Mike Ashley

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

It's not just the reluctance to spend money that's holding us back ffs.  It's consistently s**** appointments, both in a football and non-footballing capacity.

 

Bringing Keegan back was a fluke.  It worked for a short time but it was to appease the fans.  No-one will ever convince me that MA knew of Keegan's positive forward-thinking and that's why he did it.  Hughton was also a fluke.  He couldn't be arsed to seek out or pay for a well-known manager.  Luckily he had a good coach on his books, being paid a pittance, looking to step-up.

 

He's had two people running the club on his behalf, neither of whom had ever been involved in football before.

 

I refuse to believe anyone else that would come in to buy the club would have such an appalling grasp on how a football club should be ran effectively like Mike Ashley does.

Oddly enough I thought just the opposite about Ashley bringing KK back. To me it showed that head no idea what he was doing.

 

That's what I mean, man.  There were a few people on SkySports and the like at the time saying "I'd get Keegan back" - completely throwaway statements.  At the time it seemed totally unfeasible but he listened.  It wasn't something he came up with himself.

[Wullie]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Indeed. Purely on numbers, the finances are vastly worse than they were before he arrived. The difference is that we owe (hugely more) money to him rather than the banks, so we aren't going to be called on it.

 

What some people don't seem able to grasp is that the financial success of football clubs isn't about a lack of debt, it's all about profit and turnover. Man United and Chelsea's debt dwarfs everything else in the league but the banks don't care because they generate vast profits through on-pitch (and subsequently off-pitch) success. As long as they can keep on paying it comfortably, the more debt the better as far as the banks are concerned because it generates more interest for them. The clubs that get the plug pulled aren't the behemoths with mountains of debt, it's the ones with piddly little amounts owed to HMRC who can't pay because they bring absolutely fuck all in.

 

Boggles the fucking mind that some people think "financial success" as a football club is based on being on an even keel (even though we're not, but ignore that for a moment). Do these people live on the same planet as the rest of us? They want their football club to run like their own household finances.

[WarrenBartonCentrePartin]

Indeed.

 

Success = a higher global profile, the big sponsorship deals and increased revenue from the CL etc will come.

 

However to have such success you need to be prepared to take that first risk - an outlay on a squad good enough to achieve your goal.

 

This is where MA is a businessman, not a football man.  He seems convinced we can have all of the above by not spending more than £9m on a player and that you can offset some of that cost by selling others - completely forgetting the importance of squad depth.

[Guest Brazilianbob]

It beggars belief how predjudiced nufc fans are against southerners.  Mike Ashley is slowly building a solid financial foundation that WILL eventually provide the club with the financial clout to eventually compete with the big clubs.  If fans want immediate success then go and support the likes of man city.  What is the point of spending money the club cannot hope to generate only to end up like Portsmouth.  Short term gain always results on long term pain.  I have supported this club for all of my sentient years and if I can wait a little longer for success on the field I can't see why other junior supporters can't be expected to put in the time like us older fans.u

 

I'm a southerner and this is a huge crock of s***.

o

Well I think your opinion is a crock of s*** but that is not a valid argument either.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Indeed.

 

Success = a higher global profile, the big sponsorship deals and increased revenue from the CL etc will come.

 

However to have such success you need to be prepared to take that first risk - an outlay on a squad good enough to achieve your goal.

 

This is where MA is a businessman, not a football man.  He seems convinced we can have all of the above by not spending more than £9m on a player and that you can offset some of that cost by selling others - completely forgetting the importance of squad depth.

 

I agree with you basically, but it's a very tough one to get right isn't it?

 

I mean, if Ashley could guarantee that spending £Xm would break the top four regularly, win us titles and allow us to generate Man Utd profits then no doubt he would spend that money. But football isn't a predictable ROI business - so much is random and everyone above you is already so entrenched.

 

We already tried to speculate in the very recent past, and it didn't work out as planned. That's part of the reason Ashley is here.

 

I don't have an answer, I just think it's easy to throw about lines like 'speculate to accumulate' without much logic about how it actually works.

 

[Jack Flash]

One lesson he needs to learn is to never appoint a cockney to manage a Northern club as it rarely (if ever) works.

[Stuy_O]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Indeed. Purely on numbers, the finances are vastly worse than they were before he arrived. The difference is that we owe (hugely more) money to him rather than the banks, so we aren't going to be called on it.

 

What some people don't seem able to grasp is that the financial success of football clubs isn't about a lack of debt, it's all about profit and turnover. Man United and Chelsea's debt dwarfs everything else in the league but the banks don't care because they generate vast profits through on-pitch (and subsequently off-pitch) success. As long as they can keep on paying it comfortably, the more debt the better as far as the banks are concerned because it generates more interest for them. The clubs that get the plug pulled aren't the behemoths with mountains of debt, it's the ones with piddly little amounts owed to HMRC who can't pay because they bring absolutely f*** all in.

 

Boggles the f***ing mind that some people think "financial success" as a football club is based on being on an even keel (even though we're not, but ignore that for a moment). Do these people live on the same planet as the rest of us? They want their football club to run like their own household finances.

 

Our revenue is pretty shameful for a club our size.

 

 

[LRD]

The last time he wanted to sell was when the fans turned on him one or two years into his ownership. He couldn't recover his investment with any of the offers, especially after we got relegated. Then we got good crowds at a lower league, came back on the first attempt, sold a player for 35m, and the PL got a lucrative tv deal. He realised all that and that he wields all the power with fans helpless against him. We're getting some profits in, he's not losing money (even harder to do so with the increased tv revenue), gets free advertising in SJP and on screens worldwide and barring a catastrophic relegation to league 1 he won't suffer a loss on his investment.

 

We missed the window where he was desperate to sell up. Doubt Ashley will ever do so now unless an Arab with oil money comes in.

[toontownman]

Meh.. he has pretty much always said he would sell if the right offer comes in.

 

Maybe all this nonsense was about hoping a knight in shining armor would come in and bid for the club to save the day... unlikely though, he will want to recoup cost..even though he has lowered the market value with the recent shenanigans.

[PCW1983]

Am I right in saying that the plan of action from the "fans meeting" is to encourage people not to attend the SC Braga friendly?

 

What difference do the "fans" of NUFC expect this will make? 

[Guest icemanblue]

That story is nothing more than a reminder to us ungrateful fans, about how much Uncle Mike has had to spend to save our little club. No surprise that it's been released through one of the club's favourites.

[Toonpack]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Absolutely not true, they make thick end of £20Mill more than us.

 

Maybe we should charge Spurs-esque prices, that'd make everyone happy I'm sure.

[Hughesy]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Absolutely not true, they make thick end of £20Mill more than us.

 

Maybe we should charge Spurs-esque prices, that'd make everyone happy I'm sure.

 

Yep - people seem to overlook how relatively 'cheap' our tickets are compared to most other clubs.

[Hudson]

Ashley for all his problems, Runs the business side of things very well. The sporting side is just a cluster fuck.

[Guest neesy111]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Absolutely not true, they make thick end of £20Mill more than us.

 

Maybe we should charge Spurs-esque prices, that'd make everyone happy I'm sure.

 

Yep - people seem to overlook how relatively 'cheap' our tickets are compared to most other clubs.

 

They have to be or SJP would be like the SoL nowadays.  Club has lost a shit load of core supporters over the last 7- 8 years.

 

Spurs can charge those prices considering they have a 25k waiting list.

[Toonpack]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2013/apr/18/premier-league-finances-club-by-club

 

nope. they make 21m we make 24m.

 

But yes - Check the Swiss Ramble:

 

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RtQ1gYNYGuk/UcbPWkc9wqI/AAAAAAAAGtU/LkpA1-bUkzY/s640/PL+Match+Day.jpg

 

[colinmk]

Anyone care to explain how Ashley is doing so well on the business side of things then, because everything I have read does not support that.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Anyone care to explain how Ashley is doing so well on the business side of things then, because everything I have read does not support that.

 

Our profitability is improved, our debt is owed cheaply to the owner. Guess that's about the size of it.

 

TBF our position on that revenue table is about right, the cost per fan is kept as low as realistically possible. We could easily jump up the table just by putting prices up, but would people want that?

[Toonpack]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Absolutely not true, they make thick end of £20Mill more than us.

 

Maybe we should charge Spurs-esque prices, that'd make everyone happy I'm sure.

 

Yep - people seem to overlook how relatively 'cheap' our tickets are compared to most other clubs.

 

They have to be or SJP would be like the SoL nowadays.  Club has lost a s*** load of core supporters over the last 7- 8 years.

 

Spurs can charge those prices considering they have a 25k waiting list.

 

Tbhe cheap tickets are to offset the ridiculous decisions and the general disillusion of the fans. We make more out of our gate receipts than Spurs anyway.  But as Neesy says they could change it and still pack it out, massive waiting list

 

Oh no we don't.

 

Most of the "fans" aren't members of message boards and the season ticket holders I know ain't disillusioned at all, it's all about the team on match-day and the social game-day stuff.

 

Those 400 (or 0.77%) of the match-going fans don't represent the true feelings one way or the other.

 

Your notion of cheap to offset disillusion is also a flawed argument, less tickets sold for more £££'s = more money than more cheaper tickets for less, see us and Spurs/Liverpool in graphs above.

 

IF you're really disillusioned you wouldn't pay, what is, even at the current levels, to a lot of folk still a significant lump of money.

[Hudson]

Anyone care to explain how Ashley is doing so well on the business side of things then, because everything I have read does not support that.

 

maybe later on

 

[Lotus]

This lot have proved quite poor at increasing our revenue. However, they've done the sensible thing with the debts.

[Guest neesy111]

However, they've done the sensible thing with the debts.

 

That was forced onto Ashley due to his thickness of not doing due diligence.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

However, they've done the sensible thing with the debts.

 

That was forced onto Ashley due to his thickness of not doing due diligence.

 

Well whoever bought us would have had to deal with our debt position. You're right that he should have done more investigation though.

[merlin]

Talk about the so called brilliant finances to the cows come home if you wish but are they really that brilliant?

 

We rely heavily on TV money, our commercial income is f*cking awful and at the end of the day like it or not before Ashley we had much larger income.

 

Just an example of this.... 7 years ago we were getting 30m per year more than Spurs now they get 50m more than us with a smaller stadium and less f*cking gate receipts.

 

Fantastic finances my arse.

 

Absolutely not true, they make thick end of £20Mill more than us.

 

Maybe we should charge Spurs-esque prices, that'd make everyone happy I'm sure.

 

Yep - people seem to overlook how relatively 'cheap' our tickets are compared to most other clubs.

 

They have to be or SJP would be like the SoL nowadays.  Club has lost a s*** load of core supporters over the last 7- 8 years.

 

Spurs can charge those prices considering they have a 25k waiting list.

 

Tbhe cheap tickets are to offset the ridiculous decisions and the general disillusion of the fans. We make more out of our gate receipts than Spurs anyway.  But as Neesy says they could change it and still pack it out, massive waiting list

 

Oh no we don't.

 

Most of the "fans" aren't members of message boards and the season ticket holders I know ain't disillusioned at all, it's all about the team on match-day and the social game-day stuff.

 

Those 400 (or 0.77%) of the match-going fans don't represent the true feelings one way or the other.

 

Your notion of cheap to offset disillusion is also a flawed argument, less tickets sold for more £££'s = more money than more cheaper tickets for less, see us and Spurs/Liverpool in graphs above.

 

IF you're really disillusioned you wouldn't pay, what is, even at the current levels, to a lot of folk still a significant lump of money.

 

It attracts day trippers and encourages those who would have perhaps not have bought a ticket due to their feelings towards Ashley/Club/Pardew.

 

if you aren't too keen on NUFC at present and you can go to a game, the ticket is 15 compared to 40, you are more likely to buy that ticket

 

If the product on the pitch is good, people would willingly pay more to watch it - it doesn't matter HOW badly you think about the people who are producing the product, there will always be plenty of people willing to buy it if its good - there is no nation on earth who should, in theory, hate the Germans more than anyone else but Israel....yet you go there, or watch film from there and you will see the roads full of Mercs and BMWs.

Likewise people whose relatives were prisoners of the Japanese - they are quite prepared to buy Japanese cars/TVs/electrical goods because they are good and usually reliable.

 

The same thing applies with football - if you price down the product, you then take less profit unless you can increase gates massively, which means you buy cheaper players and get more mediocre football as a result.

 

There was a 20,000 waiting list in the mid-90s when our prices weren't that much different to other clubs....we are cheaper to watch now, but the waiting list has gone.

 

Offer peanuts, get monkeys....

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Pricing down the tickets doesn't really affect your ability to sign players that much though, does it? Since gate receipts are actually quite small compared to stuff like TV money and the person wealth of owners.

 

The waiting list has gone because we aren't as successful, obviously. No club can avoid that effect.