Newcastle United Finances - 2008 Accounts Recently Filed

[Guest fading star]

The season started in mid August, but you’re barking up the wrong tree. It was the lack of options that induced the panic. It was Collocini or nobody, such was the effectiveness of our scouting system.

 

How do you know that it was Coloccini or nobody?

Who else were we looking at? Which names were we being heavily linked with?

 

So basically your saying we went after Colo and got our man?

No I’m saying our recruitment team were crap and two weeks before the team headed off for Old Trafford Collocini was the only deal anywhere near going through. There’s no other explanation for the excessive price.

[Mick]

No Im saying our recruitment team were crap and two weeks before the team headed off for Old Trafford Collocini was the only deal anywhere near going through. Theres no other explanation for the excessive price.

 

Jonas signed before he did.

[Guest fading star]

That and limiting our search for players to Spain.

 

Where in Spain did Guthrie and Bassong come from?

I’ve already explained about the summing up thing, but to satisfy the pedant in you - Guthrie is widely accepted to be Keegan’s token purchase and Bassong was supposed to be one for the future. When it came to the serious money Spain was the only destination on the map.

[ChezGiven]

If the recruitment team were so crap, how come everyone thinks keegan would have had us 6th?

[OzzieMandias]

Let's sack our recruitment team because they have good contacts in Spain.

[Guest fading star]

No I’m saying our recruitment team were crap and two weeks before the team headed off for Old Trafford Collocini was the only deal anywhere near going through. There’s no other explanation for the excessive price.

 

Jonas signed before he did.

Nit picking again The only deal for a centre half. We we’re discussing Collocini.

[Guest fading star]

If the recruitment team were so crap, how come everyone thinks keegan would have had us 6th?

Because they think he’s a decent manager and a figurehead supporters and players could have rallied around? I don’t know, you’d have to ask them.

[Mick]

Ive already explained about the summing up thing, but to satisfy the pedant in you - Guthrie is widely accepted to be Keegans token purchase and Bassong was supposed to be one for the future. When it came to the serious money Spain was the only destination on the map.

You said we limited our search to Spain, if you didn't actually mean that then how was I to know?

 

[Mick]

 

 

Nit picking again The only deal for a centre half. We we’re discussing Collocini.

 

You said that he was the only deal, you didn't say you were only referring to Coloccini. 

[Guest fading star]

I’ve already explained about the summing up thing, but to satisfy the pedant in you - Guthrie is widely accepted to be Keegan’s token purchase and Bassong was supposed to be one for the future. When it came to the serious money Spain was the only destination on the map.

You said we limited our search to Spain, if you didn't actually mean that then how was I to know?

 

I did mean it. I just omitted the bit about the serious money.

 

We don’t know the details of what has happened to our club, and probably never will. We have to work with broad brush strokes.

 

Cheers for the chat lads, it’s been largely abusive but not a complete waste of time.

You faith in Ashley is largely groundless, but hey that’s the nature of faith isn’t it. 

[OzzieMandias]

Cheers for the chat lads, it?s been largely abusive but not a complete waste of time.

 

 

Yeah, thanks, with NE5 too chickenshit to post on here, we needed someone to laugh at.

[La Parka]

Cheers for the chat lads, it?s been largely abusive but not a complete waste of time.

 

 

Yeah, thanks, with NE5 too chickenshit to post on here, we needed someone to laugh at.

 

[madras]

I’ve already explained about the summing up thing, but to satisfy the pedant in you - Guthrie is widely accepted to be Keegan’s token purchase and Bassong was supposed to be one for the future. When it came to the serious money Spain was the only destination on the map.

You said we limited our search to Spain, if you didn't actually mean that then how was I to know?

 

I did mean it. I just omitted the bit about the serious money.

 

We don’t know the details of what has happened to our club, and probably never will. We have to work with broad brush strokes.

 

Cheers for the chat lads, it’s been largely abusive but not a complete waste of time.

You faith in Ashley is largely groundless, but hey that’s the nature of faith isn’t it. 

it's not so much faith in ashleys as a realisation that the position we are in is not all down to him.

[merlin]

I think Ashley is under the assumption that we will stay in the league regardless...so wouldnt spend much even if he had it. Thats the feeling i get....Kinnear claimed he had to have a meeting with Ashley & Wise two weeks into the transfer window to "explain" how bad our situation was. That fills me with a lot of doubt over their awareness of how dangerously close we are to getting relegated this season. We're playing badly now against bad teams...we have Everton, Arsenal, Chelsea & Man Utd home games all in a row coming up. We're 2 points off the very bottom.....a bad run for us with other teams picking up points...we could be out of it soon. Thats a far far to realistic possiblity.

 

Especially when you imagine the negative reaction that would create in the fans faith in the management, the players, the players own confidence etc. Last season the boost of Keegan got us going again.....this season...the way newcastle play.....if we hit bottom....i dont see us as a side that will be able to pull ourselves out of that on our performances over the last few seasons.

 

No one except Barton looks to have any real passion.....as Kinnear has said he could be key for us.

 

Its clear that a lot of criticism directed towards Ashley has been unfair now these accounts have come out.

 

But when you get back to the core of the situation at present, the choices he makes in this transfer window will ultimately determine peoples perception of him.

If he fails to risk some investment in the first team to stop us from being relegated because of our tiny squad... or the mental boost some new players might give the others around them and we do get relegated...

 

Only he can be blamed...and he'll lose a whole lot of money while we suffer the consequences with him.

 

If we dont get anyone else in this window, we're in serious danger surely.

 

A very good post Jayson - this sums up the whole situation very well.

 

I agree with most, if not all, of your points and would add that Ashley is mainly responsible for appointing the wrong staff to run the club ; furthermore, he has shown bad judgment and appalling management skills by alllowing the Keegan walk-out to be finalised - anyone with half a brain would have realised the drastic effect such an event would have on both fans and players at the start of the season.

I believe that KK could have been talked round, and although it may have cost Ashley by having to fire Wise, it would have probably ensured the club would remain in the Prem, although only just, because the team is patently NOT good enough...the turmoil at the season's start has wrecked morale and this could have been prevented.

So, despite the good work he has done to put the club on a better financial footing, Ashley has messed-up big time.

 

Your post discount the idea that problems may have been caused by Keegan in this whole farce, the accounts show the neccesity of having the "transfer team" becasue they're ensuring that the money is going further, which is vital.

 

Ashley 2 major mistakes have been appointing Keegan and poor communication.

 

A 'transfer team' is NOT necessary to ensure that player purchases are kept within a budget ; KK has had to work with that before(look at the 'huge' sums he spent building the promotion side..!!)and I am sure that, if he had been given the TRUE PICTURE prior to joining as manager , he would have either accepted or rejected the job on the terms given to him when he met Ashley...

The 'farce' is Ashley's handling of the situation and the fact that either ;

1.He didn't tell Keegan what the management set-up would consist of, Or

2.He told him one thing and did another, just to get him in when he couldn't recruit other managers.

 

Your reply discounts the a/m possibilities, and I am NOT in the KK forever camp ; I DO, however, realise that Keegan could have been told a different story both before he joined the club, and prior to Wise & Co joining.

 

As has been said in the past, both Wenger & Fergie said KK was RIGHT to walk if he hadn't been given control of signings, so it seems these experienced managers would disagree with your views about Ashley..

[WhatTheFunk]

Overpriced panic buy.

 

We paid £10 million for an international defender, I hardly think he was overpriced.  As for being a panic buy, we signed him in early August and have been after him for more than a month.

 

The season started in mid August, but you’re barking up the wrong tree. It was the lack of options that induced the panic. It was Collocini or nobody, such was the effectiveness of our scouting system.

 

That is absolute dog shit. If we had 7 or 8 other targets, you would accuse the club of not knowing who they want, and not going after the man they really wanted. Your arguments in this thread stink of desperation to make a point that is hardly valid, to assert that you have an agenda.

 

You don't make any fucking sense. Who the fuck are YOU to say that 10m for Coloccini was excessive? What do you base that on? A full Argentina international, who has been a regular starting CB for all his clubs apart from AC Milan. He's still not reached his peak for a central defender age wise. A high profile name. How much could he possibly have cost in this current climate where Wayne fucking Bridge is going for 16 odd million!!!??

 

 

[colinmk]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

[Baggio]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

 

They are in profit this season from transfers iirc.

[colinmk]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

 

They are in profit this season from transfers iirc.

 

They have sold in excess of 60m?

[Stu]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

 

They are in profit this season from transfers iirc.

 

Off the top of my head: Keane, Berbatov, Carrick, Defoe, Mido all went out for about £85mil, although they then paid another £7mil on top of the original £9mil to buy back Defoe

 

 

EDIT: I think they've spent approx £130mil on players over the last 3/4 seasons, there will be some futher revenues from players sold but IIRC they're one of the few clubs to conistently make a profit (I wonder why - think 1992 to 2004) and they had a large-ish cash injection when ENIC bought out Sugar I think

[Greg]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

 

They are in profit this season from transfers iirc.

 

They have sold in excess of 60m?

 

They got near £50M for two players.

[Baggio]

 

Im not sure how to argue that point, seems a bit of a moot point really. second part is pure specualtion as well and something else which i dont think i can argue either.

 

How do you view the Modric bid and the bid for Woodgate? What about Collocinni? Arent they substantial bids and purchases?

 

I meant "stupid" spending really - I don't honestly know how the what I think of as over moderate spending last summer or the reluctance now fits in with those bids you mention which showed exactly what I wanted - reasonable but neither excessive or inadequate.

 

I think they show that he was willing to invest in the summer but only on the players that fit in with his system and policy  which provide some form of safefty net in light of the precarious financial situation, in my opinion he realised the absolute importance of making sure whatever money spent was spent as wisely as possilbe.

 

Ive maintained throughtout this thread that these account sheets shouldnt excuse him from not spending and going on a Bolton style budget but they highlight the importance of how he spends his money.

 

If Milner hadnt gone, or if we actually did buy Schweinsteiger we wouldnt be having this conversation. Thats how flimsy this argument actually is.

 

 

Signed for Villa. Still at Bayern Munich.

 

Is there anything that will shake your faith in the Good Lord Ashley? Selling Given and Harper this month? Getting relegated? Playing in red and white?

 

 

Your logic is inpenetrable mate, only becasue its so crap.

 

f*** the debts Ashley you tit, spend the f***ing money. who cares if it puts us into adminastration should it go wrong.

 

If you cant see that as a club werent in a position to spend £100m on players even if we wanted to then thats not my problem, the facts and explainations are riddled throughout this thread.

The figure I put forward was £25m.

and where was this £25mill to come from ?

 

How do other clubs buy players? Genuine question, I know nowt about finance but I know Liverpool and Man Utd are swimming in debt but still spend big money on players. Why have the administrators not been called in there?

they have operating profit, makes it easier to finance

 

But don't Liverpool have a debt stretching into the hundreds of millions? In 2006 they turned a profit of £7m (can't find more recent figures) - unless they've found a massive profit-making exercise in the meantime, I can't imagine the banks are too happy with that.

 

Also how to Spurs continually invest so much money on players, do they have some sort of financial backer like the others?

 

They are in profit this season from transfers iirc.

 

They have sold in excess of 60m?

 

Berbatov and Keane are £50 million on their own, add to that Chimbonda, Tainio and Malbranque for £16 million, Kaboul to Portsmouth etc.

 

They also made a £27 million profit back in 2007 compared to us making a loss of over £30 million.

[Tooj]

They've done quite well on that front have Spurs, which I think is more of what Ashley has been trying to do with us, rather than the Arsenal model. Only thing of course is it doesn't lead to much continuity in your squad if you're chopping and changing all of the time.

[colinmk]

Fair play, I forgot about some of them players. I guess that cash injection you are talking about Stupeedo would of put them in a healthy state even given their lack of european football etc.

[Mick]

They've done quite well on that front have Spurs, which I think is more of what Ashley has been trying to do with us, rather than the Arsenal model. Only thing of course is it doesn't lead to much continuity in your squad if you're chopping and changing all of the time.

 

I hope Spurs do keep chopping and changing because I think that is holding them back.

[Tooj]

They've done quite well on that front have Spurs, which I think is more of what Ashley has been trying to do with us, rather than the Arsenal model. Only thing of course is it doesn't lead to much continuity in your squad if you're chopping and changing all of the time.

 

I hope Spurs do keep chopping and changing because I think that is holding them back.

 

Me too.