Eddie Howe

[La Parka]

Working harder only works if the trajectory is correct. Without correcting course it will achieve nothing more than wasted efforts. 

[Si67]

8 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I don’t remember signing up to it as a statement - I’ve never thought it was a good idea for anyone to make statements on behalf of the fanbase, and people are then held to it like it’s a fucking contract.  One of the many things Wor Flags has got right is avoiding statements of this type. 

We wanted a team that tries at the time. Everything moves on and it is quite okay to want something different now.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Everyone wants a team that wins and always did. The point of that slogan was to remember how horrific our club was and to not become entitled. 

[Kid Icarus]

I was under the impression that the slogan 'We don't demand a team that wins, we demand a club that tries' was a fairly self explanatory principle tbh. 

 

 

Edited April 21 by Kid Icarus

[Kid Icarus]

Open question, do we actually have any enduring principles then? Or do some of you just view the fanbase as a collective of individuals with nothing that can be universally co-signed on?

 

The 'what is a club in any case?' one maybe?

[bobbydazzla]

We seem to put a lot of emphasis on being "the loyalest football supporters the world has ever had*"

 

(*Apart from on 35 mins when slurping a pint and guzzling some chicken dippers on the concourse is more important than supporting the players on the pitch).

[Kilcline]

3 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said:

We seem to put a lot of emphasis on being "the loyalest football supporters the world has ever had*"

 

(*Apart from on 35 mins when slurping a pint and guzzling some chicken dippers on the concourse is more important than supporting the players on the pitch).

For we are mental, for we are mad(ri) 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

7 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said:

We seem to put a lot of emphasis on being "the loyalest football supporters the world has ever had*"

 

(*Apart from on 35 mins when slurping a pint and guzzling some chicken dippers on the concourse is more important than supporting the players on the pitch).

 

I find the chicken really funny for some reason, can't explain 

[TheBrownBottle]

1 hour ago, Wallsendmag said:

 

He supports Eddie Howe over Newcastle United. That's fair enough but the club is always above any individual in my eyes and that even extends to Kevin Keegan who is basically God to me.

I also think that the constant pointing to the examples of KK and Robson is quite the ‘gotcha’ he thinks tbh.

 

KK said in his autobiography that he was burned out and offered to go at the end of 95/96.  He offered again after Blackburn on Boxing Day 1996 (I was there with my dad - it was fucking dire).  Then he offered to go at the end of the season - which was agreed, until a rug-pull due to the proposed floatation.  After almost five years on the NUFC rollercoaster, and a top man and top manager - a club legend - was absolutely spent, needing a break from football.  Sounds familiar. 
 

Robson was also a success - two CL-qualifying spot finishes, some great matches and players.  But after almost five years, the performances had started to turn and eventually to nose-dive - after a summer chasing unrealistic targets which didn’t materialise, some really poor signings, and a dressing room which had stopped listening, time was up for him too.  Sounds familiar, again. 
 

The lesson from KK and Robson isn’t that club legends should be in the seat forever (and Howe is up there with them), it’s that you have to make sure you get the next appointment right.

[TheBrownBottle]

27 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

I was under the impression that the slogan 'We don't demand a team that wins, we demand a club that tries' was a fairly self explanatory principle tbh. 

 

 

 

It isn’t - because we absolutely do demand a team that wins; the issue is how often it wins.  Losing every week with  unquestionable effort won’t please a single support in the country, and we’re not an outlier on that.  It can be read any way a person wishes to - that’s where the demanding / delusional stuff comes in.

 

Expectation of what results look like is completely linked to investment in the squad, not history.   I think it’s a reasonable ‘demand’ that a team whose bench cost more than half the squads the PL isn’t sat in a league position which is lower than Steve Bruce managed.  I would ‘demand’ that they look better and win more regularly than one managed by the shittest manager in our history managed with a squad assembled on a relative shoestring. 

 

 

Edited April 21 by TheBrownBottle

[Kid Icarus]

5 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I also think that the constant pointing to the examples of KK and Robson is quite the ‘gotcha’ he thinks tbh.

 

KK said in his autobiography that he was burned out and offered to go at the end of 95/96.  He offered again after Blackburn on Boxing Day 1996 (I was there with my dad - it was fucking dire).  Then he offered to go at the end of the season - which was agreed, until a rug-pull due to the proposed floatation.  After almost five years on the NUFC rollercoaster, and a top man and top manager - a club legend - was absolutely spent, needing a break from football.  Sounds familiar. 
 

Robson was also a success - two CL-qualifying spot finishes, some great matches and players.  But after almost five years, the performances had started to turn and eventually to nose-dive - after a summer chasing unrealistic targets which didn’t materialise, some really poor signings, and a dressing room which had stopped listening, time was up for him too.  Sounds familiar, again. 
 

The lesson from KK and Robson isn’t that club legends should be in the seat forever (and Howe is up there with them), it’s that you have to make sure you get the next appointment right.

 

The lesson is whatever you make of it. One man's 'we just need to get the replacement right this time' is another mans' 'maybe don't be an absolute cunt about the current legend that's our manager'

[TheBrownBottle]

41 minutes ago, Si67 said:

We wanted a team that tries at the time. Everything moves on and it is quite okay to want something different now.

100%

[Shearergol]

The slogan was very specific to the Ashley era right? Haven't we moved on a bit since then?

[TheBrownBottle]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

 

The lesson is whatever you make of it. One man's 'we just need to get the replacement right this time' is another mans' 'maybe don't be an absolute cunt about the current legend that's our manager'

I don’t think thinking Howe’s time is up is being a cunt to him, though.  Just my perspective.  That doesn’t of course mean that I think abuse is ok. 

[Nucasol]

9 minutes ago, Kilcline said:

For we are mental, for we are mad(ri) 

We have the crispest chicken tenders,

the world has ever had…

 

[r0cafella]

Just now, Shearergol said:

The slogan was very specific to the Ashley era right? Haven't we moved on a bit since then?

No, we haven't.  

[Kid Icarus]

3 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

It isn’t - because we absolutely do demand a team that wins; the issue is how often it wins.  Losing every week with  unquestionable effort won’t please a single support in the country, and we’re not an outlier on that.  It can be read any way a person wishes to - that’s where the demanding / delusional stuff comes in.

 

Expectation of why results look like is completely linked to investment in the squad, not history.   I think it’s a reasonable ‘demand’ that a team whose bench cost more than half the squads the PL isn’t sat in a league position which is lower than Steve Bruce managed.  

It's as self explanatory as it gets. It covers what is demanded and what isn't demanded. You can disagree with it, say that it only applied at the time, but denying its meaning is something else entirely. 

 

 

Edited April 21 by Kid Icarus

[enthusiast]

42 minutes ago, Si67 said:

We wanted a team that tries at the time.

We wanted a club that tries: the distinction between what is/isn't demanded of the team vs. what is/isn't demanded of the club was the entire point of the slogan.

[TheBrownBottle]

Just now, Kid Icarus said:

It's as self explanatory as it gets. It covers what is demanded and what isn't demanded. You can disagree with it, but denying its meaning is something else entirely. 

Winning trophies?  Winning matches?  How many matches?  I’m not sure it is self explanatory.  I don’t demand a team that wins trophies - I demand a club that wants to win trophies.  But I absolutely do demand a team that wins. 
 

No-one would accept a team that doesn’t win. 

[Shearergol]

2 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

No, we haven't.  

 

Genuinely? You don't think the club has been trying since PIF bought us?

[r0cafella]

2 minutes ago, Shearergol said:

 

Genuinely? You don't think the club has been trying since PIF bought us?

I don't think as a fan base we have. As a club we evidently have ( in most areas). 

[Shearergol]

Just now, r0cafella said:

I don't think as a fan base we have. As a club we evidently have ( in most areas). 

 

Ahh ok, that wasn't really what I meant. I meant we do actually now have a club that tries, so now we want to see a team that wins

 

We're not unique in the footballing world though are we....

[Kid Icarus]

Just now, TheBrownBottle said:

Winning trophies?  Winning matches?  How many matches?  I’m not sure it is self explanatory.  I don’t demand a team that wins trophies - I demand a club that wants to win trophies.  But I absolutely do demand a team that wins. 
 

No-one would accept a team that doesn’t win. 

 

You're labouring something that's incredibly simple. We don't demand a team that wins, we demand a club that tries. Its simplicity and lack of grey area is why it was an effective message. 

 

Like I say, fair enough to say you disagree with it, fair enough to say that you think it no longer applies, but to deny its original meaning is getting into Jordon Peterson levels of 'what do you mean by "is" level over-analysis. IMHO anyway.

 

[r0cafella]

Just now, Shearergol said:

 

Ahh ok, that wasn't really what I meant. I meant we do actually now have a club that tries, so now we want to see a team that wins

 

We're not unique in the footballing world though are we....

Oh yeah my original response was a bit of a spin on yours. A flippant reflection of things are moving at different speeds in the NUFC Orbit  

 

Wanted to make it sound less cheesy but cba. 

[TRon]

2 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

I don't think as a fan base we have. As a club we evidently have ( in most areas). 

 

What's even more telling is that even if we have spent more than PSR dictated, no one was happy with poor results, i.e. a DOF who clashed with Howe, or not having a competent DOF in the first place. Even if the club tries, if it does so in a clueless manner, who will give them credit for that?

 

You need both at any level. Endeavour and competence. If you are missing one of those, whether at DOF or managerial level, you will come in for criticism.