Fergusons substitution

[Robster]

As much as i dislike Man U, I felt that Alex Ferguson decision, bringing Ronaldo on immediately after having pulled a goal back against Everton, was a perfect example of a Manager who knows how and when when to make a tactical change.

 

Knowing that being psychologically a little fragile after having just conceded, the added sight of Ronaldo coming on, I think, in part helped them push on and blitz Everton in that last half an hour

 

I can only hope that Roeder, if he is to be our Manager next year, and the rest of the backroom staff, can take note of things like this and learn from them

[Decky]

Going a goal down and bringing on your best player is hardly tactical genious

[Offshore]

We've always been abit shite with our use of subs true, but tbf I reckon only (a fully match fit but rested for a game - not 1st game back ie Reading or whenever) Owen coming off the bench would have anything like the same impact, fear-wise, as Man U bringing on Ronaldo.

 

 

[Robster]

Going a goal down and bringing on your best player is hardly tactical genious

 

No... he did it when they pulled back to 2-1. therefore sensing it wouold give them an extra edge as Evertone would be a bit delicate. My point being, I am hoping Roeder can learn to judge when teh right time to make subs is and not just when the crowd tell him to

[Robster]

We've always been abit s**** with our use of subs true, but tbf I reckon only (a fully match fit but rested for a game - not 1st game back ie Reading or whenever) Owen coming off the bench would have anything like the same impact, fear-wise, as Man U bringing on Ronaldo.

 

 

 

I agree the fact it was Ronaldo makes it a bit of an exception but for me it highlighted that Ferguson thought on his feet and just just glory on his team scoring a goal.

It sounds so simple but Roeder hasnt shown many, if any, similar examples of high managerial intelligence

[Offshore]

We've always been abit s**** with our use of subs true, but tbf I reckon only (a fully match fit but rested for a game - not 1st game back ie Reading or whenever) Owen coming off the bench would have anything like the same impact, fear-wise, as Man U bringing on Ronaldo.

 

 

 

I agree the fact it was Ronaldo makes it a bit of an exception but for me it highlighted that Ferguson thought on his feet and just just glory on his team scoring a goal.

It sounds so simple but Roeder hasnt shown many, if any, similar examples of high managerial intelligence

 

Or it could be argued that it shows that Ferguson got his team wrong in the 1st place. I'm fairly sure he didn't want to use Ronaldo at all if possible if he could get away with it as he's got a AC next week to contend with. Whichever way we look at it, it does come down to the fact that he had that stature of player on the bench to be able to bring on if needs be.

 

 

[OzzieMandias]

Going a goal down and bringing on your best player is hardly tactical genious

 

No... he did it when they pulled back to 2-1. therefore sensing it wouold give them an extra edge as Evertone would be a bit delicate. My point being, I am hoping Roeder can learn to judge when teh right time to make subs is and not just when the crowd tell him to

 

Well, we can all sit around and hope that Roeder suddenly becomes a top manager...

[Robster]

Going a goal down and bringing on your best player is hardly tactical genious

 

No... he did it when they pulled back to 2-1. therefore sensing it wouold give them an extra edge as Evertone would be a bit delicate. My point being, I am hoping Roeder can learn to judge when teh right time to make subs is and not just when the crowd tell him to

 

Well, we can all sit around and hope that Roeder suddenly becomes a top manager...

 

Dreaming and hoping is all I have got.....

[Dokko]

Really using your subs should be as understandable to a EPL manager as getting up in the morning.

 

But GR isn't the only manager to be guilty of being a plum on the issue, my biggest problem with Sir Bobby was this and he was 70+ and still doing it. 

 

His trick IIRC was to leave it until stoppage where he'd make 3 subs which should of been made 20mins ago, then be gutted when we didn't score.

 

 

Still wish he was here though!

[LoveItIfWeBeatU]

Newcastle almost always try to put out the best 11 players (on paper) from the start. We rarely 'rest' our big guns so bringing that sort of quality on from the bench mid-match is rarely an option for us. Also, Ferguson only used Ronaldo because Everton were making a game of it. He could have ended up looking a fool for not starting Ronaldo in the first place if they'd lost.

 

We need a bigger and better squad in order to have quality that can change a game sitting on the bench.

[Guest Geordiesned]

Unfortunately I don't think the sight of Albert Luque getting ready to come on in similar circumstances would strike fear into the hearts of the oppostion!

[Cajun]

Unfortunately I don't think the sight of Albert Luque getting ready to come on in similar circumstances would strike fear into the hearts of the oppostion!

 

I don't know, I imagine it will be somthing like "who the fucks that?"  "I don't know but I hope he isn't good!"

[The College Dropout]

Really using your subs should be as understandable to a EPL manager as getting up in the morning.

 

But GR isn't the only manager to be guilty of being a plum on the issue, my biggest problem with Sir Bobby was this and he was 70+ and still doing it. 

 

His trick IIRC was to leave it until stoppage where he'd make 3 subs which should of been made 20mins ago, then be gutted when we didn't score.

 

 

Still wish he was here though!

 

;D  This isn't totally true but very funny. It's Bobby's passion and authentic suprise when things fucked up that made me laugh. Glen looks like a wet-fish in comparison.

[NUFC06]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

[LoveItIfWeBeatU]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

I'm no defender of Roeder but comparing his substitution options with Mourihno's isn't a fair comparison. Look at Chelsea's bench compared to ours. Our bench this season was mainly kids and average squad players not internationals brought in for huge fees. Just about all the players on Chelsea's bench would make our starting 11.

[NUFC06]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

I'm no defender of Roeder but comparing his substitution options with Mourihno's isn't a fair comparison. Look at Chelsea's bench compared to ours. Our bench this season was mainly kids and average squad players not internationals brought in for huge fees.

 

Im not talking about the quality of players,im talking about the subs itself.Mourihno brings 1 striker and 1 RW when he already have 2 strikers and 1 LW on the pitch.

When we were losing to AZ 2:0 Roeder made his first sub in the 85min when he put LM on the field

Clueless as ever tbf

[1878]

:lol:

 

Complete bollocks

 

Ronaldo had no bearing on the result whatsoever. He was largely invisible and obviously carrying a knock when he came on. Lescott got the better of him, no doubt.

 

Man Utd's first 3 goals were due to individual mistakes by Everton players. Fact.

[Robster]

:lol:

 

Complete bollocks

 

Ronaldo had no bearing on the result whatsoever. He was largely invisible and obviously carrying a knock when he came on. Lescott got the better of him, no doubt.

 

Man Utd's first 3 goals were due to individual mistakes by Everton players. Fact.

 

But dont you think that the mere appearance of ronaldo coming on affected everton enough to make those mistakes. they didnt look like making them before he came on.

All I was really aiming for in the original post was that Ferguson knew exactly when to make the substitution as much as who actually came on.

I am just dreaming and hoping that one day we might be ale to say the same about our manager.

[1878]

:lol:

 

Complete bollocks

 

Ronaldo had no bearing on the result whatsoever. He was largely invisible and obviously carrying a knock when he came on. Lescott got the better of him, no doubt.

 

Man Utd's first 3 goals were due to individual mistakes by Everton players. Fact.

 

But dont you think that the mere appearance of ronaldo coming on affected everton enough to make those mistakes. they didnt look like making them before he came on.

All I was really aiming for in the original post was that Ferguson knew exactly when to make the substitution as much as who actually came on.

I am just dreaming and hoping that one day we might be ale to say the same about our manager.

 

No. I honestly think it was nothing to do with him.

 

The first mistake was made before he came on and that unsettled the defence massively, they had no confidence in the keeper anymore and United also had their tails up because of it. They could have put Silvestre on the wing and we probably would have still collapsed and made those individual errors.

[Martin Lol]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

I'm no defender of Roeder but comparing his substitution options with Mourihno's isn't a fair comparison. Look at Chelsea's bench compared to ours. Our bench this season was mainly kids and average squad players not internationals brought in for huge fees. Just about all the players on Chelsea's bench would make our starting 11.

 

It does't really matter who is on the bench, it's showing that he is trying to do something when Plan A isn't working.  If Plan A doesn't work, I'd like Plan B to be tried, even if that ultimately doesn't work either.  But Roeder isn't the only one.  My criticism of Jol is his reluctance to change the gameplan.  Against Sevilla we conceded 2 goals in the first 10 minutes, needed 4 to go through.  Defoe sat on the bench till the 70th minute.  He may not have made the slightest bit of difference but fans want to see the effort to change things around being made.

[Robster]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

I'm no defender of Roeder but comparing his substitution options with Mourihno's isn't a fair comparison. Look at Chelsea's bench compared to ours. Our bench this season was mainly kids and average squad players not internationals brought in for huge fees. Just about all the players on Chelsea's bench would make our starting 11.

 

It does't really matter who is on the bench, it's showing that he is trying to do something when Plan A isn't working.  If Plan A doesn't work, I'd like Plan B to be tried, even if that ultimately doesn't work either.  But Roeder isn't the only one.  My criticism of Jol is his reluctance to change the gameplan.  Against Sevilla we conceded 2 goals in the first 10 minutes, needed 4 to go through.  Defoe sat on the bench till the 70th minute.  He may not have made the slightest bit of difference but fans want to see the effort to change things around being made.

 

Agreed   

[James]

For me, the turning point was when at 2-1 down Rooney chases a loose ball, and realising that he wont get there in time to control it, he runs anyway, catches the ball and concedes a throw in instead of a goal kick.

 

Everton lose possession due to intense pressure, and the rest is history.

[Robster]

For me, the turning point was when at 2-1 down Rooney chases a loose ball, and realising that he wont get there in time to control it, he runs anyway, catches the ball and concedes a throw in instead of a goal kick.

 

Everton lose possession due to intense pressure, and the rest is history.

 

And in my eyes, Rooneys attitude/performance/moral was boosted by the substitution (obviously as well as the goal).

Footballers need leading by the hand at the best of times and Fergusons decision got more out of his own players as well as put nerves into Evertons

[NUFC06]

Roeder is clueless c*** and this season he was alwful with subs.He dont have the balls to take a risk when we are losing,he cant change our tactics when we are losing,he is just clueless

Mourihno is another example of how a top manager must act when his team is losing

Against Tottenham they were losing 1:3 and after the half time he put on Kalou and SWP.And at the end of the game Chelsea were playing with Drogba,Sheva,Kalou,SWP and Robben.Mourihno took a big gamble but it paid off.

Roeder is a mouse who is too afraid to take risks to win games

I'm no defender of Roeder but comparing his substitution options with Mourihno's isn't a fair comparison. Look at Chelsea's bench compared to ours. Our bench this season was mainly kids and average squad players not internationals brought in for huge fees. Just about all the players on Chelsea's bench would make our starting 11.

 

It does't really matter who is on the bench, it's showing that he is trying to do something when Plan A isn't working.  If Plan A doesn't work, I'd like Plan B to be tried, even if that ultimately doesn't work either.  But Roeder isn't the only one.  My criticism of Jol is his reluctance to change the gameplan.  Against Sevilla we conceded 2 goals in the first 10 minutes, needed 4 to go through.  Defoe sat on the bench till the 70th minute.  He may not have made the slightest bit of difference but fans want to see the effort to change things around being made.

 

But after all Jol did the right thing when he played Defoe who scored with his first touch.Maybe he put him on a little bit too late but nevertheless he tried to change the game and to win it.You didnt go through mainly because of the misses made by Berbatov and Dawson.You played great that game and deserved to go through.

And then when you make the comparison with Roeder and the game against AZ.We were losing 2:0 and needed a goal he put on Emre on 59min who was injured for a long time and was out of shape and in the 86th minute played Zoggy instead of Hunty.

 

What a clown.He put on 2 midfielders when he had Luque and Carroll on the bench.At least he should have tried to score a goal by playing one of them...

ROEDER= CLUELESS and INCOMPETENT