buzza Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Aye, it is obvious that we are nowhere near the levels we achieved last season. BUT... THIS IS A MARATHON, NOT A SPRINT!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 23 minutes ago, KaKa said: I think it's because it is completely overstated. We have played some very good teams to start the season. We are also integrating Gordon and Tonali into two key positions for us last season. The left sided Joelinton and Willock combination was key, as was the right sided Longstaff, Almiron and Trippier trio. These are now no more. On top of this teams are now going to show us a lot more respect due to what we achieved last season and will be far more prepared and up for facing us. We are also now missing key players from last year in Joelinton and Willock. There is no acknowledgement of any of these factors and the impact they have had, or any understanding or patience for the fact that these can only be worked through with the team getting more reps to continue to build back up to where we were, along with getting missing players back as the squad depth is still not the strongest. Instead now players are not good enough, the manager is not tactical enough, things will have to change or players will leave. I don't even understand why some of you even bother following the team, as it seems so incredibly unenjoyable. Would be so much easier to just pick a team where everything is already perfect and enjoy following them instead. So from your post, you agree with mine or nah? Can’t be bothered responding to the strawmans Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 14 hours ago, Yorkie said: The fact that that's weapons-grade horseshit is the main issue. It wasn't even close to 'really poor'. Disjointed and ineffective going forward I'll give you but there was plenty to like about the performance. We were incredibly dogged, kept our emotions and mentality in check, strong at the back (with some good fortune) and had spells where we were in total control of the match. We also had a knack of winning possession back quickly after losing it and were very effective at buying time, either through winning fouls or just keeping possession - not a bad tactic at the San Siro. That's before we get onto the various brilliant individual performances. There are some tactical issues atm, I would totally agree with that. But criticism to that degree is just plain wrong. We wouldn't have got out of there with a point if we were really poor/awful/whatever. Can we compromise on the notion that we’ve looked ineffective in possession in most games so far this season? Last night we were poor with the ball. Last season’s success was largely based on winning the ball deep in the opposition half. Purely based on the eye test I don’t see us doing that much this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCormick Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) I think it’s fair to express the opinion that we didn’t show the best version of ourselves on the night but still be relatively happy to salvage a point at the San Siro. I don’t think this Milan team are anything special although -based on our performances this season (granted against some top competition) - neither are we . Edited September 20, 2023 by McCormick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 5 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said: Can we compromise on the notion that we’ve looked ineffective in possession in most games so far this season? Last night we were poor with the ball. Last season’s success was largely based on winning the ball deep in the opposition half. Purely based on the eye test I don’t see us doing that much this season. I don't think there's anything controversial about that at all. What I take issue with is people saying we were really poor or awful or shite or anything like that, cos we simply weren't. Compared to 6-1 vs Spurs maybe, aye. Compared to games in the not distant past where we were actually really poor, definitely not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 These were exactly the same conversations being had after Bournemouth last year. It's fair to say we've looked disjointed as an attacking unit, but there's quite a few mitigating circumstances in terms of injuries, personnel changes and the difficulty of the fixtures. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 20 minutes ago, r0cafella said: So from your post, you agree with mine or nah? Can’t be bothered responding to the strawmans You can just ignore the post then, if you didn't understand it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Just now, KaKa said: You can just ignore the post then, if you didn't understand it. Understood it perfectly fine, the issue was it was your usual ramble against something that wasn’t overwhelming positive as per usual with you. If you believe our attacking performances have been fine fair play Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 minute ago, The Prophet said: These were exactly the same conversations being had after Bournemouth last year. It's fair to say we've looked disjointed as an attacking unit, but there's quite a few mitigating circumstances in terms of injuries, personnel changes and the difficulty of the fixtures. Total faith in Eddie to find the answers, he has done it over and over. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 minute ago, The Prophet said: These were exactly the same conversations being had after Bournemouth last year. It's fair to say we've looked disjointed as an attacking unit, but there's quite a few mitigating circumstances in terms of injuries, personnel changes and the difficulty of the fixtures. I really don't know why this is so difficult to understand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Just now, Dr Venkman said: Total faith in Eddie to find the answers, he has done it over and over. Absolutely, I’m sure he will figure it out our recruitment this summer has made his job harder in the short term but I’m sure it will look canny in the future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, Yorkie said: I don't think there's anything controversial about that at all. What I take issue with is people saying we were really poor or awful or shite or anything like that, cos we simply weren't. Compared to 6-1 vs Spurs maybe, aye. Compared to games in the not distant past where we were actually really poor, definitely not. The only thing I’d add to my comments about being poor in possession is that we look very susceptible to a ball played through our midfield to a player between our midfield and defence. It seems to happen a few times in every game and I thought he would have fixed it by now. Plenty of good performances last night but as a team we don’t look defensively solid IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 1 minute ago, r0cafella said: Understood it perfectly fine, the issue was it was your usual ramble against something that wasn’t overwhelming positive as per usual with you. If you believe our attacking performances have been fine fair play So you didn't understand it then Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Just now, Dr Venkman said: The only thing I’d add to my comments about being poor in possession is that we look very susceptible to a ball played through our midfield to a player between our midfield and defence. It seems to happen a few times in every game and I thought he would have fixed it by now. Plenty of good performances last night but as a team we don’t look defensively solid IMO. Yeah definitely; it was the same against Brighton. This appears to be a new problem too, not something that happened much last season that I recall. I don't know if it's midfield shape or CBs being deeper, or what. However, two clean sheets on the bounce indicates some solidity. Probably not sustainable though given this tactical issue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackyboy Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 We miss having the 2 Joe's bossing the midfield and seem to be struggling to find a balance. As said by someone earlier, we are in the process of integrating Tonali and Gordon into our system. Personally, I would like to see Gordon tuck in a bit rather than being glued to the line so much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Yeah definitely; it was the same against Brighton. This appears to be a new problem too, not something that happened much last season that I recall. I don't know if it's midfield shape or CBs being deeper, or what. However, two clean sheets on the bounce indicates some solidity. Probably not sustainable though given this tactical issue. Teams are starting to invert a fullback against us to create a central overload. They’ve studied how we press and this is the counter I suppose. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Just now, r0cafella said: Teams are starting to invert a fullback against us to create a central overload. They’ve studied how we press and this is the counter I suppose. Interesting observation. will keep an eye out for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Displayname Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 2 hours ago, jigen said: Great tactician but a coach should never make the transfer market. He make it and this year your market is average at best and very expensive. Yes lets judge his ability in the transfer market on the players who has played 0-6 games for us and not those that made us qualify for the CL last year. Botman, Bruno, Pope, Isak, Burn etc has all turned out to be excellent signings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzza Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 15 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said: The only thing I’d add to my comments about being poor in possession is that we look very susceptible to a ball played through our midfield to a player between our midfield and defence. It seems to happen a few times in every game and I thought he would have fixed it by now. Plenty of good performances last night but as a team we don’t look defensively solid IMO. Agree 100% on this. We are fixated on closing passing lines and we sometimes forget about pressuring the man with the ball. Good attackers find the spaces to receive the passes... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, jackyboy said: We miss having the 2 Joe's bossing the midfield and seem to be struggling to find a balance. As said by someone earlier, we are in the process of integrating Tonali and Gordon into our system. Personally, I would like to see Gordon tuck in a bit rather than being glued to the line so much. Last season, with Burn at left back, serving mainly as a defensive stopper, the overlap for the winger cutting in on the left came from Willock playing at LCM. Missing this element has affected a lot of our most effective build up and attacking play. On the right side having Longstaff and Miggy's defensive support allowed Trippier far more offensive freedom, which allowed him to be one of the highest chance creators in our open play. All these partnerships are gone for the mean time, and new ones are being worked on and established. Reading through match threads, people continue to state that things have changed and they don't understand why, with a heavy element of panic and bed wetting. Seems pretty clear as to why things aren't quite clicking yet to me. Edited September 20, 2023 by KaKa Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagten Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 3 minutes ago, Displayname said: Yes lets judge his ability in the transfer market on the players who has played 0-6 games for us and not those that made us qualify for the CL last year. Botman, Bruno, Pope, Isak, Burn etc has all turned out to be excellent signings. Legit but extremely early question to ask whether as his influence has grown (and they appointed his brother in senior scouting position) talent ID has got a bit worse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDT Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 Before last weekend's Derby this Milan team had started the season very well, I think it's more of a case of the Inter game being the anomaly rather than norm. As people have mentioned away wins in the Champions League are at a premium & we were the only pot 4 team to take a point last night. We didn't play very well but apart from that barrage of 10-20 minutes in the first half it looked like 2 pretty evenly matched teams. I don't think anyone can be disappointed with an away point in Europe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 9 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said: Total faith in Eddie to find the answers, he has done it over and over. 100%. That's why it doesn't bother me too much. The creativity problems are being overstated, but the attack does look incoherent at times. I have every faith we'll overcome that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coffee_Johnny Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 2 hours ago, Wilson said: That doesn't equate to 'should have been comfortably beaten' in my book. Feel like you're doing the lads an injustice by suggesting it tbh. We were worth the point. 25 shots to 6; 9 on target to 1. Come on, man. We were beaten 3-1 by Brighton and the shots totals were 15 to 9 (6 to 2 on target). Great CL result for us but we definitely had the rub of the green. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted September 20, 2023 Share Posted September 20, 2023 You get no credit for a solid rearguard action these days? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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