Guest The_Optimistic Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Who would you drop to put HBA in the side? Pardew has insisted that if he plays then his position will be up front playing off Ba or best? The Ba+Best partnership has generated enough goals to justify them two to keep their places. The only way to put HBA in the team is if Pardew wants to play him on the wing instead of Obertan, but he seems to have a lot of faith in Ober. I agree with Pardew that HBA best position would not be on the wing as I don't think he contributes enough defensively for the premiership. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Who would you drop to put HBA in the side? Pardew has insisted that if he plays then his position will be up front playing off Ba or best? The Ba+Best partnership has generated enough goals to justify them two to keep their places. The only way to put HBA in the team is if Pardew wants to play him on the wing instead of Obertan, but he seems to have a lot of faith in Ober. I agree with Pardew that HBA best position would not be on the wing as I don't think he contributes enough defensively for the premiership. Drop him into the side? I would build the team around him. Our CM's are good enough to hold the mid and get ball to allow HBA the free role. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 At the moment I would just drop Best. He doesn't deserve it really, but the overall effect would be to make us more dangerous IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Thinking about it further; if it is about yards covered etc then why play him against the 3 teams you need to chase harder than any others? Odd. Fair enough he was poor against Chelsea but against City he was involved in more or less all our decent play bar the goal. Saying that I was told by a source of a source that he was fucked in the summer so this could be ringing true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I think Pardew is very stupid in the way he sees Ben Arfa. IMO you need to play the best players available, at any time. Obertan have been very up and down. Maybe Pardew should see this, and let HBA have a on the wing, maybe revert to a 433? As far as i see it, we have a squad who are more fit to play a 433. Use Tiote as the anchor, Cabaye and Jonas(or guthrie/Abeid/Vuckic/Gosling) in front. The have HBA at the left. Best as a target man in the middle, Ba to play off him on the right, more like a 2nd striker. If we manage to get Santon over on the right, he can use the space left behind by Ba to bomb forward. Jonas will provide great cover for Santon on his runs. Maybe to FM-tastic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colocho Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 HBA should start instead of Best in support of Ba, or instead of Obertan. As simple as that really. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
54 Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I agree with Pardews comments, if he's not at his best and other people are performing better, why should'nt them people start ahead of Ben Arfa. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 HBA should start instead of Best in support of Ba, or instead of Obertan. As simple as that really. I'd agree with you, but I keep going back to the same point. Surely Pardew can only start him in those positions if he shows enough in training or in the games he does get to suggest he'd be better than the alternatives (something which is very very debatable at the minute)? He need a string of games, like Obertan have had. The thing that worries me is the Tevez/Mascherano episode with Pardew. There are no fucking way they was out of form or could not play for West Ham. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 There are managers who simply prefer disciplined hard worker with zero risk in their game to players like HBA. When Marseille was one of the best team in Europe (end of eighties), Cantona was benched by Goethals who didn't like his "fantasy"... Ronaldinho was benched by Luis comical Fernandez at PSG The reason Pardew gave to explain why Shola came instead of Ben Arfa for Best is also interesting and significant of his football philosophy : “Actually, I thought that maybe a diagonal coming in that box with Shola climbing on the back of a centre-half might just be enough." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I don't think you can write off Pardew's entire philosophy just because he thought Shola winning a high ball might be a way to beat Swansea. We've signed HBA, Marveaux, Obertan, Cabaye, not players you buy if you're recreating Stoke. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BEN BEN BEN ARFA Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Then why did you sign hatem you forget Anelka for comic "Nico et Luis" I advise Pardew to watch Game 6 of Marseille last month when they won the championship for the provision of even Ben Arfa Deschamp persist when the meter is banc.et when it comes fesait becaufe the situation was critical Ex .. Toulouse, Bordeaux, reindeer do for the example site Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanSkÃrare Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Again, three starts so far: City, United and Chelsea. Not fair to judge him on that. I'd definately start him tomorrow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufc4eva Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I don't think Ben Arfa off just BA will work. I think Ba has played better with a big man in front/beside him this year, such as Best or Shola tbh. I have seen no evidence yet that Ba/Ben Arfa will work as well, however I believe Ben Arfa has to be in there somewhere maybe as part of a front 3 or on the right drifting in (Can't be worse than alien head) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShearMagic Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 When he's played this year I've found myself shouting at the screen for him to work harder, and he needs to. This is the English game, everyone needs to contribute defensively and you can't get away with being a man down defensively against most teams. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 We've signed HBA, Marveaux, Obertan, Cabaye, not players you buy if you're recreating Stoke. You can add Santon to that list. Because of these players presence - bar Obertan (retrospectively, I admit) - and the game project (submited to Cabaye by Pardew) at the start of the season, I hoped to see a more ambitious Pardew in term of game scheme. Look at the difference between Santon and Simpson/Raylor in their respective relaunch from the back. I saw the italian full back always searching to come out with proper passes, avoiding losing possession with long balls ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 I am so sick to death of this crap that gets spewed - "prodigious talent", "gifted", everyone else is shite in comparison. He has made two, count 'em TWO appearances as a sub for France in the last 2 and a half seasons. You have to go all the way back to the heady days of 2007 if you wanted to see him get an International start (unfortunately, you wouldn't see hiom finish as he was generally subbed off at aroung 75 minutes). The guy is possibly just slightly above average but we don't know that because he can't seem to earn a place in the team. I am not part of the youtube generation that drools over tribute compilations lasting 2 minutes. All I can go by is what he does when we see him play and also what the coaches and manager deem him worthy of. It is entirely comical that Obertan is shit, Jonas is shit, Shola is shit, Sami is shit, Vuckic is shit, etc. etc. Guess what children, they are ahead of Ben Arfa because they are more deserving of a place PERIOD. Glorify him all you want but the fact is he hasn't earned it. If they are all deserving of a place ahead of HBA no doubt they'll keep creating and scoring goals and we'll keep winning. Personally speaking I don't see many assists or goals coming from either Jonas or Obertan whatever other qualities they have. Maybe the opposition will give us an own goal every week so we can get the points every time. We have scored a fair amount without the opposition giving us own goals Ba's score nearly all of them though. Read Parky's statistic of Obertan's 1 assist and 0 goals in 16 games. Now I know statistics don't tell the whole story but it's not even as if Obertan's defensive work is sterling like it is with Jonas. He sort of tracks back in a half-hearted fashion with usually little impact on the opposition winger. IMO one of our wingers must present a real threat to the opposition, otherwise you might as well play Ryan Taylor there if you just want a defender. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 When he's played this year I've found myself shouting at the screen for him to work harder, and he needs to. This is the English game, everyone needs to contribute defensively and you can't get away with being a man down defensively against most teams. I think he can learn in England how to work harder, but as I said previously, he'll never work like Jonas do (I think nobody here asks him to be a second Jonas) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 We've signed HBA, Marveaux, Obertan, Cabaye, not players you buy if you're recreating Stoke. You can add Santon to that list. Because of these players presence - bar Obertan (retrospectively, I admit) - and the game project (submited to Cabaye by Pardew) at the start of the season, I hoped to see a more ambitious Pardew in term of game scheme. Look at the difference between Santon and Simpson/Raylor in their respective relaunch from the back. I saw the italian full back always searching to come out with proper passes, avoiding losing possession with long balls ... I think he has decided to delay big changes until later, because we have had such a good start. In some ways it has been difficult for him to be winning games without the likes of HBA and Santon, he hasn't had a clear reason to change the team. Upsetting the balance of a winning team can be a scary thing. He seems to have moved Santon in now, and I hope he will do the same with Ben Arfa soon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BEN BEN BEN ARFA Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 We've signed HBA, Marveaux, Obertan, Cabaye, not players you buy if you're recreating Stoke. You can add Santon to that list. Because of these players presence - bar Obertan (retrospectively, I admit) - and the game project (submited to Cabaye by Pardew) at the start of the season, I hoped to see a more ambitious Pardew in term of game scheme. Look at the difference between Santon and Simpson/Raylor in their respective relaunch from the back. I saw the italian full back always searching to come out with proper passes, avoiding losing possession with long balls ... they have the player as you said. Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner.il made from bordeaux Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 When he's played this year I've found myself shouting at the screen for him to work harder, and he needs to. This is the English game, everyone needs to contribute defensively and you can't get away with being a man down defensively against most teams. Christ almighty. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner. He's right though! I think Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner. He's right though! I think Of course he is Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BEN BEN BEN ARFA Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner. is the translation makes you laugh and then you noticed the Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hatem garrincha Posted December 20, 2011 Share Posted December 20, 2011 Obertan except that one day it would espliquer that football is not to take the ball to run to the point of corner. is the trduction makes you laugh and then you noticed the No, not the traduction, but your perfect description of Obertan's skill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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