Sandro Tonali

[et tu brute]

6 minutes ago, pormag said:

Ginola wasn't that good, he only scored 6 goals i think.

 

Ben Arfa was better but Robert was the best of the french left wingers for proper end product.

Load of shite, for a period of time until his sending off against Arsenal, his displays were better than any footballer (bar Tony Green) I have ever seen in a black and white shirt and I've been going since the 70s Supermac era. 

 

 

Edited June 26, 2023 by et tu brute

[Tiburon]

Ginola was sexy and so different (today I’d try and convert him into a Ronaldo type CF role, playing through the middle with his left and right foot capabilities), HBA was undoubtedly the most talented and exciting of all, Robert the most productive, but Sellars for me was the man! We’ve been blessed with talented wingers and wide players over the years on both flanks.

[pormag]

10 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

Load of shite, for a period of time until his sending off against Arsenal, his displayed were better than any footballer I have ever seen in a black and white shirt and I've been going since the 70s Supermac era. 

 

Ginola better than Robert?

[et tu brute]

Just now, pormag said:

 

Ginola better than Robert?

In that period yes.

[TheBrownBottle]

6 hours ago, Geordie Ahmed said:

Those assists numbers look made up, think it was about half that for Robert

 

6 hours ago, Kid Icarus said:

Yeah that's not accurate like 

It possibly isn’t tbf - ‘assists’ being tracked is a relatively recent thing.  I can’t pin a year on it (I’m sure the internet hive mind will know) when they started to become a sort of ‘official’ stat.  It still feels like it comes from a different sport tbh - the game existed for a century and a half before anyone really started to track and record ‘assists’. 

[cubaricho]

What page was the last post about Tonali on? JFC.  

[TheBrownBottle]

3 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

Load of shite, for a period of time until his sending off against Arsenal, his displays were better than any footballer (bar Tony Green) I have ever seen in a black and white shirt and I've been going since the 70s Supermac era. 

 

 

 

All four months of it.  I was at Highbury that night in the LC - he was kicked from pillar to post.  Never the same player ever again in B&W.

 

My memories of Ginola must be more selective.  Of course I remember him turning Cox inside out vs the Smoggies. There aren’t many ‘Ginola’ games that stand out though as match-winning performances.  Both feet were like wands mind. 

[pormag]

9 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

In that period yes.

 

Goals and assists it's Robert all day long.

[et tu brute]

1 minute ago, pormag said:

 

Goals and assists it's Robert all day long.

You obviously didn't see Ginola play during that period.

[pormag]

17 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

You obviously didn't see Ginola play during that period.

 

I want my wingers to contribute with many goals and assists, that's why Maxi is frustrating at the minute.

 

You prefer Ginola to Robert, fair enough but one scored more goals and got more assists than the other, that's the aim of the game isn't it?

 

 

 

Edited June 26, 2023 by pormag

[et tu brute]

Just now, pormag said:

 

I want my wingers go contribute with many goals and assists, that's the aim of the game, that's why Maxi is frustrating at the minute.

 

You prefer Ginola to Robert, fair enough but one scored more goals and got more assists than the other, that's the aim of the game isn't it?

 

You obviously didn't watch him so you can't compare the two. I did and Robert. Robert was very good for us, but Ginola during that period was something else. 

[Kid Icarus]

15 minutes ago, pormag said:

 

Goals and assists it's Robert all day long.

Perfect example of stats not being everything. Ginola was as good as any player that I've ever seen at Newcastle in the first half of 95/96, he made us title challengers overnight.

[pormag]

11 minutes ago, et tu brute said:

You obviously didn't watch him so you can't compare the two. I did and Robert. Robert was very good for us, but Ginola during that period was something else. 

 

Rather arrogant to assume what i have and haven't watched but ok.

[Hovagod]

There’s a goal in that Beardsley comp- which is in itself a mesh of mad time jumps- which is something that looks like him scoring in the mid-90s against a European side (maybe?) whilst wearing white shorts in front of a noticeably not full Gallowgate end. This combination of factors makes it the football equivalent of Frank Bruno shaking Peter Sutcliffe’s hand in front of a smiling Jimmy Savile, and any insight would be welcomed. It’s about one minute and forty in.

 

Also, Tonali, eh? Right? Tonali.

[Lazarus]

26 minutes ago, cubaricho said:

What page was the last post about Tonali on? JFC.  

 

Who?

[Hank Marvin]

Saw this flying about twitter. Thought it looked pretty good.

 

[Kid Icarus]

39 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

All four months of it.  I was at Highbury that night in the LC - he was kicked from pillar to post.  Never the same player ever again in B&W.

 

My memories of Ginola must be more selective.  Of course I remember him turning Cox inside out vs the Smoggies. There aren’t many ‘Ginola’ games that stand out though as match-winning performances.  Both feet were like wands mind. 

*6 months of being utterly ridiculous though. During that time Keegan came out with one of his famous Keeganisms "I wouldn't say David is the best player in the world at the moment, but there are certainly none better".

 

Lee Clark put it another way, "the best two players I've ever played with are David Ginola and Peter Beardsley. Beardsley for all of the time that I played with him and David for the first half a season after he came"

 

Scott Sellars to Bez after Ginola's first time getting the ball in training "well that's me fucked isn't it"

 

The numbers might not have been there (7 goals and 16 assists in a team where goals and creativity were widespread is still very good) but for me with Ginola it was love at first sight and he took us up a notch to being serious contenders, I never felt that with Robert, as great as he was, I never thought we had the best winger in the league like I did with Ginola.

 

Ginola won PFA player of the year and the League Cup at Spurs, scoring and assisting for fun and yet for me still wasn't as good as that first half of 95/96.

 

 

Edited June 26, 2023 by Kid Icarus

[Hovagod]

Ginola Man City in 95 springs to mind as another iconic performance. Got their full back sent off didn’t he? Bolton away too. Maybe we were just mint in general but as a kid then those definitely stand out even now as evidence as how brilliant he was 

[Kid Icarus]

41 minutes ago, Hovagod said:

Ginola Man City in 95 springs to mind as another iconic performance. Got their full back sent off didn’t he? Bolton away too. Maybe we were just mint in general but as a kid then those definitely stand out even now as evidence as how brilliant he was 

Coventry, Man City, Sheff Wed, Everton  Wimbledon twice, Bolton, Stoke, Spurs, Boro, Forest, Arsenal (before the LC) he was unreal IIRC. 

 

One of those things that's lost in time as well, but up until Sheff Wed away for me it was just listening on the radio and hearing what he was doing described, hearing the crowd react to it, then hearing from people who went to the matches how good he was. Seeing him for the first time on Sky in that Sheff Wed match didn’t disappoint like, he was absolute magic, jaw droppingly skillful but stylish with it as well, then he went and scored as well. 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2023 by Kid Icarus

[Chris_R]

Ginola's skill was outrageous. I'm sure I remember him taking corners with both feet and I've definitely seen him on highlight reels scoring free kicks with both feet in his career. To be the best professional footballer at your club at things like that with your wrong foot is just obscene.

 

I had a season ticket back then and he was just a joy to watch, as others have said that first half-season he tormented everyone. I've never seen anyone do that before or since, just utterly terrorise the opposition week in and week out. I loved HBA and Robert, but Ginola will always be my favourite left winger. I don't know how he'd play in the modern era because he was famously a smoker and never tracked back, but by god was he glorious to watch in full flight.

[TheBrownBottle]

1 hour ago, thomas said:

Potentially unpopular opinion but it was Ben Arfa who failed Pardew, not the other way around.

Bit of both for me.  Pardew didn’t have a clue how to manage talent, but HBA’s attitude has always been an issue.  The lad should have been world class - that he wasn’t is something he takes some responsibility for. 

[TheBrownBottle]

1 hour ago, Hovagod said:

There’s a goal in that Beardsley comp- which is in itself a mesh of mad time jumps- which is something that looks like him scoring in the mid-90s against a European side (maybe?) whilst wearing white shorts in front of a noticeably not full Gallowgate end. This combination of factors makes it the football equivalent of Frank Bruno shaking Peter Sutcliffe’s hand in front of a smiling Jimmy Savile, and any insight would be welcomed. It’s about one minute and forty in.

 

Also, Tonali, eh? Right? Tonali.

Vs Halmstads in the 96/97 UEFA Cup

 

1 hour ago, Kid Icarus said:

*6 months of being utterly ridiculous though. During that time Keegan came out with one of his famous Keeganisms "I wouldn't say David is the best player in the world at the moment, but there are certainly none better".

 

Lee Clark put it another way, "the best two players I've ever played with are David Ginola and Peter Beardsley. Beardsley for all of the time that I played with him and David for the first half a season after he came"

 

Scott Sellars to Bez after Ginola's first time getting the ball in training "well that's me fucked isn't it"

 

The numbers might not have been there (7 goals and 16 assists in a team where goals and creativity were widespread is still very good) but for me with Ginola it was love at first sight and he took us up a notch to being serious contenders, I never felt that with Robert, as great as he was, I never thought we had the best winger in the league like I did with Ginola.

 

Ginola won PFA player of the year and the League Cup at Spurs, scoring and assisting for fun and yet for me still wasn't as good as that first half of 95/96.

 

 

 

Yeah, he could be magic on the ball.  Also, agreed re winning PFA PotY at Spurs - Man Utd’s treble team splitting the vote helped that one massively too.

 

We looked like contenders before Ginola joined - at the beginning of 94/95 and the end of 93/94.  He joined a side which spluttered across the line into 6th having been top three for most of the season the year before.

 

Also, I would have swapped him for Giggs at the time given the choice.  Giggs is one of those players who it is easy to forget just how good they were. 

[timeEd32]

1 hour ago, cubaricho said:

What page was the last post about Tonali on? JFC.  

 

Tonali is yet another supremely talented, mercurial French winger so this thread is right on topic.

[nemtizz]

Replacing Tonali with RLC is insane. Small club @Milanista

[Mahoneys Tache]

11 hours ago, Dr. TC said:

 

Think Tonali will develop a shimmy that puts defenders on the deck? I had also forgotten his total mastery of the chip shot until now - maybe that's what Murphy was trying to emulate. 

 

 

I think one of the things that prevents him from being viewed as an all time great (outside of Tyneside at least) is that he was so inelegant. He did things of utter wonder and implausibility but still managed to look like a shambling scruff when he did.