Ronaldo Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Well unselfish and bringing players into the game goes hand in hand tbf..... if you were a selfish player you would be less likely to do so. Not really. I would want a striker capable of bringing others into play but confident enough to consider himself the main man for scoring goals, hence I don't mind a but of greed in front of goal. To me, bringing others into play is something that happens in the build up of attacks, further away from goal.. So unselfish = not confident in front of goal? Give up and stop being daft, man. I'm right, Mole's right, you're wrong. Right and wrong? Really Ronaldo? Maybe you would care to explain what you meant by "if you're playing three up top you need an unselfish player in the middle", because from where I'm sitting that sounds like a load of utter and complete rubbish. Then you proceed to bring Ba into the equation as not being that type of player and say he's only useful feeding of scraps on his own up top, which you should know is not how he has best performed for us, as I seem to remember you saying in the past he was best used playing of a bigger striker doing the dirty work. Honestly, your argument seems to be all over the place on this.. If you can give me an example of a selfish striker who played the role described to good effect I'll hold my hands up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Well unselfish and bringing players into the game goes hand in hand tbf..... if you were a selfish player you would be less likely to do so. Not really. I would want a striker capable of bringing others into play but confident enough to consider himself the main man for scoring goals, hence I don't mind a but of greed in front of goal. To me, bringing others into play is something that happens in the build up of attacks, further away from goal.. So unselfish = not confident in front of goal? Give up and stop being daft, man. I'm right, Mole's right, you're wrong. Right and wrong? Really Ronaldo? Maybe you would care to explain what you meant by "if you're playing three up top you need an unselfish player in the middle", because from where I'm sitting that sounds like a load of utter and complete rubbish. Then you proceed to bring Ba into the equation as not being that type of player and say he's only useful feeding of scraps on his own up top, which you should know is not how he has best performed for us, as I seem to remember you saying in the past he was best used playing of a bigger striker doing the dirty work. Honestly, your argument seems to be all over the place on this.. If you can give me an example of a selfish striker who played the role described to good effect I'll hold my hands up. I will, as soon as you explain what you meant by "if you're playing three up top you need an unselfish player in the middle". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Given our 2 other strikers (generous to Shola tbf) won't be here currently next season it'd be lunacy to sell him given our struggles to move players from the verge to over the line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLK Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Have we given up on Cisse ? Was his first few months at the club just a flash in the pan ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 His form dropped the second we put Ba's needs before his and the team went to s***. When Demba Ba came off the bench to score twice at Everton, Cisse had 0 league goals. Ba had scored once. It was then Ba 3 goals to Cisse's 0. Only an idiot would back the latter horse. Who - has proven to be a shit horse anyway. 1 decentish bout of form in 18 months. He's scored 8 league goals since Ba left. Blame Cisse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I blame Pardew. Ba put him in a very difficult situation, though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Well unselfish and bringing players into the game goes hand in hand tbf..... if you were a selfish player you would be less likely to do so. Not really. I would want a striker capable of bringing others into play but confident enough to consider himself the main man for scoring goals, hence I don't mind a but of greed in front of goal. To me, bringing others into play is something that happens in the build up of attacks, further away from goal.. So unselfish = not confident in front of goal? Give up and stop being daft, man. I'm right, Mole's right, you're wrong. Right and wrong? Really Ronaldo? Maybe you would care to explain what you meant by "if you're playing three up top you need an unselfish player in the middle", because from where I'm sitting that sounds like a load of utter and complete rubbish. Then you proceed to bring Ba into the equation as not being that type of player and say he's only useful feeding of scraps on his own up top, which you should know is not how he has best performed for us, as I seem to remember you saying in the past he was best used playing of a bigger striker doing the dirty work. Honestly, your argument seems to be all over the place on this.. If you can give me an example of a selfish striker who played the role described to good effect I'll hold my hands up. I will, as soon as you explain what you meant by "if you're playing three up top you need an unselfish player in the middle". Given that you speak English I don't think I'll bother. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 And this switching systems to accomodate Ba shit is just not true. We chopped between formations plenty in the second half of the 5th season. We were 4-4-2 when we beat Chelsea in late March. We started the season 4-4-2 when we beat the team that ended up 4th. Chopped and changed some more. Went "4-3-3" at Everton, went 2-0 down. Brought Ba on, went 4-4-2.. the rest is history Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Beat Manchester United 4-4-2, Chelsea 4-4-2. Cisse's debut against Villa 4-4-2 when he came off the bench. We got tonked by Wigan and we stopped with the 4-3-3 after winning so many games with that formation. It had nothing to do with Ba. In the next game we went back to basics and beat Chelsea 4-4-2. From that point Pardew would change between those formations based on the scenario. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 So you find it a coincidence that as soon as Ba threw his toys out the pram we immediately switched back to 442? Ba was definitely the reason, but that's over now Ba left and Cisse will probably never be effective for this football club ever again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Beat Manchester United 4-4-2, Chelsea 4-4-2. Cisse's debut against Villa 4-4-2 when he came off the bench. We got tonked by Wigan and we stopped with the 4-3-3 after winning so many games with that formation. It had nothing to do with Ba. In the next game we went back to basics and beat Chelsea 4-4-2. From that point Pardew would change between those formations based on the scenario. Aye, ok. Anyway, I can't be bothered arguing about him. He's at Chelsea wearing his gloves and celebrating like mad on the first of every month. He's happy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Beat Manchester United 4-4-2, Chelsea 4-4-2. Cisse's debut against Villa 4-4-2 when he came off the bench. We got tonked by Wigan and we stopped with the 4-3-3 after winning so many games with that formation. It had nothing to do with Ba. In the next game we went back to basics and beat Chelsea 4-4-2. From that point Pardew would change between those formations based on the scenario. Was Cisse even here when we beat Manchester United? And if he was, did he play? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Nah he wasn't it was a couple weeks before we signed him if i recall. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Beat Manchester United 4-4-2, Chelsea 4-4-2. Cisse's debut against Villa 4-4-2 when he came off the bench. We got tonked by Wigan and we stopped with the 4-3-3 after winning so many games with that formation. It had nothing to do with Ba. In the next game we went back to basics and beat Chelsea 4-4-2. From that point Pardew would change between those formations based on the scenario. You and your making up of stuff man. Cisse arrived 2 weeks after we beat Man Utd ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 So you find it a coincidence that as soon as Ba threw his toys out the pram we immediately switched back to 442? Ba was definitely the reason, but that's over now Ba left and Cisse will probably never be effective for this football club ever again. Did he throw his toys out the pram when we got slapped by Wigan? Or was it just before that game he came off the bench and scored twice to get us a point? Around the same time Cisse had 0 goals in 3 games and Ba had 3 in 3. In the very next game selfish Demba let Papiss take a penalty at 1-0 that he absolutely ballooned. But Cisse's lack of confidence is down to Demba Ba and Alan Pardew. And as Unbelievable already mentoined. Cisse played wide for 4 games. 4! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 You say 'plenty' and give one example. We were winning games with that system yet went into the new season with a different one. Pretty obvious something was said in the summer. Beat Manchester United 4-4-2, Chelsea 4-4-2. Cisse's debut against Villa 4-4-2 when he came off the bench. We got tonked by Wigan and we stopped with the 4-3-3 after winning so many games with that formation. It had nothing to do with Ba. In the next game we went back to basics and beat Chelsea 4-4-2. From that point Pardew would change between those formations based on the scenario. You and your making up of stuff man. Cisse arrived 2 weeks after we beat Man Utd ffs. Yes I know that. Shola tore Evans to shreds. My point is we had several great results playing 4-4-2 that season. It's teh formation that put is in that fight for 4th place. It got some of our best results, some of which included Cisse in that formation, scoring goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 So you find it a coincidence that as soon as Ba threw his toys out the pram we immediately switched back to 442? Ba was definitely the reason, but that's over now Ba left and Cisse will probably never be effective for this football club ever again. Did he throw his toys out the pram when we got slapped by Wigan? Or was it just before that game he came off the bench and scored twice to get us a point? Around the same time Cisse had 0 goals in 3 games and Ba had 3 in 3. In the very next game selfish Demba let Papiss take a penalty at 1-0 that he absolutely ballooned. But Cisse's lack of confidence is down to Demba Ba and Alan Pardew. And as Unbelievable already mentoined. Cisse played wide for 4 games. 4! He threw his toys out the pram during Swansea... Pardew just needed a reason to change back and the Wigan defeat was that reason. Chelsea, City and Everton we played 4-4-2 after that and for the rest of Ba's career at this club except for the odd occasion Cisse played wide. Not talking about the following season, it all started from the final 3 games of the 5th placed finish season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 But we continued to play 4-3-3 after Swansea because we where winning and the team played well. Ba played in all of those games. We started 3 matches with that formation after Swansea. If what you are saying is true we would've changed formation the next game. That didn't happen. And I don't believe Pardew was looking for an excuse to change just for Ba. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Still blaming Ba Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Still blaming Ba Aye it's lunacy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Mirror.co.uk Newcastle United prepared to offload striker Papiss Cisse ChronicleLive-19 minutes agoShare However, this is a move that would only interest Cisse if he was assured of first-team football, and that it was a permanent deal. It is understood that he isn't keen ... http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/newcastle-united-prepared-offload-papiss-6553821 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sempuki Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Mirror.co.uk Newcastle United prepared to offload striker Papiss Cisse ChronicleLive-19 minutes agoShare However, this is a move that would only interest Cisse if he was assured of first-team football, and that it was a permanent deal. It is understood that he isn't keen ... http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/newcastle-united-prepared-offload-papiss-6553821 8 days to go so I doubt all these rumoured deals are going to happen. Seems our "legs have been swimming under water" for too long. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 I would swap him for anyone at the moment, take your pick: Shane Long f*** off, man. No chance How on earth is Shane Long rated so highly on here...same Shane Long that was going to tear Colo a new one then we hardly seen him. 1 game He's played well against us in the past, and I don't think it's a case of him being highly rated, more hard worker = Pardew happy. Hans, i'd struggle to find a more bang average player than Shane Long. Like you say, he works hard, that's his best attribute. He might go on a run of 3/4 games where he'll score then go missing for 15. He hasn't even nailed down a spot as a striker for West Brom, baffled how they've managed to get 6 million for a player in and out of their side. The Colo comment was more of a dig at all those slagging off Colo to the extreme, like they are doing with Cisse in this thread. It's way over the top and we make them sound proper shit. I mean because Long had a good game previously against Colo, people were saying Long would tear Colo a new one, was laughable. Some of the comments our club captain gets is a complete joke. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Long's been poor this season. Over the last season and a half he's still scored more goals than finishing/poacher supreme Papiss Cisse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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