Papiss Cissé

[Interpolic]

Pardew's tactics have been the single biggest factor imo. A shamelessly unambitious transfer window isn't far behind like.

[Dr Venkman]

You'll never convince me we shouldn't have far more points and have played far better football than we have so far this season. We've underperformed significantly, all things considered.

 

Our squad is short on quality though.

 

I would never argue we haven't underperformed and that Pardew couldn't have done more. I just think there are other factors that haven't helped but the general grumble seems to be Pardew's tactics or Ba being a greedy cunt who has the audacity to demand he plays in his natural position are the only things that have hindered us.

 

No post can ever be a catch all state of affairs though, you're asking for too much. Personally I think the managers tactics and approach to the game are the number one influence on the fortunes of any team, and I'd be interested to hear an argument stating otherwise. We've been bad this season, really bad, after 18 games that's the managers fault IMO, and the Ba issue is part of it.

[Jack Flash]

Pardew's tactics have been the single biggest factor imo. A shamelessly unambitious transfer window isn't far behind like.

 

Same here. A better manager would certainly have got more out of the available players. He's very clueless when out of his comfort zone.

[Mick]

Having 2 or 3 players out isn't a lot at all, even if they are key ones. We've looked far less than the sum of our parts for the vast majority of the season, it's as simple as that.

 

I disagree when we have a squad like we do. Just having one player out (Colo) makes a massive difference as we don't have another defender at the club capable of keeping things organised at the back.

 

If it was Simpson, Jonas and Cisse out we wouldn't have been hurt so much. Colo, Krul and Tiote (based on last seasons performances) is massive.

 

Losing the players you mention might not have been such a problem if we based our game around hurting the opposition instead of stopping them.  We've had far worse defences at this club and managed because we based our game around getting at the opposition and letting them worry about us instead of worrying about them.

[Guest neesy111]

Having 2 or 3 players out isn't a lot at all, even if they are key ones. We've looked far less than the sum of our parts for the vast majority of the season, it's as simple as that.

 

I disagree when we have a squad like we do. Just having one player out (Colo) makes a massive difference as we don't have another defender at the club capable of keeping things organised at the back.

 

If it was Simpson, Jonas and Cisse out we wouldn't have been hurt so much. Colo, Krul and Tiote (based on last seasons performances) is massive.

 

Losing the players you mention might not have been such a problem if we based our game around hurting the opposition instead of stopping them.  We've had far worse defences at this club and managed because we based our game around getting at the opposition and letting them worry about us instead of worrying about them.

 

This is my single biggest pet hate about Pardew.

[Cajun]

Having 2 or 3 players out isn't a lot at all, even if they are key ones. We've looked far less than the sum of our parts for the vast majority of the season, it's as simple as that.

 

I disagree when we have a squad like we do. Just having one player out (Colo) makes a massive difference as we don't have another defender at the club capable of keeping things organised at the back.

 

If it was Simpson, Jonas and Cisse out we wouldn't have been hurt so much. Colo, Krul and Tiote (based on last seasons performances) is massive.

 

Losing the players you mention might not have been such a problem if we based our game around hurting the opposition instead of stopping them.  We've had far worse defences at this club and managed because we based our game around getting at the opposition and letting them worry about us instead of worrying about them.

 

We have had worse defences I agree but we have had players like Bellamy, Speed, Robert, Solano and Shearer in front of them. As much as I rate our current players there is only really one who comes close to any of those (Ben Arfa).

[Ronaldo]

True. Dyer too would walk into our current side.

[Mick]

 

 

We have had worse defences I agree but we have had players like Bellamy, Speed, Robert, Solano and Shearer in front of them. As much as I rate our current players there is only really one who comes close to any of those (Ben Arfa).

 

Ben Arfa, Cabaye, Ba, Cisse, Anita and Marveaux are good enough players to get something out of.  Ba and Cisse both have a better goals to game ration here than Shearer had and that's while playing for a negative manager.  We don't have wingers like either Solano or Robert, we do have very good players who could do much better if we set up in a way that was going to bring the best out of them.

[Mick]

True. Dyer too would walk into our current side.

 

Dyer wouldn't have been the same player in this team as he was under Robson because he would be starting from much deeper in this team.

[Ronaldo]

True. Dyer too would walk into our current side.

 

Dyer wouldn't have been the same player in this team as he was under Robson because he would be starting from much deeper in this team.

 

Talking purely personnel, not tactics or formations.

[Jimburst]

You'll never convince me we shouldn't have far more points and have played far better football than we have so far this season. We've underperformed significantly, all things considered.

 

Our squad is short on quality though.

 

I would never argue we haven't underperformed and that Pardew couldn't have done more. I just think there are other factors that haven't helped but the general grumble seems to be Pardew's tactics or Ba being a greedy cunt who has the audacity to demand he plays in his natural position are the only things that have hindered us.

 

It's pretty audacious to demand anything pertaining to 'where you play' when you play football for millions a year, mate.

[Cajun]

I knew that argument would come up. He earns as much (probably less than a fair few who perform as well as he does in that position). That's just football.

 

Yes he makes millions a year but it's not like we are giving him some once in a lifetime opportunity, others would pay him the same wage and allow him to play in that position because he does a bloody good job in it.

[littlelunchbox]

This whole bullshit about Ba wanting to play where or what has got to stop, honestly our fans are going on like old women. 

 

It's up to the manager where he wants to play his players, it's all down to the manager, players can have their preference and such but its f*** all to do with them, they are there to do what the coach tells him to do. 

 

and by the way some people so f***ing naive to believe that Ba not playing out wide is because he and Pardew has some sort of agreement. wake up.

 

Pardew is last man you would rely on to honor such nonsense, he f***ing shagged half the team's wives back down southampton, he sold a load of old bullshit to hba and cabaye about his team playing good football only have them hoofing it around for over a year and a half.

 

I dont blame Ba or any players when i don't see them at a position they can be  acustomed to.  It's down to the manager to have the man management skills to persuade a player where he wants him to play and get a performance out of him in that area, and right now Pardew has failed miserably.

[Interpolic]

What a load of rubbish.

[Skirge]

More like Easter the reincarnation of Christmas tree

 

[Jimburst]

He doesn't have some form of right to any position on the pitch, no matter who will pay him his wages. He's contracted to us, by his own choice, and should fucking play as a left forward if asked . This shouldn't even have to be said.

 

I see it like this: We have 2 players who are as good as each other, and it seems like both of them like to be the main goalscorer. Ba is simply more versatile, and if it means pushing Jonas further back (or even out the team) then Ba should go left, Cisse centre and HBA right. they are our 3 most potent attacking threats, playing in in their most dangerous positions (overall).

 

Seems to make sense, and if you're about to say 'Cisse hasn't proven he can score goals' or something to that effect, just remember how class he was last season. We need to get him back on form, he's vital, and will never get back on form playing on the wing (ffs) or on the bench.

[Ronaldo]

What a load of rubbish.

 

Putting it mildly.

[Interpolic]

What a load of rubbish.

 

Putting it mildly.

 

It's patently clear that Ba's been accommodated centrally to the benefit of himself and the detriment of the team, it's almost 100% certain that this is down to the wishes of the player himself, yet people who can see the obvious are being called naive in the middle of an almost unreadable rant.

[cp40]

True. Dyer too would walk into our current side.

 

assuming it was the week a season he could walk.

[littlelunchbox]

look i believe for what its worth (fuck all) that Ba is playing up top simply because of Pardew's short sighted reliance on cheap stats.

 

He see Cisse not scoring much, off form, therefore he can't play upfront on his own.  Thus no Ba out on the left, Ba must play upfront.  It's that simple, I don't believe he scared of Ba and his agent throwing another strop.

 

He's scared the goals will dry up if Ba is not playing upfront.

[Cajun]

He doesn't have some form of right to any position on the pitch, no matter who will pay him his wages. He's contracted to us, by his own choice, and should fucking play as a left forward if asked . This shouldn't even have to be said.

 

I see it like this: We have 2 players who are as good as each other, and it seems like both of them like to be the main goalscorer. Ba is simply more versatile, and if it means pushing Jonas further back (or even out the team) then Ba should go left, Cisse centre and HBA right. they are our 3 most potent attacking threats, playing in in their most dangerous positions (overall).

 

Seems to make sense, and if you're about to say 'Cisse hasn't proven he can score goals' or something to that effect, just remember how class he was last season. We need to get him back on form, he's vital, and will never get back on form playing on the wing (ffs) or on the bench.

 

Ba has proven to be our best centre forwards over the last 18 months. Neither player are as effective out wide, both can do a job there. Cisse has started the season poorly in terms of finishing chances. Just because he scored some blinders last season that doesn't make up for the fact he can't score (so far) this season.

 

 

[Skirge]

I think Cisse would play RB if asked and give his all there too, he has not complained well publicly anyway about where he is played. Fans are of the opinion he would be best played central in a front three, I am not so sure the same could be said for Ba.

YES its upto the manager who he plays where but its not as easy as that, players play better when happy & I am sure it was stated publicly that Ba was not happy being played wide left.

He looks a threat from there he caused all sorts of problems for QPR yesterday when he pulled out wide left and as far as I can remember yesterday is the only game this season where Ba has done that allowing Cisse to go central, so Pardew must want it tried but is doing in as a trial during a game and not as a constant system change. That may be down to Ba not wanting to do so therefore as a compromise he has asked him do drift out there occasionally.

[Cajun]

I think Cisse would play RB if asked and give his all there too, he has not complained well publicly anyway about where he is played. Fans are of the opinion he would be best played central in a front three, I am not so sure the same could be said for Ba.

YES its upto the manager who he plays where but its not as easy as that, players play better when happy & I am sure it was stated publicly that Ba was not happy being played wide left.

He looks a threat from there he caused all sorts of problems for QPR yesterday when he pulled out wide left and as far as I can remember yesterday is the only game this season where Ba has done that allowing Cisse to go central, so Pardew must want it tried but is doing in as a trial during a game and not as a constant system change. That may be down to Ba not wanting to do so therefore as a compromise he has asked him do drift out there occasionally.

 

Cisse has played 4 (?) games out there and kicked off when he was subbed. Bit early to proclaim he would play anywhere for the team and Ba is the devil

[Interpolic]

look i believe for what its worth (fuck all) that Ba is playing up top simply because of Pardew's short sighted reliance on cheap stats.

 

He see Cisse not scoring much, off form, therefore he can't play upfront on his own.  Thus no Ba out on the left, Ba must play upfront.  It's that simple, I don't believe he scared of Ba and his agent throwing another strop.

 

He's scared the goals will dry up if Ba is not playing upfront.

 

Doesn't explain why we played 2 up front for most of the season until the last few games.  You can't be this stupid.

[Jimburst]

I don't see how Ba can clearly be said to be better than Cisse? Because he's played here longer? He hasn't got a significantly better goals:games ratio, and both have had terrible runs of form in terms of scoring goals when played as a right or left forward.

 

The difference being that Cisse looks clueless on the right, and Ba looked fine on the left. I like Ba, I think he's great, I just want to see our best players put in positions they're most comfortable in.