Conjo Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 1 hour ago, Paullow said: It was kind of the opposite when I was growing up in the mid 90s - we finished 3rd, 6th, 2nd, 2nd, 13th, 13th, 11th, 11th, 4th, 3rd, 5th so an average finish of 6.6 over that 11 year period, plus back to back FA Cup finals against the league champions of that year in two of the lower midtable years, which meant European qualification pretty much every season, 18 CL group matches, UEFA Cup SF, 7 top 6 finishes, breaking world transfer records, signing some of the best young players around, massive crowds, whereas in that same period, they finished 15th, 7th, 8th, 10th, 14th, 11th, 10th, 12th, 9th, 10th, 14th, an average position of 10.9. They did win the League Cup in that time which earned them a very rare season in Europe in that period, where they lost in R2 of the UEFA Cup, and they also exited the Intertoto Cup early after that 7th place finish, but it was generally an unhappy time for their fans, their managers including Gross and Santini. I'd say we were generally similar in stature, but from like 8 years old to 18, growing up (and being less aware of previous years to 1993/4) I would have definitely considered us the bigger, higher profile club, but the past 20 years have been absolute night and day stuff, up until last year. Constantly in the top 4/6, Champions League regulars, new stadium, world class players, high profile managers, high media profile presence with the 'big 6', global brand, whereas we've had Ashley for 14 of them as you say, and they have massively differentiated themselves in terms of stature from the likes of us, Everton and Aston Villa, and any neutral under 30 would laugh if you compared the two, certainly before last season. So basically we were pretty good from 1993 to 2004, they were pretty poor in that same period, but polar opposites after that, and we signed Stephen Carr from them in August 2004, who ironically had been at Spurs since 1993 - it's like the clubs respective fortunes dramatically shifted straight after that one signing . 2004 - 2008 they ended above us, but with exception of 1 year not by more than 3 - 6 points if I screened through the years correctly. We were competing for many of the same players and they kept getting the key ones over us in that time period. Carrick & Berbatov notably. The shift in stature for me started for real when Modric went to Spurs over us in 2008 while we got Nacho Gonzales on deadline day instead. They replaced Carr with Noe Pamarot. Hardly someone you'd call an upgrade on Carr whom two seasons earlier had been named as the best right back in the league by his peers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paullow Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) 20 minutes ago, Conjo said: 2004 - 2008 they ended above us, but with exception of 1 year not by more than 3 - 6 points if I screened through the years correctly. We were competing for many of the same players and they kept getting the key ones over us in that time period. Carrick & Berbatov notably. The shift in stature for me started for real when Modric went to Spurs over us in 2008 while we got Nacho Gonzales on deadline day instead. They replaced Carr with Noe Pamarot. Hardly someone you'd call an upgrade on Carr whom two seasons earlier had been named as the best right back in the league by his peers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Newcastle_United_F.C._seasons https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Tottenham_Hotspur_F.C._seasons 2004/05 us 14th, them 9th 2005/06 us 7th (crazy Roeder run after sacking Souey), them 5th 2006/07 us 13th, them 5th 2007/08 us 12th, them 11th 2008/09 us 18th, them 8th It probably wasn't until 2009/10 and Redknapp when they fully pushed on and became a club regularly competing for CL places, but they did finish 5th twice under Jol the first of which being that food poisoning incident when Arsenal pipped them on the final day to take the final CL spot, which was significantly better than anything in the previous 12 years, and were starting to look like they were pushing on from the lower midtable side they constantly were during my childhood and all my teen years. And I wasn't seriously saying that singing Carr was the catalyst for both clubs respective forthcoming fortunes, just that ironically he had just missed the boat in terms of both ours and Spurs' good spell, and as a result, he basically had an entire career of bottom half / lower midtable football and frustrated fanbases. Edited October 24, 2023 by Paullow Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) 45 minutes ago, Conjo said: 2004 - 2008 they ended above us, but with exception of 1 year not by more than 3 - 6 points if I screened through the years correctly. We were competing for many of the same players and they kept getting the key ones over us in that time period. Carrick & Berbatov notably. The shift in stature for me started for real when Modric went to Spurs over us in 2008 while we got Nacho Gonzales on deadline day instead. They replaced Carr with Noe Pamarot. Hardly someone you'd call an upgrade on Carr whom two seasons earlier had been named as the best right back in the league by his peers. Did they? I remember they had Stephen Kelly - maybe they rotated At that time Spurs were building a young team, looking forward. The revolving door moment was us finishing 5th and not backing SBR or at least keeping the core of his approach. The summer we finished 5th, I think we signed Nicky Butt + Kluivert and they signed Michael Carrick + Mido. We would continue to sign players over the hill in the next 2-3 years until relegation. Kluivert, Carr, Geremi, Alan Smith, Babayaro etc. They would keep going the younger route landing the likes of Aaron Lennon, Berbatov and Modric. Edit: I'm wrong here about SPurs finishing positions. Edited October 24, 2023 by The College Dropout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Did they? I remember they had Stephen Kelly - maybe they rotated At that time Spurs were building a young team, looking forward. The revolving door moment was us finishing 5th and not backing SBR or at least keeping the core of his approach. The summer we finished 5th, I think we signed Nicky Butt + Kluivert and they signed Michael Carrick + Mido. We would continue to sign players over the hill in the next 2-3 years until relegation. Kluivert, Carr, Geremi, Alan Smith, Babayaro etc. They would keep going the younger route landing the likes of Aaron Lennon, Berbatov and Modric. Edit: I'm wrong here about SPurs finishing positions. Never higher than 7th top and never lower than 7th bottom between 1992 & 2005. For 13 years they were the meh-rist of the meh in terms of the Premier League. Only significant to London. Edited October 24, 2023 by Optimistic Nut Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Just now, Optimistic Nut said: Never higher than 7th top and never lower than 7th bottom between 1992 & 2007. For 15 years they were the meh-rist of the meh in terms of the Premier League. Only significant to London. That's the stat I was looking for—the middest of mid. The thing with Spurs is - it wasn't for a lack of trying. They had some great players during that spell but many of them passed their peaks. At least we had the decency to get relegated a couple of times to keep things spicy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conjo Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) 18 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Did they? I remember they had Stephen Kelly - maybe they rotated He got a nasty injury second half of the season but was playing more or less every minute of every game for them before that. Stephen Kelly took his spot rest of the season. Pamarot joined Redknapp at Portsmouth half a year later while Spurs brought in Paul Stalteri summer 2005. Edited October 24, 2023 by Conjo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 1 minute ago, The College Dropout said: That's the stat I was looking for—the middest of mid. The thing with Spurs is - it wasn't for a lack of trying. They had some great players during that spell but many of them passed their peaks. At least we had the decency to get relegated a couple of times to keep things spicy. Talking of punishments with the whole Tonali thing. 94/5 season they were handed a 12 points deduction and kicked out of the FA Cup. Of course, the FA let them off with just a heftier fine. Townsend while at Spurs got a 4 month ban for gambling offences, only difference I can see is he didn't bet on his own team. 3 of those 4 months were suspended too. The Toney and Tonali bans seem ridiculous. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erikse Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) Honestly I'm starting to think that needing more points than what we got last year for top 4 will become a reality. Tottenham is doing much better than I expected, and Villa can easily improve on last season without that Gerrard start. Liverpool is looking very strong aswell. I'm sure Tottenham wont last all season, but surely the will improve their tally from last season by quite a bit? Edited October 24, 2023 by Erikse Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 1 hour ago, Monters said: Not really - was genuinely puzzled at the two year ahead thing other than manager length of service yeah sorry, wasn’t clear enough - I was just looking at that cycle of new manager/team and transition periods. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 It seems a bit early to be discussing teams' potential points totals like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 45 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said: Never higher than 7th top and never lower than 7th bottom between 1992 & 2005. For 13 years they were the meh-rist of the meh in terms of the Premier League. Only significant to London. The key transition year for us was 2004. Santini Jol came in, Arnesen started as Director of Football (before Chelsea nicked him) and we cleared house on the pitch. A load of young players came in, then another load of young players. It was all about building from then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Oh yeah, one key change in the Premier League at that time was Abramovich. Suddenly there was a fucking ton of Russian oil money being pumped in, and Levy (among other chairmen) had to decide how to compete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixelphish Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 3 minutes ago, leffe186 said: Oh yeah, one key change in the Premier League at that time was Abramovich. Suddenly there was a fucking ton of Russian oil money being pumped in, and Levy (among other chairmen) had to decide how to compete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donut Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) Galatasary - Bayern has been very entertaining so far. Bayern took the lead and Gala has just missed an absolute sitter. Edited October 24, 2023 by Donut Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUFCDoog Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Cracking start to Galatasary/Bayern game, 1 nil Bayern but Gala have had 3 really good chances, good tempo and very attacking Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 damn bots Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 I've caught Galatasaray on TNT a few times now and it always seems to be entertaining. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Galatasaray have played well, unlucky not to be level Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donut Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Penalty to Galatasary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Pen to Galatasaray, not entirely convinced it should be Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Wow, what a pen from Icardi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maybe_next_year Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 So cheeky from Icardi, 1-1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 2 hours ago, Optimistic Nut said: Talking of punishments with the whole Tonali thing. 94/5 season they were handed a 12 points deduction and kicked out of the FA Cup. Of course, the FA let them off with just a heftier fine. Townsend while at Spurs got a 4 month ban for gambling offences, only difference I can see is he didn't bet on his own team. 3 of those 4 months were suspended too. The Toney and Tonali bans seem ridiculous. Big difference mind. 2 hours ago, The Prophet said: It seems a bit early to be discussing teams' potential points totals like. That's how I see teams in terms of possible points totals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Lovely Paneka penalty kick goal by Mauro Icardi for Galatasaray, Live on TNT Sports 1. Stream TNT Sports on discovery+ for only £20! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted October 24, 2023 Share Posted October 24, 2023 Does Sane not like Kane? He just won't pass to him Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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