Twinport53 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Gegenpressing is so hipster, not even FM addicts know what it means. TCD the shuttling bullshitter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Think Moussa would make a fine faux-Raumdeuter, tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest reefatoon Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Fucking gegenpressing. Arseholes making football sound shit by talking bollocks. Pardew was also a master of this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I have to say, i wish i knew more about the game, tactics etc. It would probably make watching the game more enjoyable for me i think. TCDs mention of gegenpressing has made me look up a few things. It's all good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I have to say, i wish i knew more about the game, tactics etc. It would probably make watching the game more enjoyable for me i think. TCDs mention of gegenpressing has made me look up a few things. It's all good. http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51T2dlncOcL._SY344_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg All you need imo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sima Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 How do you pronounce it anyway? juhjenpressing? Gehgenpressing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 How do you pronounce it anyway? juhjenpressing? Gehgenpressing? 'High pressing' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twinport53 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 How do you pronounce it anyway? juhjenpressing? Gehgenpressing? 'High pressing' Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Seems there's a few different ways to do it though: http://spielverlagerung.com/2014/10/07/counter-or-gegenpressing/ It's in English... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
samptime29 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 He has no intelligence. He has the physical attributes to be a top footballer & little awareness of how to improve or make the best use of it. Given him slack recently, but interviews like this just prove the same thing. Id not be fussed if he left, i dont rate him as highly as many on here. Fair post tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Gegenpress is a system/theory. "High pressing" is something Pardew or a any other many can tell his players to do. It's like saying Catenaccio or Total Football is pompous.. it's just defensive football or switching positions. But it's not. Every great concept is essentially simple but the detail is complex and in football requires intelligence. back to Moussa, I think he's a fairly intelligent footballer, going forward. Running into space in good moments, attempting to increase the tempo of a game. But the limitation of his game means there's only a few ways he knows how to play. It's about speed. Movement. Sometimes it's just not possible. He wants to make things happen but endlessly passing sideways isn't his game. Eventually he'll need to learn when to probe and when to go for it. He's awful with movement behind him and the nature of his game leaves massive holes when played centrally if the ball is lost. So there needs to be 3 players covering CM. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 It just makes it even funnier when you try to back it up with some flimsy/non-existent difference to make it sound like you're more intelligent than everyone else. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Are there any notable examples of teams that have succeeded by gegenpressing then TCD? I heard the word for the first time today so perhaps you can point me to some teams that have used it to good effect and how it's clearly distinct from just playing a pressing game? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 If you don't believe there's a difference. That's cool. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Barcelona and Dortmund are the cited examples. Funnily enough they're also cited as using a high-pressing system, because they're exactly the same thing. I'm all for new terms being different to pre-existing ones (the clear difference between false 9 and a number 10 for example) but terms like Gegenpressing are utter nonsense like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 If you don't believe there's a difference. That's cool. You've just said it's a specific system and is entirely different from high pressing but you haven't said how. Seems like you've introduced a new term to most of us today, the least you could do is shine your light of knowledge on those of us sitting in the dark wise one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanj Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Does the degenerationxpress utilize double shuttlers? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHoob Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Is it just high pressing though? It seems it's more to do with systems of pressing no matter where you lose the ball. It's a strategic type of pressing in order to regain the ball after losing it within 5 seconds. You can blitz non discrimantely, cover the available players, cover the passing lanes, etc. I'm sure our coaches are familiar with it and it's nuances. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 If you don't believe there's a difference. That's cool. You've just said it's a specific system and is entirely different from high pressing but you haven't said how. Seems like you've introduced a new term to most of us today, the least you could do is shine your light of knowledge on those of us sitting in the dark wise one. Lotus linked a good piece on it. It almost literally means countering the counter. Based on the principle that the first few seconds a player has won the ball off you, is when he's most vulnerable. He's just intercepted the ball or made a tackle, he has to change a mindset to look for the pass.. he probably hasn't decided already who to pass to. His team mates probably are only starting to move into space (but they are moving). If 2 or 3 players are hunting him down, he's liable to lose it. This requires the team to be super compact and press in unison. To leave as little space for a pass as possible. This is the one weakness of Xabi Alonso's game, he's very dangerous on the ball but he doesn't have quick feet and has also developed into a combative/defensive player. So he's often intercepting, then having to make a pass. He doesn't have the skill or quick feet of a Xavi to remain in control of the situation. Most of Alonso's teams depend on him to initiate attacks. But if you can press him quickly, he'll fold. It's also when Moussa is at his best (other than a pure counter attack). By the time they've realised what's happened he's gone. Under McClaren I feel as if he prefers a slower, more possession based build-up. Doesn't suit Moussa at all. Pardew's brand of counter attacking football is more suitable for the lad I fear. Nothing he's done suggests he wants us to defend with a high line/pressing the ball, except when the opportunity of a counter arises. With runners like Wijnaldum & Sissoko in your team you want a fast paced side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanj Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 counter the counter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Is it just high pressing though? It seems it's more to do with systems of pressing no matter where you lose the ball. It's a strategic type of pressing in order to regain the ball after losing it within 5 seconds. You can blitz non discrimantely, cover the available players, cover the passing lanes, etc. I'm sure our coaches are familiar with it and it's nuances. Definitely requires a lot of thought and work on the training field. Otherwise there would just be huge gaps. I think Moussa is an intelligent enough footballer (facing goal) to make it work. When he closes down, it's not just the man with the ball, he'll close down the best passing option too. Someone like Colback seems to either hide, or chase whoever has the ball like a headless chicken. Moussa doesn't do that. He's always looking for the quick pass. I don't think he's the stupid player many do. He's just got a finite skillset and an attitude that wants to put them to task. Someone like Obertan is stupid. He's fast and doesn't want to run at fullbacks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 It's interesting that from the descriptions of it in this thread the example that sprung right to mind was Guardiolas Barcelona, which is referenced in that article, yet during the entire period they won everything doing it I never once heard it referred to as Gegenpressing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 It's interesting that from the descriptions of it in this thread the example that sprung right to mind was Guardiolas Barcelona, which is referenced in that article, yet during the entire period they won everything doing it I never once heard it referred to as Gegenpressing. Think it's been described that way of Dortmund. I'm guessing it's a German word. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 It's interesting that from the descriptions of it in this thread the example that sprung right to mind was Guardiolas Barcelona, which is referenced in that article, yet during the entire period they won everything doing it I never once heard it referred to as Gegenpressing. Think it's been described that way of Dortmund. I'm guessing it's a German word. Yeah, the other word used in that article was counterpressing which is closer to how we'd describe it. Back to the original hipster accusation imo, just not necessary to use it other than to sound knowledgeable Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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