Tooj Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 This change to a front three due to injury is very similar to when Milner & N'Zogbia's injuries lead to the 4-3-3 under Keegan, only this is somehow even better. N'Zogbia was fit when we started with the 4-3-3- under Keegan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benwell Lad Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Taking off Ba and replacing him with Ferguson just as they were starting to rip into us down the right was a good move at the right time. Not necessarily tactical genius but excellent timing and decision making. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'm interested to know if young Gabriel Obertan has an injury, or if Pardew has frozen him out due to his non-performances. Yeah, it's all gone quiet on Obertan, can't say I'm in the least bothered. When Marveaux makes his recovery I think Pardew will be hard pressed to play Obertan, especially with Ferguson becoming a more viable winger alternative than Obertan Oh, I'm not bothered/concerned by Obertan's absence - don't get me wrong. It's just interesting to see how Pardew is handling it, I suppose. IIRC Obertan first left the first-team picture due to injury, but Pardew tried to re-integrate him thereafter. I think then Pardew left him out for poor performances, and since then we've heard of niggling injuries here and there, but I'm not sure. My hope is that, behind closed doors, Pardew has been very stern with him and told him to stop being a passenger on the pitch and to develop some confidence if he wants to be a part-of first team football - which is the official reason Gabriel gave for why he came here. To get minutes. You'd think it'd be sufficient motivation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliottman Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'm interested to know if young Gabriel Obertan has an injury, or if Pardew has frozen him out due to his non-performances. Yeah, it's all gone quiet on Obertan, can't say I'm in the least bothered. When Marveaux makes his recovery I think Pardew will be hard pressed to play Obertan, especially with Ferguson becoming a more viable winger alternative than Obertan Oh, I'm not bothered/concerned by Obertan's absence - don't get me wrong. It's just interesting to see how Pardew is handling it, I suppose. IIRC Obertan first left the first-team picture due to injury, but Pardew tried to re-integrate him thereafter. I think then Pardew left him out for poor performances, and since then we've heard of niggling injuries here and there, but I'm not sure. My hope is that, behind closed doors, Pardew has been very stern with him and told him to stop being a passenger on the pitch and to develop some confidence if he wants to be a part-of first team football - which is the official reason Gabriel gave for why he came here. To get minutes. You'd think it'd be sufficient motivation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Im sure Ryder tweeted something yesterday about being back for Stoke? Unless I dreamed it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ToonZA Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'm interested to know if young Gabriel Obertan has an injury, or if Pardew has frozen him out due to his non-performances. Yeah, it's all gone quiet on Obertan, can't say I'm in the least bothered. When Marveaux makes his recovery I think Pardew will be hard pressed to play Obertan, especially with Ferguson becoming a more viable winger alternative than Obertan Oh, I'm not bothered/concerned by Obertan's absence - don't get me wrong. It's just interesting to see how Pardew is handling it, I suppose. IIRC Obertan first left the first-team picture due to injury, but Pardew tried to re-integrate him thereafter. I think then Pardew left him out for poor performances, and since then we've heard of niggling injuries here and there, but I'm not sure. My hope is that, behind closed doors, Pardew has been very stern with him and told him to stop being a passenger on the pitch and to develop some confidence if he wants to be a part-of first team football - which is the official reason Gabriel gave for why he came here. To get minutes. You'd think it'd be sufficient motivation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Im sure Ryder tweeted something yesterday about being back for Stoke? Unless I dreamed it. Sounds more like a nightmare mate Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzle Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'm interested to know if young Gabriel Obertan has an injury, or if Pardew has frozen him out due to his non-performances. Yeah, it's all gone quiet on Obertan, can't say I'm in the least bothered. When Marveaux makes his recovery I think Pardew will be hard pressed to play Obertan, especially with Ferguson becoming a more viable winger alternative than Obertan Oh, I'm not bothered/concerned by Obertan's absence - don't get me wrong. It's just interesting to see how Pardew is handling it, I suppose. IIRC Obertan first left the first-team picture due to injury, but Pardew tried to re-integrate him thereafter. I think then Pardew left him out for poor performances, and since then we've heard of niggling injuries here and there, but I'm not sure. My hope is that, behind closed doors, Pardew has been very stern with him and told him to stop being a passenger on the pitch and to develop some confidence if he wants to be a part-of first team football - which is the official reason Gabriel gave for why he came here. To get minutes. You'd think it'd be sufficient motivation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I imagine it would be pretty difficult to develop confidence when your own fans groan if you don't cross the ball first time, berate you every time you lose the ball and cheer when you leave the field. Still, the fans were right about Perch (and numerous others in the past....), so maybe they should carry on like this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TherealnorthernTOON Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Really think this formation can be a blessing for Obertan, really think he can be an asset on the left hand side cutting inwards and mixing it up with HBA and Cabaye. He allways saw for that opportunity to go inside earlier in the season. Aswell as he got somekind of footballing brain and he seems to be clever with some of the things he does. He just seems scared to fail miserably. Remember, this transfer pretty much was tail between legs for him, and if he can't succeed to atleast be a part of the first team squad here he has failed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi_D Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'm interested to know if young Gabriel Obertan has an injury, or if Pardew has frozen him out due to his non-performances. Yeah, it's all gone quiet on Obertan, can't say I'm in the least bothered. When Marveaux makes his recovery I think Pardew will be hard pressed to play Obertan, especially with Ferguson becoming a more viable winger alternative than Obertan Oh, I'm not bothered/concerned by Obertan's absence - don't get me wrong. It's just interesting to see how Pardew is handling it, I suppose. IIRC Obertan first left the first-team picture due to injury, but Pardew tried to re-integrate him thereafter. I think then Pardew left him out for poor performances, and since then we've heard of niggling injuries here and there, but I'm not sure. My hope is that, behind closed doors, Pardew has been very stern with him and told him to stop being a passenger on the pitch and to develop some confidence if he wants to be a part-of first team football - which is the official reason Gabriel gave for why he came here. To get minutes. You'd think it'd be sufficient motivation. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I imagine it would be pretty difficult to develop confidence when your own fans groan if you don't cross the ball first time, berate you every time you lose the ball and cheer when you leave the field. Still, the fans were right about Perch (and numerous others in the past....), so maybe they should carry on like this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 In fairness, it was difficult for the fans to get behind Perch when for the start of his career, all he did was mistime challenges and pick up cards. Hardly surprising that most didn't think he'd make it, full credit to the lad for upping his game. He's been one of our top 3 performers in the last four-five games. As for Obertan, I'd never boo him at a game or applaud him coming off but the reality is, he's shown very, very little to suggest he can come good here. He'd require a Perch transformation and I'd say that's very unlikely, especially if we continue to do good business and marginalise him further Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzle Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 It kind of defeats the object of being a supporter when you only cheer players who are doing well though doesn't it? And its not even about Obertan coming good, its about giving him the chance to do so. I understand people getting frustrated at games, happens to all of us, but if you can't refrain from cheering one of our own players from being subbed then you may as well fuck off now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 In fairness, it was difficult for the fans to get behind Perch when for the start of his career, all he did was mistime challenges and pick up cards. Hardly surprising that most didn't think he'd make it, full credit to the lad for upping his game. He's been one of our top 3 performers in the last four-five games. As for Obertan, I'd never boo him at a game or applaud him coming off but the reality is, he's shown very, very little to suggest he can come good here. He'd require a Perch transformation and I'd say that's very unlikely, especially if we continue to do good business and marginalise him further I would say Perch along with Guthrie and Raylor make it more likely Obertan can go on to be a good player for us. Pardew has got a lot out of players deemed not good enough, including Best. Saylor was brilliant before his injury too. It's far, far too early to write off Obertan (or Gosling for that matter). Both are still young and finding their feet. It's the first season at a new club for Obertan and Gosling has started about 6 games in 2 years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I'd be more sympathetic to Obertan if I saw more effort tbh. Perch never lacked effort. That's not to say I don't think he'll come good eventually, or that he deserves to be heckled and beeeeeeeeeewed... but it helps when you demonstrate the right attitude through rough patches. It counts for a lot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzle Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I agree the lack of effort should be criticised but I wouldn't say Obertan has been strolling around with his hands on his hips. He's bottled out of a few challenges but you can't really expect him to do what Perch does either can you? Two completely different styles of players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 In fairness, it was difficult for the fans to get behind Perch when for the start of his career, all he did was mistime challenges and pick up cards. Hardly surprising that most didn't think he'd make it, full credit to the lad for upping his game. He's been one of our top 3 performers in the last four-five games. As for Obertan, I'd never boo him at a game or applaud him coming off but the reality is, he's shown very, very little to suggest he can come good here. He'd require a Perch transformation and I'd say that's very unlikely, especially if we continue to do good business and marginalise him further I would say Perch along with Guthrie and Raylor make it more likely Obertan can go on to be a good player for us. Pardew has got a lot out of players deemed not good enough, including Best. Saylor was brilliant before his injury too. It's far, far too early to write off Obertan (or Gosling for that matter). Both are still young and finding their feet. It's the first season at a new club for Obertan and Gosling has started about 6 games in 2 years. You're completely right about players coming good after poor starts. I always rated Best and Saylor to put in good performances but I did not think Perch or Guthrie would improve to the levels they have. As for Gosling, I definitely think he'll come good. My problem with Obertan is that he makes the wrong decision far too often and it's not that he's technically flawed, not at all, it's that mentally he isn't there on a confidence level or a football-understanding level. I hope he comes through and improves but if I had the choice I'd put other players ahead of him like Ferguson who I think will improve much quicker. If we get into Europe, I really hope Obertan gets games and manages to develop Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi_D Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Tbh fans are just fickle as fuck No two ways about it really If Perch has a couple of poor performances he will be thrown to the dogs, like Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 In fairness, it was difficult for the fans to get behind Perch when for the start of his career, all he did was mistime challenges and pick up cards. Hardly surprising that most didn't think he'd make it, full credit to the lad for upping his game. He's been one of our top 3 performers in the last four-five games. As for Obertan, I'd never boo him at a game or applaud him coming off but the reality is, he's shown very, very little to suggest he can come good here. He'd require a Perch transformation and I'd say that's very unlikely, especially if we continue to do good business and marginalise him further I would say Perch along with Guthrie and Raylor make it more likely Obertan can go on to be a good player for us. Pardew has got a lot out of players deemed not good enough, including Best. Saylor was brilliant before his injury too. It's far, far too early to write off Obertan (or Gosling for that matter). Both are still young and finding their feet. It's the first season at a new club for Obertan and Gosling has started about 6 games in 2 years. You're completely right about players coming good after poor starts. I always rated Best and Saylor to put in good performances but I did not think Perch or Guthrie would improve to the levels they have. As for Gosling, I definitely think he'll come good. My problem with Obertan is that he makes the wrong decision far too often and it's not that he's technically flawed, not at all, it's that mentally he isn't there on a confidence level or a football-understanding level. I hope he comes through and improves but if I had the choice I'd put other players ahead of him like Ferguson who I think will improve much quicker. If we get into Europe, I really hope Obertan gets games and manages to develop Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chubby Jason Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 How long has it been since we had a manager that completed a full Premiership season? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Benitez? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 How long has it been since we had a manager that completed a full Premiership season? Too long. It feels good (will probably get sacked tomorrow now). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varadi Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 How long has it been since we had a manager that completed a full Premiership season? Think Roeder did the full 2006/07 season - he was sacked as soon as it finished iirc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chubby Jason Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 I think it was Sir Bobby wasn't it? Roeder nearly did but got sacked before the Watford game on the last day. That's about 7 -8 years, that's ridiculous. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzle Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Roeder went before the last game Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chubby Jason Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 indeed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Played them perfectly yesterday, got a feeling he knows we can rip Bolton on Monday too. Doing very well at the minute, top work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 How long has it been since we had a manager that completed a full Premiership season? Think Roeder did the full 2006/07 season - he was sacked as soon as it finished iirc. Nope, was sacked after last home game. Pearson took charge of Watford (a) last game. It's 2003/04. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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