Rangers 1 - 1 Newcastle United - pretend you know how it went from page 18

[Dave]

This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default.

 

but he's right, we should be able to do much better by default with the existing squad we have

 

Okay then, he thinks he doesn't need to spend money upgrading the manager because he thinks Pardew will do better by default despite the evidence of his career. Again thinking he knows better than anyone else.

[captainhaircut]

How in the hell has Pardew been fucked over? Last summer maybe but hardly since then.

 

Since we finished 5th, we've lost Ba, Best, Simpson, Perch and Guthrie.

 

We've signed Remy, Gouffran, Debuchy, Mbiwa and Anita as direct replacements. We've also added Haidara and Bigi as young members d the squad and added Sissoko to the mix.

 

We're trying to add Gomis and maybe another midfield player.

 

All looking decent to me. Unfortunately Pardew is a muppet who consistently plays Jonas, plays Sissoko wide right, doesn't play Marveaux or Anita and has no clue how to have a side pass the ball.

 

We're two short of having a very good squad. Unfortunately all our players are made to look shit by Pardew.

[mrmojorisin75]

well if rumours are to be believed that's not the reason pardew is still manager and jfk is roaming the SJP stands looking under the seats for new players

[Elliottman]

To be fair to Pardew (for some reason), he's just another NUFC manager that's been f***ed over by the hierarchy above him. He's sticking with what he thinks will produce good results, even if it often didn't last season. Downey aside he's been given absolutely nothing new to work with.

 

Thats a good point. I think it's easy to forget too. Look at laudrup kicking off six or seven weeks ago about players, they've since signed 5? Would never happen here. That's why we will never get a top manager under Ashley.

 

It's just the same basic principle as last summer - and pretty much everything to do with the club these days - Ashley thinks he knows better than everyone else involved in football. Last summer we'd just finished 5th; there was no need to invest as we'd obviously be able to repeat it by default. This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default. He and the odious people he employs to do his dirty work think they will win every gamble they make.

 

Will we be better? Probably, it's hard to imagine us being as bad or worse. Is simply being better than 16th good enough for NUFC? Absolutely not.

 

For me, there's been a big realisation this summer especially that Ashley is happy for us to simply exists, for the club to run itself. There is no ambition to succeed or achieve anything in particular. So in the meantime, we have to hope the players and manager can produce a decent cup run or a some decent results in the league. Pretty fucking sad really.

[mrmojorisin75]

and what haircut said

[Guest Phil K]

no i'm aware, and cisse wasn't playing in a lot of our games but then liverpool have been without suarez, as an example, yet have bagged 17 goals

 

i dunno man, it's all mitigation and excuses with Pardew because he can't put a team on the park to go out and just f***ing beat the opposition

 

In mitigation it has to be remembered he's an utter joke of a manager.....only Kinnear is as bad, and we have em both......

[Spider Jerusalem]

It's just the same basic principle as last summer - and pretty much everything to do with the club these days - Ashley thinks he knows better than everyone else involved in football. Last summer we'd just finished 5th; there was no need to invest as we'd obviously be able to repeat it by default. This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default. He and the odious people he employs to do his dirty work think they will win every gamble they make.

 

Will we be better? Probably, it's hard to imagine us being as bad or worse. Is simply being better than 16th good enough for NUFC? Absolutely not.

 

It's not that hard to imagine to be honest.

[Dave]

I'm not defending Pardew at all, he's poor and should certainly be getting more from the talent he's got to work with.

 

But look at the managers employed by Ashley:

 

Kevin Keegan (not in a managerial job)

Joe Kinnear (not in a managerial job)

Alan Shearer (not in a managerial job)

Chris Hughton (not in a managerial job)

Alan Pardew (not in a managerial job)

 

Okay, Keegan was genuinely fucked over and Hughton (plus Pardew for one season) outperformed all expectations but the fact is that not once has he given the single most important role at the club to someone that any other club wanted to employ as manager at the time. It's all about gambling on cheap options and hoping they come up trumps. Same shit runs throughout the club from top to bottom, time and time again.

[mrmojorisin75]

For me, there's been a big realisation this summer especially that Ashley is happy for us to simply exists, for the club to run itself. There is no ambition to succeed or achieve anything in particular. So in the meantime, we have to hope the players and manager can produce a decent cup run or a some decent results in the league. Pretty fucking sad really.

 

people need to separate the idea of pardew not being backed (partially true but not entirely) with a real honest look at how he's performing as a manager with what he's had available to him

 

in the interests of fairness he massively overachieved when we finished 5th but he's been on a seemingly unstoppable slide ever since, was backed with new players to try and arrest our slide, and almost managed to take us down

 

he's had deficiencies in his squad, as have most managers tbf, but nothing that comes close to justifying the last year

[Dave]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's shite and so are the wankers running the club above him.

[Elliottman]

How in the hell has Pardew been f***ed over? Last summer maybe but hardly since then.

 

Since we finished 5th, we've lost Ba, Best, Simpson, Perch and Guthrie.

 

We've signed Remy, Gouffran, Debuchy, Mbiwa and Anita as direct replacements. We've also added Haidara and Bigi as young members d the squad and added Sissoko to the mix.

 

We're trying to add Gomis and maybe another midfield player.

 

All looking decent to me. Unfortunately Pardew is a muppet who consistently plays Jonas, plays Sissoko wide right, doesn't play Marveaux or Anita and has no clue how to have a side pass the ball.

 

We're two short of having a very good squad. Unfortunately all our players are made to look s*** by Pardew.

 

Last summer was a major fuck up though to be fair. We went into a new season with extra games with a centre midfielder we didn't need. And excuse or not we did have shocking injuries last year.

 

But, now you're right. He does have a decent set of players to work with, no injuries, no Europe. For me, he's got ten games. I think he'll be out on his arse if we don't have a decent start.

[Elliottman]

Wouldn't be surprised if poyet is already lined up either.

[Dr Venkman]

To be fair to Pardew (for some reason), he's just another NUFC manager that's been f***ed over by the hierarchy above him. He's sticking with what he thinks will produce good results, even if it often didn't last season. Downey aside he's been given absolutely nothing new to work with.

 

Thats a good point. I think it's easy to forget too. Look at laudrup kicking off six or seven weeks ago about players, they've since signed 5? Would never happen here. That's why we will never get a top manager under Ashley.

 

It's just the same basic principle as last summer - and pretty much everything to do with the club these days - Ashley thinks he knows better than everyone else involved in football. Last summer we'd just finished 5th; there was no need to invest as we'd obviously be able to repeat it by default. This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default. He and the odious people he employs to do his dirty work think they will win every gamble they make.

 

Will we be better? Probably, it's hard to imagine us being as bad or worse. Is simply being better than 16th good enough for NUFC? Absolutely not.

 

For me, there's been a big realisation this summer especially that Ashley is happy for us to simply exists, for the club to run itself. There is no ambition to succeed or achieve anything in particular. So in the meantime, we have to hope the players and manager can produce a decent cup run or a some decent results in the league. Pretty fucking sad really.

 

I think that realisation came last summer tbf.

[Elliottman]

To be fair to Pardew (for some reason), he's just another NUFC manager that's been f***ed over by the hierarchy above him. He's sticking with what he thinks will produce good results, even if it often didn't last season. Downey aside he's been given absolutely nothing new to work with.

 

Thats a good point. I think it's easy to forget too. Look at laudrup kicking off six or seven weeks ago about players, they've since signed 5? Would never happen here. That's why we will never get a top manager under Ashley.

 

It's just the same basic principle as last summer - and pretty much everything to do with the club these days - Ashley thinks he knows better than everyone else involved in football. Last summer we'd just finished 5th; there was no need to invest as we'd obviously be able to repeat it by default. This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default. He and the odious people he employs to do his dirty work think they will win every gamble they make.

 

Will we be better? Probably, it's hard to imagine us being as bad or worse. Is simply being better than 16th good enough for NUFC? Absolutely not.

 

For me, there's been a big realisation this summer especially that Ashley is happy for us to simply exists, for the club to run itself. There is no ambition to succeed or achieve anything in particular. So in the meantime, we have to hope the players and manager can produce a decent cup run or a some decent results in the league. Pretty f***ing sad really.

 

I think that realisation came last summer tbf.

 

Well, coming off the back of a good season I was probably willing to give the benefit of the doubt. It's pretty clear now like.

[Unbelievable]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

[Unbelievable]

To be fair to Pardew (for some reason), he's just another NUFC manager that's been f***ed over by the hierarchy above him. He's sticking with what he thinks will produce good results, even if it often didn't last season. Downey aside he's been given absolutely nothing new to work with.

 

Thats a good point. I think it's easy to forget too. Look at laudrup kicking off six or seven weeks ago about players, they've since signed 5? Would never happen here. That's why we will never get a top manager under Ashley.

 

It's just the same basic principle as last summer - and pretty much everything to do with the club these days - Ashley thinks he knows better than everyone else involved in football. Last summer we'd just finished 5th; there was no need to invest as we'd obviously be able to repeat it by default. This summer we've just finished 16th; there's no need to invest as we'll obviously be able to do much better by default. He and the odious people he employs to do his dirty work think they will win every gamble they make.

 

Will we be better? Probably, it's hard to imagine us being as bad or worse. Is simply being better than 16th good enough for NUFC? Absolutely not.

 

For me, there's been a big realisation this summer especially that Ashley is happy for us to simply exists, for the club to run itself. There is no ambition to succeed or achieve anything in particular. So in the meantime, we have to hope the players and manager can produce a decent cup run or a some decent results in the league. Pretty f***ing sad really.

 

I think that realisation came last summer tbf.

 

I was sceptical before the KK affair, but anyone who didn't realise what we're dealing with after that train wreck of a summer and ensuing season need their heads checked. If anything, things have slightly improved since then.

[mrmojorisin75]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

 

i'm sorry like, but in the immediate term he is our major problem, because he's a football manager who is very poor at managing football teams

 

this discussion was sort of restarted by me this morning not to juxtapose how brendan rodgers employers have or have not backed him this summer to make him more successful, it was to highlight how rodgers has gone out with purpose and intent to make sure liverpool have a good season to the best of his abilities

 

pardew seems to have done little more than complain about new signings, ostensibly

 

that ashley employed him and should have sacked him is by the by really 'cause he's still the manager

[Unbelievable]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

 

i'm sorry like, but in the immediate term he is our major problem, because he's a football manager who is very poor at managing football teams

 

this discussion was sort of restarted by me this morning not to juxtapose how brendan rodgers employers have or have not backed him this summer to make him more successful, it was to highlight how rodgers has gone out with purpose and intent to make sure liverpool have a good season to the best of his abilities

 

pardew seems to have done little more than complain about new signings, ostensibly

 

that ashley employed him and should have sacked him is by the by really 'cause he's still the manager

 

I couldn't disagree more. Ashley could sack Pardew tomorrow and replace him by Kinnear (most likely) or the next unemployed no-mark English manager. The real issue here is Ashley, Pardew is no more than a symptom. A symptom that needs to be combatted, certainly, but that by itself will not cure the disease.

[Troll]

As far as on the pitch in concerned, Pardew is our biggest problem.  Off the pitch it's Ashley.

[manosdepiedra]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

 

i'm sorry like, but in the immediate term he is our major problem, because he's a football manager who is very poor at managing football teams

 

this discussion was sort of restarted by me this morning not to juxtapose how brendan rodgers employers have or have not backed him this summer to make him more successful, it was to highlight how rodgers has gone out with purpose and intent to make sure liverpool have a good season to the best of his abilities

 

pardew seems to have done little more than complain about new signings, ostensibly

 

that ashley employed him and should have sacked him is by the by really 'cause he's still the manager

 

I couldn't disagree more. Ashley could sack Pardew tomorrow and replace him by Kinnear (most likely) or the next unemployed no-mark English manager. The real issue here is Ashley, Pardew is no more than a symptom.

 

The fact that Pardew is clearly first in line to get the job should tell you everything you need to know tbh. He's donr nowt but moan about transfers this summer because he's not involved in them to any great degree.

[mrmojorisin75]

so in response to me comparing how pardew has done this pre-season vs. another manager is it doesn't matter because ashley should sack him?

 

the whole point of this thread and what was being discussed was about how well we'd done this pre-season vs. a perceived overreaction to the draw with rangers

 

we're not talking about ashley, of course he should have sacked pardew before we hit 2013 (certainly before the end of last season), i was one of the fucking first people to say it

[Optimistic Nut]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

 

i'm sorry like, but in the immediate term he is our major problem, because he's a football manager who is very poor at managing football teams

 

this discussion was sort of restarted by me this morning not to juxtapose how brendan rodgers employers have or have not backed him this summer to make him more successful, it was to highlight how rodgers has gone out with purpose and intent to make sure liverpool have a good season to the best of his abilities

 

pardew seems to have done little more than complain about new signings, ostensibly

 

that ashley employed him and should have sacked him is by the by really 'cause he's still the manager

 

I couldn't disagree more. Ashley could sack Pardew tomorrow and replace him by Kinnear (most likely) or the next unemployed no-mark English manager. The real issue here is Ashley, Pardew is no more than a symptom. A symptom that needs to be combatted, certainly, but that by itself will not cure the disease.

 

A half competent manager should still be able to get this squad competing for a top 7 spot even with the tools he's been given.

[mrmojorisin75]

A half competent manager should still be able to get this squad competing for a top 7 spot even with the tools he's been given.

 

yeah but ashley should have sacked pardew, so er, ashley

 

or something

[Unbelievable]

As usual this isn't a either/or argument. I think Pardew's s**** and so are the w*****s running the club above him.

 

Yep. It's strange people can't take in criticism of the board/owner without reverting to pointing to Pardew as our major problem, conveniently sidestepping the fact that he too has been appointed and given more time by the same incompetent people at the top.

 

i'm sorry like, but in the immediate term he is our major problem, because he's a football manager who is very poor at managing football teams

 

this discussion was sort of restarted by me this morning not to juxtapose how brendan rodgers employers have or have not backed him this summer to make him more successful, it was to highlight how rodgers has gone out with purpose and intent to make sure liverpool have a good season to the best of his abilities

 

pardew seems to have done little more than complain about new signings, ostensibly

 

that ashley employed him and should have sacked him is by the by really 'cause he's still the manager

 

I couldn't disagree more. Ashley could sack Pardew tomorrow and replace him by Kinnear (most likely) or the next unemployed no-mark English manager. The real issue here is Ashley, Pardew is no more than a symptom. A symptom that needs to be combatted, certainly, but that by itself will not cure the disease.

 

A half competent manager should still be able to get this squad competing for a top 7 spot even with the tools he's been given.

 

Ashley made the decision to appoint Pardew, firstly, and then to not send him packing after last season. He holds the power to change things for the better for this club. His influence eclipses that of Pardew. Pardew hasn't convinced, but then he never has at any club. We got what we paid for, and apparently that suits Ashley just fine.

[manosdepiedra]

As far as on the pitch in concerned, Pardew is our biggest problem.  Off the pitch it's Ashley.

 

They're implicitly linked though. Did anyone have high hopes for Pardew when he was appointed? his recored suggested he flatters to deceive for a while then cant sustain any momentum to keep his team's moving forward. That sounds horribly familiar after last season. Who appointed a manager with that track record again?...