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Ronal... Baptista on his way?

Crumpy Gunt

by Crumpy Gunt
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Razor

Razor

Posted
Posted

Arsenal, Liverpool, Manchester United

 

Chelsea, Newcastle, Leeds, West ham.

 

 

 

the top list is a list of clubs who built their success with solid foundations. the bottom list is a list of clubs who tried or are trying to spend big, in order to be big, go for big names etc... and buy success.

 

Fair point imo

 

Further, which lot of clubs would we prefer to be in? simple answer....

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Wullie

Wullie

Posted
Posted

Arsenal, Liverpool, Manchester United

 

Chelsea, Newcastle, Leeds, West ham.

 

 

 

the top list is a list of clubs who built their success with solid foundations. the bottom list is a list of clubs who tried or are trying to spend big, in order to be big, go for big names etc... and buy success.

 

I can see the point you're trying to make, but Man Utd and Liverpool have spent £50m each this summer already, near enough - both bankrolled by new owners, particularly Liverpool. The playing field has changed drastically in the last few years. If we want to have a hope of catching the big four, we have to spend - not £58m on one player perhaps, but we do have to write some big cheques. Unfortunate, the way it was historically was much better, but that's the way it is.

 

Also your point about Leeds and West Ham is flawed - they didn't/haven't bought big names. Obviously we've not seen the result of West Ham throwing money about yet, but as far as Leeds went, their problem wasn't big money on quality players, it was big money on average players. West Ham seem to be following suit, though thankfully for them they've actually got the money.

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Guest Ridzuan

Guest Ridzuan

Posted
Posted

Hmm...interesting.Although he was poor with Barcelona for most part of last season,I think he could still do well this season but 58m is too much for us to spend on one player.But you never know what Mikey is thinking,he really wants a top star to come here and it might just be a possibility.

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merlin

merlin

Posted
Posted

Regarding the signature of Pele in the 70's - of COURSE we would have been delighted..we signed Supermac in 71 for what was then a record 180,000 pounds and to be honest, I wondered where the money had come from!

Go forward 25 years and Shearer arrives for a record 15m, and the whole place goes berserk - quite rightly as he was probably in the top 3 CFs in the world at the time, but this time , I DIDN'T wonder where the money had come from because we were a top 3 side, earning millions from off-field activities and we knew we'd get it back.

 

The difference with a deal like the pie-in-the-sky piece in the NOTW is that we WOULDN'T get the money back - even if Ashley used the guy as a promotional tool for shirts etc I doubt whether it would make commercial sense simply because we are currently a run-of-the-mill side - it would be different if we had just won, say, the Prem & FA Cup because it would look as if we were going places & neutrals around the world would be swept up in all the Ronaldinho mania & buy the stuff.

 

There are also other issues - regardless of his great talent, the guy is not going to get any better as he gets older AND he doesn't have the loyalty that a player like Shearer did because of his local connections so the chances are that it wouldn't be a long stay and you would need at least 5 years to try to even attempt to make economic sense of the transfer.

 

At this point in time, there is almost NO WAY this guy would sign for us - another year or two, who knows, but would you want him then..?

Better in my view to take a chance on an up & coming player like Huntelaar for less than half the cost - less injury-prone(younger),no problem with climate etc(remember Mira's hamstrings..!?)

 

Pele in 1970 would have been brilliant - we had just won the Fairs Cup , he had just been part of Brazil's best-ever side and there wasn't as much difference between top div clubs in England as there is now.

However, he was then 29 and had had loads of injuries - it wouldn't have lasted long, but boy, what a player he was ! If you watch some of his flashes of genius(the shot from well within his own half during the 70 WC game with the Czechs)and his outrageous dummy against the Uruguay goalkeeper in the same tournament, which would have been the goal of all time had his shot gone in)just show why he was a really great player AND he gave no problems off the field - my all-time choice as best forward in the world.

 

All nice dreams, but we have reality to face, and a hard slog to get back to even the top 5 - luxury players are not going to do that for us..

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Guest optimistic nit

Guest optimistic nit

Posted
Posted

aye, but the main point is that we need solid foundations to really challenge the top 4. unless you plan to do a chelsea and spend 2-300 million on a squad you need to buid to achieve success. we don't have any foundations, we need to develop a system of getting good youngsters in (which to some degree we have to be fair) and competent backroom staff.

Arsenal's success was built on scouting, manure and liverpools success has been build on their academy, chelsea's on their money. We don't have anything like chelsea's spending power, so i think it is very important to focus on scouting and the academy as well as signing star players. of course the others spent big as well, but thats because you can't form a team entirely of cheaply bought youngsters and academy players that will challenge for the league.

 

Arsenal built their team around henry, liverpool around gerrard and to some degree carrager and manure have had scholes, giggs, keane, beckham and countless others. even chelsea had their two star players before abramovic.

all of these clubs success was built by players that didn't arrive on massive fees (comparitively). it is only once success (top 4 status) was achieved that these clubs really started to spend big. our big mistake was that we achived top 4 status and thought it could be maintained by our current squad.

 

 

 

this is in response to wullie btw.

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Razor

Razor

Posted
Posted

It might be obvious, but in all the Top 4 clubs, to varying extents, they have had a brilliant manager to help bring and organise success. Man U and Arsenal wouldnt be where they are now without Fergie and Wenger.

Over the years its clear to anyone we have a had a fairly sour run of managers since KK, and until we get and keep a good one, we arent going to challenge. In my opinion Allardyce is the manager we need right now; he can build solid foundations, get the players in our existing squad to realise some of their potential, and bring in new players which so far havent been incredible signings, but all have been solid and productive. Once we have a solid squad, that is consistant week in week out, plays well at home, then we can bring in a few more world class signings to get that extra edge.

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madras

madras

Posted
Posted

Arsenal, Liverpool, Manchester United

 

Chelsea, Newcastle, Leeds, West ham.

 

 

 

the top list is a list of clubs who built their success with solid foundations. the bottom list is a list of clubs who tried or are trying to spend big, in order to be big, go for big names etc... and buy success.

rubbish.

 

 

the top list is a list of clubs who spent their money better than the bottom list.

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Tsunami

Tsunami

Posted
Posted

If this is true we are beginning to look bloody stupid. Giving trials to free agents one week & going after Ronaldinho the next.

 

Sam knows he needs to sort out the defence & if we do have that kind of cash, splash it wisely & then the trophy players will want to come once we are a viable proposition for them.

 

Other clubs are signing players; we are continuing with Jackanory stories at best & self indulgency on the part of MA at worst.

 

Nobody has a clue what MA is all about & I find this latest story cringeworthy.

 

Sam - "So Ron, how do you fancy playing for the Toon?"

Ron - "Fuck off"

Sam - "Mike, told you what he'd say"

Mike - "Ok Sam; go & buy Queuedrue & then give Messi/ Kaka etc a call & see if they fancy it"

Sam - "I'd rather try & get Micah Richards or Ledley King in"

Mike - "Nah, you can ask about Puyol or Cannavarro & if they say no you can go & buy Luke Young"

 

Let us hope this is not how it is going. The point is we don't know & surely we must start asking questions. Is that not reasonable? This is not Chicken Little panicking; though I do expect many posts saying don't worry it'll be alright. I'd rather know what was coming over the horizon rather than bury my head in the sand & hope it is all ok.

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manorpark

manorpark

Posted
Posted

If this is true we are beginning to look bloody stupid. Giving trials to free agents one week & going after Ronaldinho the next.

 

Sam knows he needs to sort out the defence & if we do have that kind of cash, splash it wisely & then the trophy players will want to come once we are a viable proposition for them.

 

Other clubs are signing players; we are continuing with Jackanory stories at best & self indulgency on the part of MA at worst.

 

Nobody has a clue what MA is all about & I find this latest story cringeworthy.

 

Sam - "So Ron, how do you fancy playing for the Toon?"

Ron - "f*** off"

Sam - "Mike, told you what he'd say"

Mike - "Ok Sam; go & buy Queuedrue & then give Messi/ Kaka etc a call & see if they fancy it"

Sam - "I'd rather try & get Micah Richards or Ledley King in"

Mike - "Nah, you can ask about Puyol or Cannavarro & if they say no you can go & buy Luke Young"

 

Let us hope this is not how it is going. The point is we don't know & surely we must start asking questions. Is that not reasonable? This is not Chicken Little panicking; though I do expect many posts saying don't worry it'll be alright. I'd rather know what was coming over the horizon rather than bury my head in the sand & hope it is all ok.

 

There is a distinct lack of information - hard information - around at the moment.

 

We cannot 'know' what is going on at times like this, however I think (I 'think') we can be certain that Sam is working on bringing in the players (4 or 5 defenders, in my view) that he wants.  It will happen.

 

Now, to Mike Ashley, and your fictional 'exchange' above.

 

I do not believe that our rich and intelligent (thats how he got his money) billionaire, will be having any "proactive" input AT ALL.  It is all cr*p to suggest that he does have (I'm not saying you are). He (in reality, Mort) is leaving it to Allardyce, while their 'review of the business' continues. I imagine that review will (amongst many other things) end up supporting the retention of Allardyce.

 

We just have to be patient. I like to think we are an 'intelligent' club now, and are leaving the "buy anybody" / "we have £50M to spend screaming" to clubs like Man City/Villa/West Ham.  The only thing we have to worry about is letting Liverpool, Man U and Chelsea "pull too much farther away from us".

 

Patience is the key (along with ignoring all the press totally-made-up stories) for us uninformed fans, at the moment though!!

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Guest firetotheworks

Guest firetotheworks

Posted
Posted

Ive just read the article now. i had to chuckle. As for the 'if this story was true...' question. I think in principle its wrong for a chairman with no footballing experience to get involved with signings but I doubt anyone would complain if it was Ronaldinho. I still think this enquiry went something like

 

Newcastle: Whats the availability of Gudjohnsen, Edmilson and Deco?

Barca: We'll get back to you

Newcastle: What about that Ronaldinho kid?

Barca: Haha yes, yes thats very funny, we've never heard that one before.

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Guest eyeball_tickler

Guest eyeball_tickler

Posted
Posted

if we even bid £20 million for crouch i will lose all the respect i once had for sam.

 

hypothetically, if we did sign crouch for £20 million, uproar or delight?

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Guest firetotheworks

Guest firetotheworks

Posted
Posted

To be fair dont you think that 20m isnt that bad considering the stupid prices that have been thrown about this summer? 5million for Chopra, 8.5million for Reo Coker, 6million for Kamara, 16.5million for Bent. Last year those prices would have been almost half that. I still think 20million for Crouch is steep but the people who still think Crouch is shite are hanging on to that period when he first started playing for England for dear life.

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Guest eyeball_tickler

Guest eyeball_tickler

Posted
Posted

in our current situation with owen, martins and viduka (plus that other one) we have 3 and 1/4 good strikers, so bidding (or even thinking about bidding) £20 million for him would be beyond stupid. even if martins left i'd still be pissed off if we tried to replace him with crouch for that price.

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Guest Verlaine

Guest Verlaine

Posted
Posted

If this is true we are beginning to look bloody stupid. Giving trials to free agents one week & going after Ronaldinho the next.

 

Sam knows he needs to sort out the defence & if we do have that kind of cash, splash it wisely & then the trophy players will want to come once we are a viable proposition for them.

 

Other clubs are signing players; we are continuing with Jackanory stories at best & self indulgency on the part of MA at worst.

 

Nobody has a clue what MA is all about & I find this latest story cringeworthy.

 

Sam - "So Ron, how do you fancy playing for the Toon?"

Ron - "f*** off"

Sam - "Mike, told you what he'd say"

Mike - "Ok Sam; go & buy Queuedrue & then give Messi/ Kaka etc a call & see if they fancy it"

Sam - "I'd rather try & get Micah Richards or Ledley King in"

Mike - "Nah, you can ask about Puyol or Cannavarro & if they say no you can go & buy Luke Young"

 

Let us hope this is not how it is going. The point is we don't know & surely we must start asking questions. Is that not reasonable? This is not Chicken Little panicking; though I do expect many posts saying don't worry it'll be alright. I'd rather know what was coming over the horizon rather than bury my head in the sand & hope it is all ok.

 

Embarassing, tbh.

 

In your other thread, you were crying that we weren't linked with Deco any more in the papers. Now we're linked with UBERDECO and you're upset about that. You're just a whinger at the moment.

 

Also, it's the NOTW. It's not true. Relax.

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Mr Logic

Mr Logic

Posted
Posted

 

Sam - "So Ron, how do you fancy playing for the Toon?"

Ron - "f*** off"

Sam - "Mike, told you what he'd say"

Mike - "Ok Sam; go & buy Queuedrue & then give Messi/ Kaka etc a call & see if they fancy it"

Sam - "I'd rather try & get Micah Richards or Ledley King in"

Mike - "Nah, you can ask about Puyol or Cannavarro & if they say no you can go & buy Luke Young"

 

 

That's a Shepherd conversation, Ashley, hopefully, doesn't operate like that.

 

Ashley will want a 'star' player to add to the team at some point to raise brand awareness in a global market. Hopefully a list would be compiled that Allardyce would then get a say in. Otherwise it would be as much a cowboy outfit as the last lot.

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Guest Verlaine

Guest Verlaine

Posted
Posted

The club have blatantly read all the complaining threads yesterday, so leaked that story to shut us up.

 

:lol: James made a pretty good funny.

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