AyeDubbleYoo Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Not IMO, but I am one of his major haters. He hasn't stopped the team winning. Anyway, Hull game eh? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lush Vlad Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Clearly Benitez has placed great importance on tomorrow's match so he's going to start with what he feels is his best team. If Colback is fit it'll be interesting to see who gets the nod to play alongside Shelvey. Despite the fact Colback wasn't available for selection on Saturday and Benitez regularly rotates the two. I mean apart from that, it's clear Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 .co.uk beta showing Colback has a 90% win ratio. Hayden: 66% And yet Hayden is miles better than Colback, so I'm confused. That isn't really up for debate imo. However the theory that Shelvey is more effective for us alongside Colback might have something to it. I just don't see logically how that could be the case. Yes, Hayden was awful yesterday but Colback has been repeatedly awful for ages. Dunno, maybe there's something in their psychology that's hard to explain. Colback's been decent the last few months, hasn't he? He's been fine this season. Tbf he's probably found his level which is why I think he'd be a great signing for any of the 3 relegated teams next season if we go up. Long term Hayden is clearly going to be the better bet but right now there's very little between them but for me I'd give Colback the nod because I think that Shelvey (our most important player) has looked better alongside him, and I base that opinion having seen the majority of matches this season, and not just to towing the party line on here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 .co.uk beta showing Colback has a 90% win ratio. Hayden: 66% And yet Hayden is miles better than Colback, so I'm confused. That isn't really up for debate imo. However the theory that Shelvey is more effective for us alongside Colback might have something to it. I just don't see logically how that could be the case. Yes, Hayden was awful yesterday but Colback has been repeatedly awful for ages. Dunno, maybe there's something in their psychology that's hard to explain. Colback's been decent the last few months, hasn't he? He's been fine this season. Tbf he's probably found his level which is why I think he'd be a great signing for any of the 3 relegated teams next season if we go up. Long term Hayden is clearly going to be the better bet but right now there's very little between them but for me I'd give Colback the nod because I think that Shelvey (our most important player) has looked better alongside him, and I base that opinion having seen the majority of matches this season, and not just to towing the party line on here. But your opinion doesn't really say anything other than Shelvey's looked better alongside Colback according to you. What is it about Colback that improves Shelvey's game? Can you elaborate, maybe I'm missing something you've picked up on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Mitrovic started as well. Maybe we should play him ahead of Gayle going by your logic? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Mitrovic started as well. Maybe we should play him ahead of Gayle going by your logic? Shelvey ran the game in our most dominant performance of the season with Hayden in the team, your "point" was that he is ineffective alongside Hayden compared to alongside Colback. It's bollocks basically, and reactionary bollocks based on a rare defeat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Mitrovic started as well. Maybe we should play him ahead of Gayle going by your logic? Shelvey ran the game with Hayden in the team, your "point" was that he is ineffective alongside Hayden compared to alongside Colback. It's bollocks basically, and reactionary bollocks based on a rare defeat. You're basing this on 1 match where the opposition were worse than dreadful and their manager lost his job not long after. Our results have been better this season with Colback/Shelvey than Hayden/Shelvey. Anyway this is the wrong thread to be discussing this. My opinion is still the same and that is that there's little to choose between the two but i'd give Colback the edge because, in my opinion, Shelvey looks better alongside him. Going forward, should we get promoted I'd expect Colback to be moved on and Hayden to be retained because I think Hayden will improve whereas I know Colback can't quite cut it at that level. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We've won 6 league games with Hayden/Shelvey midfield and 5 games with Colback/Shelvey mind. There's no way I'm counting that Norwich game as a win for Colback/Shelvey when we were 1-3 down when Colback came off Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We've won 6 league games with Hayden/Shelvey midfield and 5 games with Colback/Shelvey mind. There's no way I'm counting that Norwich game as a win for Colback/Shelvey when we were 1-3 down when Colback came off So we have a better win percentage with Colback starting than Hayden then. Another question. Were you actually at the Norwich match? Did you watch it? We absolutely murdered them. Gayle should have had a hattrick before half time and they scored with their only 3 attempts on target, one being a penalty. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I was at the Norwich match and I saw Colback get a stupid yellow card in the first half and then he couldn't make a tackle for the rest of the game. Their third goal came from him running the length of the pitch unable to make a tackle because of his yellow card in the first half leaving us 1-3 down. He also didn't put a tackle in for their 2nd goal to stop a counter attack Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We've won 6 league games with Hayden/Shelvey midfield and 5 games with Colback/Shelvey mind. There's no way I'm counting that Norwich game as a win for Colback/Shelvey when we were 1-3 down when Colback came off So we have a better win percentage with Colback starting than Hayden then. Another question. Were you actually at the Norwich match? Did you watch it? We absolutely murdered them. Gayle should have had a hattrick before half time and they scored with their only 3 attempts on target, one being a penalty. Yeah, you said this in the Shelvey thread after that match: Our most important player and someone who I don't think will be rotated too many times. Colback was fairly anonymous last night which made his performance even more impressive as he was needing to cover more ground than he would have liked at times. I'd imagine he prefers Hayden beside him and hopefully Rafa will try Diame alongside him as well in the future because he's a waste of a shirt playing in his current position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We've won 6 league games with Hayden/Shelvey midfield and 5 games with Colback/Shelvey mind. There's no way I'm counting that Norwich game as a win for Colback/Shelvey when we were 1-3 down when Colback came off So we have a better win percentage with Colback starting than Hayden then. Another question. Were you actually at the Norwich match? Did you watch it? We absolutely murdered them. Gayle should have had a hattrick before half time and they scored with their only 3 attempts on target, one being a penalty. Yeah, you said this in the Shelvey thread after that match: Our most important player and someone who I don't think will be rotated too many times. Colback was fairly anonymous last night which made his performance even more impressive as he was needing to cover more ground than he would have liked at times. I'd imagine he prefers Hayden beside him and hopefully Rafa will try Diame alongside him as well in the future because he's a waste of a shirt playing in his current position. He was poor that night, every bit as bad as Hayden on Saturday. Read through the Colback thread and it's clear I'm not his greatest fan but generally speaking he's been OK this season. Unlike a lot of people on here I'm also happy to admit when he plays well. He was involved in both our goals down at Leeds last week but got no credit on here for that. He miss times a tackle or gives the ball away and the Colback thread goes into overdrive. A bit of balance would be nice. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We've won 6 league games with Hayden/Shelvey midfield and 5 games with Colback/Shelvey mind. There's no way I'm counting that Norwich game as a win for Colback/Shelvey when we were 1-3 down when Colback came off So we have a better win percentage with Colback starting than Hayden then. Another question. Were you actually at the Norwich match? Did you watch it? We absolutely murdered them. Gayle should have had a hattrick before half time and they scored with their only 3 attempts on target, one being a penalty. Yeah, you said this in the Shelvey thread after that match: Our most important player and someone who I don't think will be rotated too many times. Colback was fairly anonymous last night which made his performance even more impressive as he was needing to cover more ground than he would have liked at times. I'd imagine he prefers Hayden beside him and hopefully Rafa will try Diame alongside him as well in the future because he's a waste of a shirt playing in his current position. He was poor that night, every bit as bad as Hayden on Saturday. Read through the Colback thread and it's clear I'm not his greatest fan but generally speaking he's been OK this season. Unlike a lot of people on here I'm also happy to admit when he plays well. He was involved in both our goals down at Leeds last week but got no credit on here for that. He miss times a tackle or gives the ball away and the Colback thread goes into overdrive. A bit of balance would be nice. Why should we give him credit for mishitting a simple cross into the box that should have been a simple catch to the goalkeeper? If Green had caught the ball like 9.9/10 other goalkeepers in that situation it would have been a terrible piece of play by Colback. He also nearly cost us a goal at Leeds for a terrible touch in the box only for an excellent save by Darlow. He was fine for 30 mins against Leeds but was extrememly average after that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Even in this league he's been nothing more than average at best. We fell to pieces when he came on for the last 15 mins against Villa. I'd still put him in ahead of Colback but clearly Shelvey and Hayden is our best central midfield pairing. ^ You just seem to change your mind on this issue a lot and act like it's been your view for longer than 5 minutes, that's all m8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufcjb Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 The Friday game against Forest shouldn't be taken lightly for tomorrow's team selection. Think we'll get surprises for the Hull match and a strong team against Forest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If we go weakened tomorrow what the fuck was the point in Saturday? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Even in this league he's been nothing more than average at best. We fell to pieces when he came on for the last 15 mins against Villa. I'd still put him in ahead of Colback but clearly Shelvey and Hayden is our best central midfield pairing. ^ You just seem to change your mind on this issue a lot and act like it's been your view for longer than 5 minutes, that's all m8 Have you changed your mind on who is our best central defensive partnership this season m8? A simple yes or no will suffice? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Mitrovic started as well. Maybe we should play him ahead of Gayle going by your logic? Shelvey ran the game with Hayden in the team, your "point" was that he is ineffective alongside Hayden compared to alongside Colback. It's bollocks basically, and reactionary bollocks based on a rare defeat. You're basing this on 1 match where the opposition were worse than dreadful and their manager lost his job not long after. Our results have been better this season with Colback/Shelvey than Hayden/Shelvey. Anyway this is the wrong thread to be discussing this. My opinion is still the same and that is that there's little to choose between the two but i'd give Colback the edge because, in my opinion, Shelvey looks better alongside him. Going forward, should we get promoted I'd expect Colback to be moved on and Hayden to be retained because I think Hayden will improve whereas I know Colback can't quite cut it at that level. You still haven't said why you think Shelvey looks better alongside Colback. What is it about Colback's game which brings out the best in Shelvey? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Even in this league he's been nothing more than average at best. We fell to pieces when he came on for the last 15 mins against Villa. I'd still put him in ahead of Colback but clearly Shelvey and Hayden is our best central midfield pairing. ^ You just seem to change your mind on this issue a lot and act like it's been your view for longer than 5 minutes, that's all m8 Have you changed your mind on who is our best central defensive partnership this season m8? A simple yes or no will suffice? Well no, not really. It'll take a lot more than what we've seen to convince me Colback is the better option or gets better performances out of Shelvey. From what I've seen of Colback this year it's the same old shit with him hiding regularly, giving the ball away loads, and shock horror not getting found out for it quite as much because we're at a lower level. Hayden has been the better of the 2, and I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest Shelvey prefers playing alongside Colback, and neither had you since about 3 days ago. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallsendmag Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Even in this league he's been nothing more than average at best. We fell to pieces when he came on for the last 15 mins against Villa. I'd still put him in ahead of Colback but clearly Shelvey and Hayden is our best central midfield pairing. ^ You just seem to change your mind on this issue a lot and act like it's been your view for longer than 5 minutes, that's all m8 Have you changed your mind on who is our best central defensive partnership this season m8? A simple yes or no will suffice? Well no, not really. It'll take a lot more than what we've seen to convince me Colback is the better option or gets better performances out of Shelvey. From what I've seen of Colback this year it's the same old s*** with him hiding regularly, giving the ball away loads, and shock horror not getting found out for it quite as much because we're at a lower level. Hayden has been the better of the 2, and I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest Shelvey prefers playing alongside Colback, and neither had you since about 3 days ago. Who was your preferred centre half pairing before we kicked off at Fulham and who is your preferred centre half pairing now? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufcjb Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If we go weakened tomorrow what the f*** was the point in Saturday? Saturday wasn't weakened. Yes he made changes but most of the players he put in, maybe except for Gamez, were players who Rafa had trusted before to start a game. Problem with Saturday was complacency. There is no way Rafa will go with his strongest possible team tomorrow with a game on Friday. Had it not been Friday or even Forest, then maybe he'd had put strong sides out not for Hull only but also on Saturday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Even in this league he's been nothing more than average at best. We fell to pieces when he came on for the last 15 mins against Villa. I'd still put him in ahead of Colback but clearly Shelvey and Hayden is our best central midfield pairing. ^ You just seem to change your mind on this issue a lot and act like it's been your view for longer than 5 minutes, that's all m8 Have you changed your mind on who is our best central defensive partnership this season m8? A simple yes or no will suffice? Well no, not really. It'll take a lot more than what we've seen to convince me Colback is the better option or gets better performances out of Shelvey. From what I've seen of Colback this year it's the same old s*** with him hiding regularly, giving the ball away loads, and shock horror not getting found out for it quite as much because we're at a lower level. Hayden has been the better of the 2, and I've seen absolutely nothing to suggest Shelvey prefers playing alongside Colback, and neither had you since about 3 days ago. Who was your preferred centre half pairing before we kicked off at Fulham and who is your preferred centre half pairing now? What the fuck you on about? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Hayden and Shelvey started the game together at QPR which was our biggest win and most dominant performance of the season. Bit weird. Mitrovic started as well. Maybe we should play him ahead of Gayle going by your logic? Shelvey ran the game with Hayden in the team, your "point" was that he is ineffective alongside Hayden compared to alongside Colback. It's bollocks basically, and reactionary bollocks based on a rare defeat. You're basing this on 1 match where the opposition were worse than dreadful and their manager lost his job not long after. Our results have been better this season with Colback/Shelvey than Hayden/Shelvey. Anyway this is the wrong thread to be discussing this. My opinion is still the same and that is that there's little to choose between the two but i'd give Colback the edge because, in my opinion, Shelvey looks better alongside him. Going forward, should we get promoted I'd expect Colback to be moved on and Hayden to be retained because I think Hayden will improve whereas I know Colback can't quite cut it at that level. You still haven't said why you think Shelvey looks better alongside Colback. What is it about Colback's game which brings out the best in Shelvey? I'm only really playing devil's advocate and haven't seen us play enough to have a strong opinion on it but it could be that Hayden tries more risky passes on the ball, instead of Colback who is aware of his limitations and will just give Shelvey the ball most of the time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If we go weakened tomorrow what the f*** was the point in Saturday? Saturday wasn't weakened. Yes he made changes but most of the players he put in, maybe except for Gamez, were players who Rafa had trusted before to start a game. Problem with Saturday was complacency. There is no way Rafa will go with his strongest possible team tomorrow with a game on Friday. Had it not been Friday or even Forest, then maybe he'd had put strong sides out not for Hull only but also on Saturday. I don't think there was any complacency against Blackburn, I tend to agree with Rafa that the team we put out was more than strong enough to win the game, just some of the players who were given the chance to claim a shirt didn't really perform on the day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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