Eddie Howe

[Kid Icarus]

7 minutes ago, Sir Joel Inton said:

 

If Howe wasn’t planning for Isak to go long before he did, he’s failed himself. 

 

 

Howay

 

I did have some issue with Howe’s methods when we were successful. I think his limitations we see now were present there too.

 

What would cause you to change your position on Howe? I saw one ridiculous comment that someone would be okay if he relegated us. At what point this season does Howe take the blame rather than the summer?

Saying Howay isn't an argument.

 

I don't believe you on having an issue with Howe's methods when we were winning. Like everyone else I would imagine you accepted them, at worst warts and all. Just being honest.

 

I basically won't change my stance on Howe unless it gets into hypothetical fantasy territory or it's clear that he's had enough.

 

 

Edited December 27, 2025 by Kid Icarus

[Ghandis Flip-Flop]

23 minutes ago, Gawalls said:

Then after this post I'll stop posting after negative as well, to be honest mentioned this once and don't want to do it again but step daughter died not so long ago and football forums aren't that high up in my worries where my head is at. Don't need this shit 

Well obviously I’m sorry to hear that and that would be a justifiable reason to be angry and negative at the world in general. As you’ve already Identified maybe combative football forums aren’t the best place to frequent when you’re in your current headspace. I’m genuinely sorry that Newcastle United continue to do what they do best and continue to add to all of our collective anguish.

 

Hope you’re able to process what you’ve been through recently and that you and your family come out the other side in the best place possible.

[Sir Joel Inton]

Fwiw if we won a cup (FA or Carabao) and finished deep into the CL, I would probably accept finishing midtable. The key issue for me is European qualification year on year. A year in the Europa League would not be too bad and consistent European football will help us grow.

 

We’d also make up the loss in PL prize money through CL progression.

 

Conference League is a bit of a nightmare as it doesn’t offer a route into the CL but it does offer a realistic chance of a European trophy.

 

However, I’ve got zero confidence we could put all our eggs into this basket as Spurs did last season. We used to thrive off big games, but when you look at how we turned up (or didn’t) at Sunderland and others, I have little confidence we would turn up at Wembley.

[Sir Joel Inton]

1 minute ago, Kid Icarus said:

Saying Howay isn't an argument.

 

I don't believe you on having an issue with Howe's methods when we were winning. Like everyone else I would imagine you accepted them, at worst warts and all. Just being honest.

 

I basically won't change my stance on Howe unless it gets into hypothetical fantasy territory or it's clear that he's had enough.

 

 

 

 

I think that’s fairly clear it’s a pointless discussion, if you openly accept your view is a closed one unwilling to accept or learn from what is playing out in front of you.

[Kid Icarus]

5 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

Can't be fucked going through the atheletics archive but I do recall reading it was ran past him. 

More standard process for that sort of situation then, rather than him having an active hand in him bring hired?

[r0cafella]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

More standard process for that sort of situation then, rather than him having an active hand in him bring hired?

Hmmm not where I work it isn't. Was your boss ran by you before he was hired? Sincere question. 

[Sir Joel Inton]

5 minutes ago, Heron said:

I totally get business continuity planning but if you're being told something is specifically not going to happen and then all your alternatives might happen and don't then it's not really Howes fault.

 

Internally it was very much accepted that Isak would leave. 

 

But regardless, you can’t not have a Plan B as a PL/elite manager. You cannot write off a whole season because one player was sold who was actively pushing for a move since the end of last season.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

4 hours ago, RS said:

He’s successfully transitioning the team away from the high press, high octane approach that made us so effective into a submissive set up that invites pressure onto the defence whilst offering nothing in midfield and limited attacking threat. All to supposedly minimise injuries. 
 

Id rather we revert to our original M.O and take the injury risk than suffer a full season of turgid, ineffectual football. 
 

It’s probably not just to minimise injuries TBH, it’s equally because it’s physically impossible to perform with that intensity every 3-4 days. 

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, Sir Joel Inton said:

 

I think that’s fairly clear it’s a pointless discussion, if you openly accept your view is a closed one unwilling to accept or learn from what is playing out in front of you.

My view on Howe is based on the 5 years and more of evidence we have. I'm not really open to changing view on him when I think you'd need to ignore that evidence to get there.

[The Prophet]

Howe is reliant on training ground coaching, player relationships and ingrained patterns of play to get the very best out the attack. 

 

It was another summer of chaos caused by a lack of executive structure. The issue of Isak and his replacement dragged on until the eleventh hour, when the season had begun. It's then been three games a week, almost every week. He's had no time on the training ground with a new look attack.

 

Problem solving in a packed schedule is something that Howe will need to develop, but even Pep struggled with it last season and Klopp the season before that , before they were able to dip into the transfer market. I think when the schedule reduced we'll see a marked improvement in our attacking play though. At the moment it's all a bit messy.

[Cf]

2 minutes ago, Sir Joel Inton said:

Fwiw if we won a cup (FA or Carabao) and finished deep into the CL, I would probably accept finishing midtable. 

 

Let's say this did happen. Mid table in the league and through to the FA Cup final. 

 

It goes to penalties. 

 

If we win the shootout European football awaits and a possible 2nd route into the CL. 

 

If we lose then we get nothing and miss out on Europe. 

 

I'd wager that most people would say under scenario a) that Howe has done a good job, and under b) that Howe has done a bad job. 

 

I'd argue that despite the final result he's done the exact same job in both cases.

 

People say it's a results based business but sometimes you have to look past the results when evaluating is someone the right fit. 

 

See also Ange quite rightly getting the boot from Spurs despite winning the EL. 

[r0cafella]

Just now, The Prophet said:

Howe is reliant on training ground coaching, player relationships and ingrained patterns of play to get the very best out the attack. 

 

It was another summer of chaos caused by a lack of executive structure. The issue of Isak and his replacement dragged on until the eleventh hour, when the season had begun. It's then been three games a week, almost every week. He's had no time on the training ground with a new look attack.

 

Problem solving in a packed schedule is something that Howe will need to develop, but even Pep struggled with it last season and Klopp the season before that , before they were able to dip into the transfer market. I think when the schedule reduced we'll see a marked improvement in our attacking play though. At the moment it's all a bit messy.

I see this summer of chaos thing quoted a lot, people citing it as the factor for our poor start but I'm really curious to hear what would be different if we had Ross Wilson this summer? I mean time will tell but I don't think it say keeps Isak (he wanted out regardless imo) or convinced any of those missed targets to join us. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

One thing I would like to see is subs that change the approach in some way rather than just like for like changing the players. 
 

Like last night, move Gordon right, leave Woltemade on instead of Joey coming on and play Wissa ahead of him. Barnes on the left where he’s dangerous. 
 

TBF to Man U they did work hard to defend their box and any team would find that hard to break down. 

[Sir Joel Inton]

5 minutes ago, Cf said:

 

Let's say this did happen. Mid table in the league and through to the FA Cup final. 

 

It goes to penalties. 

 

If we win the shootout European football awaits and a possible 2nd route into the CL. 

 

If we lose then we get nothing and miss out on Europe. 

 

I'd wager that most people would say under scenario a) that Howe has done a good job, and under b) that Howe has done a bad job. 

 

I'd argue that despite the final result he's done the exact same job in both cases.

 

People say it's a results based business but sometimes you have to look past the results when evaluating is someone the right fit. 

 

See also Ange quite rightly getting the boot from Spurs despite winning the EL. 

 

Well that is a fair assessment. If he put our entire season onto a one off game due to his failings in the league, his performance will undoubtedly be reviewed on that outcome.

 

It’s a bit like saying if Aston Villa score the goal last season, people would have had different opinions on whether the season was a Grade A or B success due to CL qualification. Of course they would, as the outcome determines the performance.

He also wouldn’t have done the exact same job in both cases with your example as one would be qualification for Europe and the other wouldn’t. The very point I explained is my barometer for success with us at the moment.

 

 

Edited December 27, 2025 by Sir Joel Inton

[Yorkie]

9 minutes ago, Sir Joel Inton said:

Fwiw if we won a cup (FA or Carabao) and finished deep into the CL, I would probably accept finishing midtable.

 

If, for the first time since the 1950s, we defended a trophy - you'd probably accept a league campaign where we didn't pull up any trees but were competitive and comfortable? Sounds like your expectations are very grounded.

[Kid Icarus]

3 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

Hmmm not where I work it isn't. Was your boss ran by you before he was hired? Sincere question. 

 

She was yeah. Quite often one of us is on the interview panel for senior roles as well. Everywhere is different, but there's also a big difference between running it by me and me actively getting someone hired though, which I think was the insinuation.

 

Do you think Man City or Liverpool under Klopp would hire a DoF without including the manager in discussions? Us getting Mitchell without involving Howe and without letting him know until it had happened strikes me as much more unusual, especially based on Howe's reaction to it.

[Sir Joel Inton]

2 minutes ago, Yorkie said:

 

If, for the first time since the 1950s, we defended a trophy - you'd probably accept a league campaign where we didn't pull up any trees but were competitive and comfortable? Sounds like your expectations are very grounded.

Well, yes. As the alternative would be finishing 12th with no silverware. Is that a good season for us? Would that have been a good season for us pre-Ashley?

 

If we were competitive and finished 6th, qualifying for Europe but went out of all cups early, I’d be okay with that too.

 

 

Edited December 27, 2025 by Sir Joel Inton

[andycap]

He had the squad training getting ready for man united for six days, we didn't look any better at all from our previous away games this year.  

[Yorkie]

1 minute ago, Sir Joel Inton said:

Well, yes. As the alternative would be finishing 12th with no silverware. Is that a good season for us? Would that have been a good season for us pre-Ashley?

 

... No? But if we win a trophy it would be magnificent.  

 

I'm here for trophies, like. 

[r0cafella]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

 

She was yeah. Quite often one of us is on the interview panel for senior roles as well. Everywhere is different, but there's also a big difference between running it by me and me actively getting someone hired though, which I think was the insinuation.

 

Do you think Man City or Liverpool under Klopp would hire a DoF without including the manager in discussions? Us getting Mitchell without involving Howe and without letting him know until it had happened strikes me as much more unusual, especially based on Howe's reaction to it.

Interesting, maybe I've been in Asia too long and it isn't a thing here. Klopp fell out consistently with the Liverpool transfer committee but when he was appointed the manager led recruitment model was in its dying days. Today it's totally dead. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but we only knew Howes reaction after Mitchell opened his mouth. 

[Sibierski]

3 minutes ago, andycap said:

He had the squad training getting ready for man united for six days, we didn't look any better at all from our previous away games this year.  

Training ground myth needs to get in the bin. It was mentioned last season, and the times we had more time between games, produced some of our poorer performances (same season before). There was no solid evidence that more time = better performances. It was up and down as it is this season.

 

The only thing the breaks between games have at our best, was being able to roll out same XI and play the same high octane football. But as shown again last night, teams are happy to just sit off, concede all possession and know we will struggle to break them down. Opposition are happy to play different for one game, even if it’s not pretty, because they know it’s effective against us.

[Cf]

6 minutes ago, Sir Joel Inton said:

 

Well that is a fair assessment. If he put our entire season onto a one off game due to his failings in the league, his performance will undoubtedly be reviewed on that outcome.

 

It’s a bit like saying if Aston Villa score the goal last season, people would have had different opinions on whether the season was a Grade A or B success due to CL qualification. Of course they would, as the outcome determines the performance.

He also wouldn’t have done the exact same job in both cases with your example as one would be qualification for Europe and the other wouldn’t. The very point I explained is my barometer for success with us at the moment.

 

 

 

 

But he's not the one taking the penalties. Maybe he chooses the right takers, does the necessary research, but on the day the opposition keeper chooses to dive left instead of right like he usually does. Or our best penalty taker hits the woodwork. Whatever. 

 

The point is whilst obviously the manager is a highly influential role they're ultimately not fully in control of what happens on the pitch. They can set things up the best they can (like the opposition manager will be trying to do) and at that point sometimes all you can do is see how the chips fall. 

 

In that sense I'm not worried. There's an argument that we've been a little stand back at times and lost our aggressive bit but I'll put that down to the sheer volume of fixtures and trying to manage fitness. And outside one or two games I don't think the performances have been bad. We're just not having the chips fall for us. It happens. 

[Cf]

9 minutes ago, andycap said:

He had the squad training getting ready for man united for six days, we didn't look any better at all from our previous away games this year.  

 

Did I imagine the bit where we had Man Utd pinned back in their own half for the majority of the game at Old Trafford. 

 

Granted we lacked the finishing touch but I'd say in terms of overall performance/game flow that was very different to other away games this year. 

[gbandit]

20 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

Howe is reliant on training ground coaching, player relationships and ingrained patterns of play to get the very best out the attack. 

 

It was another summer of chaos caused by a lack of executive structure. The issue of Isak and his replacement dragged on until the eleventh hour, when the season had begun. It's then been three games a week, almost every week. He's had no time on the training ground with a new look attack.

 

Problem solving in a packed schedule is something that Howe will need to develop, but even Pep struggled with it last season and Klopp the season before that , before they were able to dip into the transfer market. I think when the schedule reduced we'll see a marked improvement in our attacking play though. At the moment it's all a bit messy.

An excellent post

[Kid Icarus]

3 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

Interesting, maybe I've been in Asia too long and it isn't a thing here. Klopp fell out consistently with the Liverpool transfer committee but when he was appointed the manager led recruitment model was in its dying days. Today it's totally dead. Also correct me if I'm wrong, but we only knew Howes reaction after Mitchell opened his mouth. 

Klopp and Edwards did often disagree, there's loads of examples of it, but Klopp came in before Edwards and I'd be stunned if Edwards was brought in without Klopp being in the loop and being given the opportunity to give his two penneth.

 

I don't think Howe would have reacted like he did in that interview without Mitchell doing that car crash one first, but it was widely reported that Mitchell was hired without Howe being part of any discussions or even being in the loop until it had happened, and Howe's interview definitely pointed towards that being a problem - "as long as I'm happy and left to do what I do" or whatever it was.

 

It was a braindead move by Eales really. No idea what he was thinking. With hindsight it looks like a power move with a terrible hire who everyone immediately disliked.