Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 What needs to happen: We press on with the same managership, scouting department and transfer policy that have brought us a clutch of absolute steals and a fifth-placed finish in the last two years, and attempt to secure our targets at centre half and full back, recognizing (as we did in the summer) that we could do with more strength in depth at the back. Curse our luck that the first half of the season hasn't gone better, and take heart from the fact that our attacking play has improved immeasurably in the last few games, even with a depleted side. Go into January's games with the sense that, for the first time in a while, we're making chances and can always find goals, and with some relief that we don't have to play Man Utd and Arsenal away every three days for the rest of the year. Accept that not every transfer window will be a roaring success if you're to maintain a determination to run the club sensibly for the long term. Consider the fact that our opponents last night are the long-term beneficiaries of precisely that approach, and also consider how ridiculous and fickle Arsenal's fans generally look from afar when they throw their toys out of the pram at every collapse in form or disappointing transfer window. Accept that, having gained promotion and built an overachieving side very quickly, it is likely that we'll yo-yo up and down the league for a while and that a consistently impressive side with real strength in depth might take another year or two, or three, to put together. What will happen: Precisely that approach from the owners, unrelenting negativity from the fans... Unless the January window happens to go our way and the resulting signings happen to bed in perfectly (or even if the current squad simply finds its feet a bit, Ben Arfa and Cabaye come back and results pick up) in which case platitudes will be mumbled in the club's general direction while all the pitchforks and torches are stowed away ready for the next difficult period. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
samag Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 We don't do loans. Hatem Ben Arfa ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 That was ages ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 We needs meat. But who are we kidding. I have hoped for some players. It will not happen. maybe 1-2. 19-14 yo max. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 We needs meat. But who are we kidding. I have hoped for some players. It will not happen. maybe 1-2. 19-14 yo max. We needs meat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Where has this pessimism about signing players come from? January 2010: Simpson, Routledge, Williamson, Hall, Van Aanholt, Best Summer 2010: Perch, Gosling, Campbell, Tiote, Ben Arfa Summer 2011: Cabaye, Ba, Marveaux, Obertan, Santon January 2012: Cisse Summer 2012: Amalfitano, Bigirimana, Anita An avalanche of creditable first teamers have arrived, for decent prices, in the last couple of years (along with one or two that didn't quite work out). What reason is there to suspect that we'll do nothing in this next window? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 We needs meat. But who are we kidding. I have hoped for some players. It will not happen. maybe 1-2. 19-14 yo max. We needs meat. Meat is good. AKA We need some squad players. Good squad players. Defenders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Amalfitano a creditable first teamer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Some words followed by (along with one or two that didn't quite work out) followed by some words Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 What needs to happen: Ashley needs to sell up to someone who has money and understands football. Once we have this guy in place he can sack Llambias and bring in sensible football men who understand the game. The new owner then invests in the majorly weak positions such as our defence and gives Pardew a certain number of games to have pulled clear of relegation trouble. Failing this he then sacks him and makes an ambitious managerial appointment. What will happen: Ashley will eat some donuts on transfer deadline day then fall asleep in front of the TV. This - nail on head. Whilst other posts have been good and very detailed, this one goes right to the heart of the problem.. Also, I disagree that its impossible to go down...any team that concedes 4 goals after pulling back deficits 3 times has EVERY chance of going down if the squad is not strengthened adequately. We are a total shambles of a club right now and the sooner everyone realizes this the better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 What needs to happen: Ashley needs to sell up to someone who has money and understands football. Once we have this guy in place he can sack Llambias and bring in sensible football men who understand the game. The new owner then invests in the majorly weak positions such as our defence and gives Pardew a certain number of games to have pulled clear of relegation trouble. Failing this he then sacks him and makes an ambitious managerial appointment. What will happen: Ashley will eat some donuts on transfer deadline day then fall asleep in front of the TV. This - nail on head. Whilst other posts have been good and very detailed, this one goes right to the heart of the problem.. Also, I disagree that its impossible to go down...any team that concedes 4 goals after pulling back deficits 3 times has EVERY chance of going down if the squad is not strengthened adequately. We are a total shambles of a club right now and the sooner everyone realizes this the better. Agree with Skelotors post, but we are not shambles. If we go on like this, we will beat the weaker sides. If Pardew goes back to 442 hoof we are in trouble imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 What should happen? No Newcastle fan should set foot in St James' Park until Ashley no longer runs the club. What will happen? Fans will turn out in their tens of thousands, pour money into his pockets and periodically buy into the bullshit they are fed. Yep...another on-the-nose post...quite right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 mental Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Where has this pessimism about signing players come from? January 2010: Simpson, Routledge, Williamson, Hall, Van Aanholt, Best Summer 2010: Perch, Gosling, Campbell, Tiote, Ben Arfa Summer 2011: Cabaye, Ba, Marveaux, Obertan, Santon January 2012: Cisse Summer 2012: Amalfitano, Bigirimana, Anita An avalanche of creditable first teamers have arrived, for decent prices, in the last couple of years (along with one or two that didn't quite work out). What reason is there to suspect that we'll do nothing in this next window? How many have left in that time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 I vividly remember we got Woodgate for a decent price as Leeds were in financial melt down at that time. Cisse was a great buy for January for that price. ...remind me - how many games did Woodgate play for us before we managed to unload him to Real Madrid..? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
High Five o Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 What should happen? No Newcastle fan should set foot in St James' Park until Ashley no longer runs the club. What will happen? Fans will turn out in their tens of thousands, pour money into his pockets and periodically buy into the bullshit they are fed. Yep...another on-the-nose post...quite right. Jupp, we should leave SJP empty! That would show the players right! FFS, do you think they think its fun to be beat 7-3? If there are anything that can help is if the fans appreciate that we had a go at manu and Arsenal. Did anyone expect points against them? As long as we have this owner we can only do as well tbh, and backing the players is at least what we can do, right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Where has this pessimism about signing players come from? January 2010: Simpson, Routledge, Williamson, Hall, Van Aanholt, Best Summer 2010: Perch, Gosling, Campbell, Tiote, Ben Arfa Summer 2011: Cabaye, Ba, Marveaux, Obertan, Santon January 2012: Cisse Summer 2012: Amalfitano, Bigirimana, Anita An avalanche of creditable first teamers have arrived, for decent prices, in the last couple of years (along with one or two that didn't quite work out). What reason is there to suspect that we'll do nothing in this next window? I stopped reading after you described Simpson and Williamson as 'creditable first teamers'... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Some words followed by (along with one or two that didn't quite work out) followed by some words You not noticed the declining numbers there then? That coupled with the comments from Llambias about 'purple players' strongly imply the club simply don't believe in paying for much more than the bare bones. Not to mention the fact that despite our most successful season in almost a decade we only brought in one senior player plus a youngster that is fortunately exceeding all expectations. We buy players based on getting a good deal first and foremost, ideally someone with high resale value. If we can't get a good deal, the manager goes without. If we don't sell anyone this January (and if someone else wants them then they're bound to be important to us) then I think there's a reasonable chance we won't sign anyone either. As it happens I think we'll sign one, but who goes out - if any - will be interesting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Where has this pessimism about signing players come from? January 2010: Simpson, Routledge, Williamson, Hall, Van Aanholt, Best Summer 2010: Perch, Gosling, Campbell, Tiote, Ben Arfa Summer 2011: Cabaye, Ba, Marveaux, Obertan, Santon January 2012: Cisse Summer 2012: Amalfitano, Bigirimana, Anita An avalanche of creditable first teamers have arrived, for decent prices, in the last couple of years (along with one or two that didn't quite work out). What reason is there to suspect that we'll do nothing in this next window? I stopped reading after you described Simpson and Williamson as 'creditable first teamers'... Some words followed by (along with one or two that didn't quite work out) followed by some words ...not to mention the fact that they have at times since their arrival looked exactly like creditable first teamers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 "Noticed the declining numbers?" Yes. Suggests a lack of willingness to buy squad players for the sake of it. As far as I know, Ashley and Pardew would like to have brought more players in over the summer but were unable to land their targets for the right price. The idea that we won't add to the squad unless we sell is totally at odds with that. They know they're short. Meanwhile, noticed the increasing quality over that time? Compare the calibre of player we have now to the 2010/11 squad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 When we'd just been promoted from the Championship? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 tollemache - do you think Pardew was hired for his footballing credentials? [/sincere question] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 My stance is that it's almost irrelevant, because I'm satisfied enough with what I've seen so far (what with reading a lot less into this season's dip than most) that I don't feel like raising major questions over his ability. So I think the motivation behind his hiring is a little bit of a moot question, and will continue to be until I see the club start to look like it's regressing in the long term. I think what we've seen since being relegated / promoted is quite a steady progression, marred by one poor transfer window and a poor run of form. Had the top brass come out saying they'd met their goals in that window, for example, I'd be concerned. But they didn't. They're aware it didn't go as well as they'd have liked and they've pledged to try and do something about it. If I am going to answer the question, though... I think it had as much to do with a sense that he'd be onside as anything, but I don't think that is necessarily that bad a thing to look for in a manager, and I don't think you appoint someone on that basis at the expense of footballing ability, on purpose, if you're halfway sane and want your football club to be successful / increase in value. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tollemache Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 When we'd just been promoted from the Championship? I think that no matter what time period you fancy looking at, there has been an increase in individual quality, and quite a rapid one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted December 30, 2012 Share Posted December 30, 2012 Anyway, if they couldn't get the right price in the summer why the optimism that they will now? In January, a window Pardew (and Llambias IIRC) has/have previously said is notoriously bad for value? When we're doing shit, shipping goals and everyone knows we're on our knees? We don't need to 'buy squad players for the sake of it', we need first team improvements to make the likes of Simpson and Williamson the squad players they should be. The position with those two in particular has been the same for years, it's bloody embarrassing. If the club are willing to back Pardew this time then I believe they'll have to fork out a bit more than they'd like. If they do so then they'll get credit from most. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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