Dokko Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 12:59, Hanskissedhispantz said: He had a poor season but the myth about him fucking up loads of chances is just irritating, it got to the point where every fruitless shot at goal was met with "Cisse man!" and it seems to have stuck 2 of the best forwards in the world probably fluffed more clear cut chances against each other in the 2nd leg of the Madrid/Dortmund semi-final than Cisse did in half of a season. This is just utter bollocks like Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I was just about to post agreeing with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 The last bit was obviously a joke but the first part is true. He didn't miss many clear cut chances, ones where he had to score. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 12:59, Disco said: His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. That's the main issue we are a shite at the moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 How many goals did he score after Ba left? 6? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 12:59, Disco said: His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how shit they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'fuck off cunt' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 5 in 18 in the league after Ba left. Still a very poor return like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:06, Toon's Taylor said: Quote His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how shit they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'fuck off cunt' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Not really. His main problem isn't whether he is/isn't good it's that for whatever reason we're utterly reliant on him for goals. With a bit more support he'll improve as his chance numbers will go up and chances are he'll be under less pressure to snatch at them knowing if he doesn't score, someone else might contribute. Probably didn't help his cause that bar 15 mins at the end of the Mentalists away game he played every single second of the season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Aye, right again TT. I don't even bother with the Jonas thread. Most times he should be benched - end of. There's a real discussion to be had with Papiss on the other hand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 He scored 13, including some very important goals in Europe. Dropping it down to league goals only is pointless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:09, Disco said: Quote Quote His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how s*** they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'f*** off c***' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Not really. His main problem isn't whether he is/isn't good it's that for whatever reason we're utterly reliant on him for goals. Until we moved 4-4-2 the side was built for him to score tbh. The way many said we should operate. We looked a bit better when we went 4-4-2. If you go 1 uptop ideally he leads the line and scores loads. But mostly, it's either to get him goals or for him to bring in everyone else. Fernando Torres still does a decent job assisting and leading the line for Chelsea. He just won't score. Papiss is the other type similar to Demba. If he's up top by himself, it's for him to score bucketloads. So while everyone else was poor. The system was built around Cisse the way many here wanted. Even if it failed - badly and we still didn't create loads. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dokko Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:09, Disco said: Quote Quote His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how shit they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'fuck off cunt' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Not really. His main problem isn't whether he is/isn't good it's that for whatever reason we're utterly reliant on him for goals. With a bit more support he'll improve as his chance numbers will go up and chances are he'll be under less pressure to snatch at them knowing if he doesn't score, someone else might contribute. Probably didn't help his cause that bar 15 mins at the end of the Mentalists away game he played every single second of the season. In all honesty I don't see why it has to be one or the other, i think its both. His goal return is certainly highlighted by the fact no one else is really helping him out with goals, but his own return certainly isnt good enough for a main striker wanting to stay in the league (never mind other aspirations) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:11, Jack Flash said: He scored 13, including some very important goals in Europe. Dropping it down to league goals only is pointless. 13 in 47 is Craig Bellamy numbers. It's not good enough either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:14, Toon's Taylor said: Quote Quote Quote His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how shit they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'fuck off cunt' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Not really. His main problem isn't whether he is/isn't good it's that for whatever reason we're utterly reliant on him for goals. With a bit more support he'll improve as his chance numbers will go up and chances are he'll be under less pressure to snatch at them knowing if he doesn't score, someone else might contribute. Probably didn't help his cause that bar 15 mins at the end of the Mentalists away game he played every single second of the season. In all honesty I don't see why it has to be one or the other, i think its both. His goal return is certainly highlighted by the fact no one else is really helping him out with goals, but his own return certainly isnt good enough for a main striker wanting to stay in the league (never mind other aspirations) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:14, The College Dropout said: Quote He scored 13, including some very important goals in Europe. Dropping it down to league goals only is pointless. 13 in 47 is Craig Bellamy numbers. It's not good enough either. I'm not saying it is, just that all his goals should be taken into account when discussing how well he has done. His goals against Anzi and Benfica in partic shouldn't be forgotten. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 He had some great chances against Benfica tbh. That was the perfect set-up for him and he didn't quite hit the heights I expected. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 13:15, Disco said: Quote Quote Quote Quote His 8 goals wouldn't have been such an issue if everyone else in our team, bar Cabaye from set pieces, wasn't utterly inept at sticking the ball in the back of the net. I agree, however this is his thread and his downfalls are being highlighted. We can talk about the rest of the team and how shit they were in the respective threads, no? He has to carry the blame for his short comings, and there were plenty last season. The fact i'm not just going 'fuck off cunt' like i feel with pardew or Jonas mean i still hold out hope for him and want him here, he just needs to improve on last season. Not really. His main problem isn't whether he is/isn't good it's that for whatever reason we're utterly reliant on him for goals. With a bit more support he'll improve as his chance numbers will go up and chances are he'll be under less pressure to snatch at them knowing if he doesn't score, someone else might contribute. Probably didn't help his cause that bar 15 mins at the end of the Mentalists away game he played every single second of the season. In all honesty I don't see why it has to be one or the other, i think its both. His goal return is certainly highlighted by the fact no one else is really helping him out with goals, but his own return certainly isnt good enough for a main striker wanting to stay in the league (never mind other aspirations) I agree basically, I just think the whole debate is irrelevant unless the team as a whole is functioning well. We were playing so shite it was completely unrealistic to expect our striker to get 20 goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Ba was on course to beat 20 goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 14:02, Dave said: Ba was on course to beat 20 goals. As he was last year, still didn't do it though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Just saying, he was scoring when we were playing shite so I don't know why Cisse would get a bye. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 14:22, Dave said: Just saying, he was scoring when we were playing s**** so I don't know why Cisse would get a bye. Fair enough, well Ba doesn't play for us any more so obviously the rules are different. Tbh i have come around to TT's line of thinking with regards to Cisse, genuinely do believe he needs competition and not just a partner. Would look to sign someone pacey to stretch defences and someone who can hold the ball up. ( very unlikely i know) But then again i don't really trust Pardew to rotate them properly if that happened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 14:22, Dave said: Just saying, he was scoring when we were playing shite so I don't know why Cisse would get a bye. I wasn't saying he should get a bye, not sure what that would even mean. The general performance of the team is just a big factor in whether a striker scores goals or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 14:45, Ian W said: Quote Just saying, he was scoring when we were playing s**** so I don't know why Cisse would get a bye. I wasn't saying he should get a bye, not sure what that would even mean. The general performance of the team is just a big factor in whether a striker scores goals or not. The reverse logic is that if the striker(s) score goals, results improve and confidence grows, leading to better general performances of the team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Ba scored 13 in 21 for a shit team but it was 'completely unrealistic' to expect Cisse to score 20 in 47 for that same team. Okay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 On 04/06/2013 at 14:52, Unbelievable! said: Quote Quote Just saying, he was scoring when we were playing s**** so I don't know why Cisse would get a bye. I wasn't saying he should get a bye, not sure what that would even mean. The general performance of the team is just a big factor in whether a striker scores goals or not. The reverse logic is that if the striker(s) score goals, results improve and confidence grows, leading to better general performances of the team. True to a certain extent, aye. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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