PIF and RB Sports & Media

[Hovagod]

27 minutes ago, Hank Marvin said:

These people who attempt to promote themselves as a paragon of morality whilst the sport their involved in is awash with corrupt money from around the world, and to single out Amanda for saying that Abaramovich who has been nothing but an excellent steward of his club is being harshly treated for being Russian and wealthy, is utterly absurd.

 

What the fuck exactly beyond being Russian and wealthy has Abramovich got to do with Vladimir Putin's geopolitical ambitions & foreign policy? Do they think old Vlad is taking the council of a middle-aged Ruski playboy who's main ambition is to win pieces of shiny metal for his swanky London club?

 

And if they want to talk about collective punishment as a means of putting pressure on Putin - Shouldn't the same go when this country is involved in illegal middle-eastern wars that kill millions of poor and working class people who never asked for their country to be invaded by the UK and the USA? Perhaps English clubs, and wealthy English people should be frozen out of sport and out of the economic system every time we go on some adventurist war on behalf of the international elite and American Neo-cons?

 

Before these berks open their mouths, they should start with "I, hypocrite".

 

 

 

Bad take. 

[Hovagod]

45 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

I'm not sure how support for Ukraine will come across when the country with majority control of our club are levelling the fuck out of Yemen.

Yep- I said this earlier. Any other answer would have been rightly cited as hypocrisy

 

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by Hovagod

[Kid Icarus]

48 minutes ago, Hank Marvin said:

These people who attempt to promote themselves as a paragon of morality whilst the sport their involved in is awash with corrupt money from around the world, and to single out Amanda for saying that Abaramovich who has been nothing but an excellent steward of his club is being harshly treated for being Russian and wealthy, is utterly absurd.

 

What the fuck exactly beyond being Russian and wealthy has Abramovich got to do with Vladimir Putin's geopolitical ambitions & foreign policy? Do they think old Vlad is taking the council of a middle-aged Ruski playboy who's main ambition is to win pieces of shiny metal for his swanky London club?

 

And if they want to talk about collective punishment as a means of putting pressure on Putin - Shouldn't the same go when this country is involved in illegal middle-eastern wars that kill millions of poor and working class people who never asked for their country to be invaded by the UK and the USA? Perhaps English clubs, and wealthy English people should be frozen out of sport and out of the economic system every time we go on some adventurist war on behalf of the international elite and American Neo-cons?

 

Before these berks open their mouths, they should start with "I, hypocrite".

 

 

 

 

If you're talking specifically about oligarchs (probably semantics when it seems like every fucking Billionaire is involved in manipulating a government) here then I actually agree with almost everything you're saying here. I think the only difference is that while your point is 'why single out Stavelely/Abramovich when they're all at it?' and it being hypocritical, I would say every single one of them should be singled out, sanctioned, removed from positions of political influence.

Obviously that's deluded in the extreme though, this country and its public has very clear definitions on what's an acceptable war and an unacceptable war. Mention something like BDS in most political corners either here or in the U.S and most of the people who are rightly outraged over Ukraine will look down and shuffle their feet.

 

 

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by Kid Icarus

[Hank Marvin]

13 minutes ago, Hovagod said:

Bad take. 

 

Explain the difference to me between the US and the UK killing millions of Iraqi's and Afghan's in their appalling war for a 'democracy' and Vladimir Putin attempting the seize the Ukraine by force - Go ahead, please.

 

The only difference is that it's ok when we do it because you're conditioned to think that when we kill millions of people, that it's noble.

 

What a fucking joke.

 

War is appalling, full stop. And if you're going to apply harsh means of treatment to Russians on the basis of what the Russian government has done, then the same treatment should be applied to the leaders of other warmongering states, including ours and the good ol' US of A.

[KaKa]

43 minutes ago, Hank Marvin said:

These people who attempt to promote themselves as a paragon of morality whilst the sport their involved in is awash with corrupt money from around the world, and to single out Amanda for saying that Abaramovich who has been nothing but an excellent steward of his club is being harshly treated for being Russian and wealthy, is utterly absurd.

 

What the fuck exactly beyond being Russian and wealthy has Abramovich got to do with Vladimir Putin's geopolitical ambitions & foreign policy? Do they think old Vlad is taking the council of a middle-aged Ruski playboy who's main ambition is to win pieces of shiny metal for his swanky London club?

 

And if they want to talk about collective punishment as a means of putting pressure on Putin - Shouldn't the same go when this country is involved in illegal middle-eastern wars that kill millions of poor and working class people who never asked for their country to be invaded by the UK and the USA? Perhaps English clubs, and wealthy English people should be frozen out of sport and out of the economic system every time we go on some adventurist war on behalf of the international elite and American Neo-cons?

 

Before these berks open their mouths, they should start with "I, hypocrite".

 

 

 

 

Honestly, it's all so incredibly ridiculous and tedious at this point. They may as well just fold everything up. 

[Hovagod]

3 minutes ago, Hank Marvin said:

 

Explain the difference to me between the US and the UK killing millions of Iraqi's and Afghan's in their appalling war for a 'democracy' and Vladimir Putin attempting the seize the Ukraine by force - Go ahead, please.

 

The only difference is that it's ok when we do it because you're conditioned to think that when we kill millions of people, that it's noble.

 

What a fucking joke.

 

War is appalling, full stop. And if you're going to apply harsh means of treatment to Russians on the basis of what the Russian government has done, then the same treatment should be applied to the leaders of other warmongering states, including ours and the good ol' US of A.

Don’t disagree about America’s wars being disgraceful. I think the links are a lot more nebulous though. It’s an emotive and horrible subject though, and I do apologise for my pithy reply. 

[Kid Icarus]

The links aren't nebulous like, but it's probably best kept for the Chat section/for us to not talk about. 

[midds]

It's probably her first, public mis-step since she took the reins tbh. I don't agree with her and think/hope she's just misarticulated herself but the witch-hunt is disproportionate to what she actually said. It's not the end of the world but she needs to choose her words with more care when she's in that situation. 

[Khalidao]

48 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

I'm not sure how support for Ukraine will come across when the country with majority control of our club are levelling the fuck out of Yemen.

 

Imagine a radical Islamic militia in Norway took over the government and decided to sail over the North Sea and add Newcastle to their land by force. UK pushing them out and they start sending missiles killing civilians in Newcastle. How'd the UK government and public respond?

 

Also, Saudi didn't "invade" Yemen like Russia did in Ukraine. Saudi started by fighting the Houthi militia on the border and north of Yemen and later helping normal Yemenis in the south fight for their liberation from Houthis.

 

All of this is well-documented but not really highlighted by Western media when they talk about the war in Yemen. The pushed narrative is only "Saudi is bombing Yemenis".

[Hovagod]

23 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

The links aren't nebulous like, but it's probably best kept for the Chat section/for us to not talk about. 

Honestly happy to hear more. But you’re right, maybe better suited to another part of the forum.

[The Prophet]

10 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

Imagine a radical Islamic militia in Norway took over the government and decided to sail over the North Sea and add Newcastle to their land by force. UK pushing them out and they start sending missiles killing civilians in Newcastle. How'd the UK government and public respond?

 

Also, Saudi didn't "invade" Yemen like Russia did in Ukraine. Saudi started by fighting the Houthi militia on the border and north of Yemen and later helping normal Yemenis in the south fight for their liberation from Houthis.

 

All of this is well-documented but not really highlighted by Western media when they talk about the war in Yemen. The pushed narrative is only "Saudi is bombing Yemenis".

 

I'm sure the KSA blockade of the Yemen borders, preventing foreign aid, namely food from coming in for large sections of the population has helped liberate them no end.

 

They're a barbaric regime, we don't need to make excuses on their behalf.

[Khalidao]

4 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

I'm sure the KSA blockade of the Yemen borders, preventing foreign aid, namely food from coming in for large sections of the population has helped liberate them no end.

 

They're a barbaric regime, we don't need to make excuses on their behalf.

 

And this is a barbaric group who needs to be eradicated off the face of the earth. Hopefully soon since the UN has finally designated them as a terrorist group.

[Awaymag]

Wow....Admin, is there a feature to hid threads/topics?

[The Prophet]

1 minute ago, Khalidao said:

 

And this is a barbaric group who needs to be eradicated off the face of the earth. Hopefully soon since the UN has finally designated them as a terrorist group.

 

Putin would say the same regarding Ukrainian Nazis.

[Khalidao]

Just now, The Prophet said:

 

Putin would say the same regarding Ukrainian Nazis.

 

The UN council isn't Putin though is it?

 

Basically, Houthis now are in the same category as ISIS.

[The Prophet]

2 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

The UN council isn't Putin though is it?

 

Basically, Houthis now are in the same category as ISIS.

 

Spin it whatever you want, the starvation of millions of innocent civilians is vile behaviour.

[Guest HTT II]

Sadly in war, innocent people get caught in the crossfire. When we were up against it with Nazi Germany which was a legit war and a war we had every right to enter into and engage in, we used tactics to prevent resources getting to Germany like food, medicine and other stuff, and they did the same to us. Which had severe consequences to the civilian populations. Today, if any nation has a legitimate reason to go to war (I say legitimate, fucking hell it’s the 21st century, there should never ever be war) then there needs to be a way to reduce the impact of war on the civilian population. 

[Yorkie]

There is a valid discussion being had here from what I can see but this topic probably isn't the most appropriate place. 

 

Here is the Saudi thread in General Chat, if yous are areet transferring this to over there:

 

 

24 minutes ago, Awaymag said:

Wow....Admin, is there a feature to hid threads/topics? 

 

Yep, it's the "don't open the thread" feature which I've checked and you have access to. 

[Rompe]

48 minutes ago, Khalidao said:

 

Imagine a radical Islamic militia in Norway took over the government and decided to sail over the North Sea and add Newcastle to their land by force. UK pushing them out and they start sending missiles killing civilians in Newcastle. How'd the UK government and public respond?

 

Also, Saudi didn't "invade" Yemen like Russia did in Ukraine. Saudi started by fighting the Houthi militia on the border and north of Yemen and later helping normal Yemenis in the south fight for their liberation from Houthis.

 

All of this is well-documented but not really highlighted by Western media when they talk about the war in Yemen. The pushed narrative is only "Saudi is bombing Yemenis".

Oh, so the Saudis are actually the good guys? How convenient for us fans

[The Prophet]

Wrong thread, so I'll draw a line under this here.

 

My point was that I'm uncomfortable making a song and dance about Ukraine, while the chaps that own 80% of our club are responsible for the bombing and starvation of millions of innocent civilians in Yemen.

 

Everyone has their own moral compass, but it just doesn't sit right for me. I feel that we should stand strong with both Ukraine and Yemen, but we won't because sportswahing works.

[Awaymag]

4 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

Wrong thread, so I'll draw a line under this here.

 

My point was that I'm uncomfortable making a song and dance about Ukraine, while the chaps that own 80% of our club are responsible for the bombing and starvation of millions of innocent civilians in Yemen.

 

Everyone has their own moral compass, but it just doesn't sit right for me. I feel that we should stand strong with both Ukraine and Yemen, but we won't because sportswahing works.

If wood scores tomorrow I will definitely be sportsWahing tomorrow

[Guest HTT II]

13 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

Wrong thread, so I'll draw a line under this here.

 

My point was that I'm uncomfortable making a song and dance about Ukraine, while the chaps that own 80% of our club are responsible for the bombing and starvation of millions of innocent civilians in Yemen.

 

Everyone has their own moral compass, but it just doesn't sit right for me. I feel that we should stand strong with both Ukraine and Yemen, but we won't because sportswahing works.

No-one gave two fucks about Yemen before we were taken over, if anything people now care, or rather have a think about this sort of stuff since the takeover, mostly it’s fake outrage sadly and point scoring and more about self interest. LFC fans now only ‘care’ for example because we are now a threat to them. The mackems now only ‘care’ because they know it will end in their rivals being better off.
 

No-one gave a fuck about Abramovic’s links to Putin until now, or that Everton guy, again, it’s mostly fake outrage. It’s our governments, leaders and people in power we should be outraged at and outraged about all wars or human atrocities.
 

We are all morally bankrupt though and at least if not, complicit in the evils, ills, malaise and bad things in this world of ours. We happily support a football team owned by a barbaric regime, we happily allow the likes of Boris into power, we happily buy expensive designer clothes made in sweat shops and we happily choose sides in conflicts that suit our own interests.

 

Sportswashimg doesn’t exist, well it does, but only as an idea, PIF owning NUFC doesn’t have any bearing on the ordinary population at all, either back in their own country or here, it does politically and financially, however, and that’s why they buy the likes of NUFC and why the powers that be allow it. It benefits a few, not the majority. Financially and politically.

 

Sportswashing is a term used to best describe fake outrage. Look at that ‘reporter’ asking Howe about his thoughts, fine ask, but if you were really unhappy and had issues, ask the very fucking people doing the crimes against humanity not some football manager doing his job and a job he’s doing for the right reasons and for a real purpose. What is the purpose of war, of making people suffer, of amassing untold riches one can’t fully ever spend?

 

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by HTT II

[The Prophet]

11 minutes ago, HTT II said:

No-one gave two fucks about Yemen before we were taken over, if anything people now care, or rather have a think about this sort of stuff since the takeover, mostly it’s fake outrage sadly and point scoring and more about self interest. LFC fans now only ‘care’ for example because we are now a threat to them. The mackems now only ‘care’ because they know it will end in their rivals being better off.
 

No-one gave a fuck about Abramovic’s links to Putin until now, or that Everton guy, again, it’s mostly fake outrage. It’s our governments, leaders and people in power we should be outraged at and outraged about all wars or human atrocities.
 

We are all morally bankrupt though and at least if not, complicit in the evils, ills, malaise and bad things in this world of ours. We happily support a football team owned by a barbaric regime, we happily allow the likes of Boris into power, we happily buy expensive designer clothes made in sweat shops and we happily choose sides in conflicts that suit our own interests.

 

Sportswashimg doesn’t exist, well it does, but only as an idea, PIF owning NUFC doesn’t have any bearing on the ordinary population at all, either back in their own country or here, it does politically and financially, however, and that’s why they buy the likes of NUFC and why the powers that be allow it. It benefits a few, not the majority. Financially and politically.

 

Sportswashing is a term used to best describe fake outrage. Look at that ‘reporter’ asking Howe about his thoughts, fine ask, but if you were really unhappy and had issues, ask the very fucking people doing the crimes against humanity not some football manager doing his job and a job he’s doing for the right reasons and for a real purpose. What is the purpose of war, of making people suffer, of amassing untold riches one can’t fully ever spend?

 

 

 

 

You're right it's not on us as football fans, I'm not saying that at all. What I'm saying is a show of support for Ukraine, while Yemen is blockaded, is bad optics at best.

[Guest HTT II]

3 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

You're right it's not on us as football fans, I'm not saying that at all. What I'm saying is a show of support for Ukraine, while Yemen is blockaded, is bad optics at best.

It is, and kind of hypocritical, especially from all those companies, governments and people in power whose fake outrage at the Ukraine situation are all involved or part of the ills going on all over the world. I highly doubt the likes of Boris give a shit about Ukraine or it’s people. Same with Apple or the banks etc. And yet I’m happy for them to ‘cancel’ Russia. It’s fucked up all of it. We are fucked up, all of us.

 

 

Edited March 4, 2022 by HTT II

[Yassassin]

2 hours ago, Khalidao said:

 

Imagine a radical Islamic militia in Norway took over the government and decided to sail over the North Sea and add Newcastle to their land by force. UK pushing them out and they start sending missiles killing civilians in Newcastle. How'd the UK government and public respond?

 

Also, Saudi didn't "invade" Yemen like Russia did in Ukraine. Saudi started by fighting the Houthi militia on the border and north of Yemen and later helping normal Yemenis in the south fight for their liberation from Houthis.

 

All of this is well-documented but not really highlighted by Western media when they talk about the war in Yemen. The pushed narrative is only "Saudi is bombing Yemenis".

There’s no doubt that the causes of the two wars do not have equivalence but bombing civilians in both wars does have equivalence and should be condemned, unhesitatingly