Baggio Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Get Butt out of the team ASAP for someone who can pass a ball and attack. Hopefully Emre will be back by next week. This Emre? http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php?topic=33233.0 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Get Butt out of the team ASAP for someone who can pass a ball and attack. Hopefully Emre will be back by next week. This Emre? http://www.newcastle-online.com/nufcforum/index.php?topic=33233.0 credit for that one Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzza Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Only saw thwe second half on the telly, thought we didn't create one clear cut chance the whole of the second half and villa were virtually the same. Milner and zog were trying hard to create something and Sam made a mistake by replacing martins with owen, I thought he should have taken Viduka off, who coincidentally looked fukcing useless... Thought Roz was very composed and carr wasn't bad either. Butt looks the business in midfield aswell. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
garth Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 You guys need to get a grip here, considering our performances from the last 3 seasons I thought we did quite well, for me it was a good game tactically! their defence and ours did very well I thought which is a great relief from our part, considering how shit we were in the past. I mean fellow Toon supporters it's only our second game for fuck sakes! things can only get better in my view from here on, I'd rather we take some positives out of this rather than negatives, all in all we didn't lose which makes a change from our past. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Carr was caught out of position badly on the counter on at least 4 occassions, needs to understand himself better, ie he's an unfit c*** who attacks even worse than he defends Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keefaz Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 I'm disappointed, tbh, but I had unrealistic expectations along with everyone else. I thought maybe there would be some magic fix. But, apparently, we're living in the real world so we just have to get on with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 I sat there for 90 minutes and I still don't know what formation we were supposed to be playing. It was like a 4-4-2 with 3 defensive midfielders and no left winger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest goal! Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 I don't think we were great defensively either, if even 2 of their front 6 had their shooting boots we'd probably have conceded 2 goals! Young, Agbonlahor and Carew had chances from good positions - just with shocking finishing, plus that 1 really good chance they had where they'd certianly have scored if Agbonlahor? (I think it was) had of squared it to NRC instead of shooting. They created a lot more than we did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmonkey Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Hate to say it, but thought Reo Coker had a smashing game today. Very quick and powerful on the counter attack, some solid passing at times, and battled well in midfield - if his name were Appiah or similar and he werent a bling boy more of us would have drooled over that performance (slight exaggeration only). We were lucky today. We had a few half chances, but they had the real chances or had created the right situations to bury us, but merely messed things up at the death. Particularly Agbonlahor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohmelads Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 If Allardyce is going to be heavily praised for what he's achieved, I think he has to take a bit of constructive criticism for what went on out there today. Quite simply there was no movement, no pace, no width, for large parts of the game we were playing way too deep, it was desperate stuff. I'm a bit surprised by all the positive reaction on Rozehnal. He's impressed me in pre-season, and I know there's always supposed to be the benefit of the doubt with new (and foreign) signings, but I thought he didn't take enough responsibility today, and left Taylor doing a lot of the work. He gets pulled out of position quite easily, bombs forwards for 'all or nothing' tackles and shy's out of the odd balls that centre backs really should be winning. He didn't have a bad game, no major mistakes to speak of, but he's not deserving of all this praise. For a defender who wears white boots and apparently fancies himself as a cultured ballplaying defender, he did an awful lot of hoof and hope when the likes of Butt, Smith and Geremi were giving him options. Taylor made one shocking mistake which could have been costly, but apart from that he was solid, and yet he doesn't get a mention. Seems to be the way at the moment. Milner deserves a mention, as the only player in black and white willing to find space and run at people. Zog tried to make forays forward but cut inside way too much. Viduka looked way off the pace and was rightly replaced by Ameobi. Martins had another one of those days, he needs to be playing further up the pitch to be effective. There's still a lot of hard work to be done. We didn't stretch them and never deserved anything more than a point. Throughout the game we were hoping for a 30 yard screamer, a corner, a free-kick, a dodgy pen. A goal was never going to come from open play, we could have played for hours. I hate to say it but we could really have done with Dyer and Solano today. It's all well and good having shiny new players but the pace, directness and creativity of those two was in bloody short supply today. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhatTheFunk Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 sorry to have to say this...but some of the posts on here indicate that we have some unbelievably fickle and shortsighted supporters following this club!! im shocked by some of the doom mongering going on here, and all the player bashing!!! some of you lot are fucking pathetic!!! get a fucking grip!! in the past we would have lost games like this one! easily! but we didn't, and thats what matters at this point! none of us is any of the players, and none of us is the manager. Im certain the manager, staff and players will study the tapes come monday morning, and will do their best to put things right! it was a mighty tactical battle between two sides who simply cannot field their strongest line ups at the moment. MON didnt want to lose, and big sam didnt want to let the pressure get to his players seeing as we couldn't score in the first hour. both teams played for the draw in the last 30 mins, and that was obvious for all to see. just one of them days. i suggest some of you get over it, look forward to the next game and move the fuck on!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keefaz Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 If Allardyce is going to be heavily praised for what he's achieved, I think he has to take a bit of constructive criticism for what went on out there today. Quite simply there was no movement, no pace, no width, for large parts of the game we were playing way too deep, it was desperate stuff. I'm a bit surprised by all the positive reaction on Rozehnal. He's impressed me in pre-season, and I know there's always supposed to be the benefit of the doubt with new (and foreign) signings, but I thought he didn't take enough responsibility today, and left Taylor doing a lot of the work. He gets pulled out of position quite easily, bombs forwards for 'all or nothing' tackles and shy's out of the odd balls that centre backs really should be winning. He didn't have a bad game, no major mistakes to speak of, but he's not deserving of all this praise. For a defender who wears white boots and apparently fancies himself as a cultured ballplaying defender, he did an awful lot of hoof and hope when the likes of Butt, Smith and Geremi were giving him options. Taylor made one shocking mistake which could have been costly, but apart from that he was solid, and yet he doesn't get a mention. Seems to be the way at the moment. Milner deserves a mention, as the only player in black and white willing to find space and run at people. Zog tried to make forays forward but cut inside way too much. Viduka looked way off the pace and was rightly replaced by Ameobi. Martins had another one of those days, he needs to be playing further up the pitch to be effective. There's still a lot of hard work to be done. We didn't stretch them and never deserved anything more than a point. Throughout the game we were hoping for a 30 yard screamer, a corner, a free-kick, a dodgy pen. A goal was never going to come from open play, we could have played for hours. I hate to say it but we could really have done with Dyer and Solano today. It's all well and good having shiny new players but the pace, directness and creativity of those two was in bloody short supply today. Good post. There's work to be done, but let's not lose our heads. Thought Rozey had a tendancy to back off a bit much for my tastes (although he wasn't alone in that: an Allardyce technique?). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 I'm a bit surprised by all the positive reaction on Rozehnal. He's impressed me in pre-season, and I know there's always supposed to be the benefit of the doubt with new (and foreign) signings, but I thought he didn't take enough responsibility today, and left Taylor doing a lot of the work. He gets pulled out of position quite easily, bombs forwards for 'all or nothing' tackles and shy's out of the odd balls that centre backs really should be winning. He didn't have a bad game, no major mistakes to speak of, but he's not deserving of all this praise. For a defender who wears white boots and apparently fancies himself as a cultured ballplaying defender, he did an awful lot of hoof and hope when the likes of Butt, Smith and Geremi were giving him options. Taylor made one shocking mistake which could have been costly, but apart from that he was solid, and yet he doesn't get a mention. Seems to be the way at the moment. fully agree. Rozehnal's first four challenges, where he's committed himself, were all lost. on two of those occasions he was simply shoved out of the way, not by a bruiser like Carew, but by Agbonlahor, who you'd have to consider one of the less physical players in the league. think he quite a lot of adapting to do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSG Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Like watching 10 Scott Parkers today tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decky Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 We are a team in transition this season, Martins and Viduka are a new partnership and tbh Viduka didnt look arsed. Owen is still getting back to fitness. Plus our strikers got no real service from a midfield consisting of 2 defensive midfielders, a striker and a winger. What did you expect? The whole team needs time to gel and Sam needs time to try things out before he can know what tactics work well for our players. When Emre, Barton and Duff are back we will be far more creative and will soar up the league, we are unbeaten so far after 2 games which has to be one of our best starts in ages, lets not forget we had this fixture at the start of last season and lost it. Also lets not forget our defense consisting of a sh*t RB, a youngster, a defender new to the Prem and a left winger did a f***ing outstanding job considering what i just mentioned and considering how sh*t our defense has been for years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocksammy Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 villa are boring as s*** though to be fair... the boys tried hard and the ref was being a c*** to duks all game.... not a bad try but i would have started 451 against villa just because of the way they played f****** pricks How did they play? Better than us? Yes, the f****** pricks. wasnt meaning to take a stab at villa or their supporters for their fine effort and they prob should have won but i was quite upset about how we played was expecting alot more oh wells its a fresh week Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ridzuan Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 It was a very frustrating afternoon for us all day.I dont know if we didnt play very well or Villa was a good team,but still,I think playing at home,we should be more attacking but that did not happen.I dont think the 4-3-3 formation was working in the first half,we were too exposed on the right and left side of the midfield.Smith was excellent so too was Harper.Ameobi was rubbish when he came on.Anyway,a point is better than none. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NUFC4 Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 i didn't have a chance to watch the match last week but with a 3-1 scoreline, highlights and all the good feelings flowing i expected a lot more out of the game today. granted villa did a lot to stifle us but the biggest problem was a lack of RUNNING and CREATIVITY in the midfield. either the defenders would get the ball in the back look up and see no movement, or the midfielders had no other option but to aimlessly hoove the ball upfield. really disappointed with that aspect. we got a point thought and fair enough to that. we really need barton, erme, and duff back in the mix though to add that extra bit of guile that the likes of butt, geremi, and smith lack as a unit. if we could get deco i would shit my pants to be honest. we played entirely too much long ball. players who i thought stood out about the rest: rozy good first game at home and will only get better, looks very comfortable on the ball: n'zogbia, made a few mistakes at the back but he's only learning that position and offered some penetration down the wing, would love to see enrique come in at left back next game and move zoggy up to the wing to attack more. harper, did everything he had to do and nothing he didn't. hope we win at smoggies next week!! and after all that bitching i have to say this squad is 10 fold better than one year ago! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlito Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Well, after sitting there watching an hour and a bit of absolute tripe, I think I'll just blame Carr for everything as always Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DONTOONER Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 It was a game that was needed. The hype needs to stop or at least calm down a whole lot. This is still a team far from being complete. We're only two competitive matches into the season and people are expecting nice attacking football? Has anyone noticed that this is a formation which NONE of our players are used to? I'm not making excuses for the inept attacking display but I fully empathize with BS and realize that we have to calm down. Has anyone noticed how the other teams in the league have started? Spurs lost 2 in a row before recovering today. Manyoo are only on 2 points after two matches. Chelsea were very good for only 10 minutes and then went back into the sloppiness which plagued them the whole game against Reading. No team has started on fire, and we should be analyzing the team's performance in relative to how the other teams, especially our direct competitors (Spurs, Everton and Villa etc.), have done. Regarding today's performance, I thought Zoggy and Milner were our best players. Milner was trying his darn hardest to create something. Viduka was disappointing and should have come off a lot earlier because at least Ameobi competed for balls in the air. I thought Laursen and Mellberg were brilliant. When Enrique's fit, I expect Sam to give Zoggy a go in the middle in games like these, especially at home. We're lacking that drive in the middle of the park; Geremi's always looking to pass, Butt needs to stop with his playmaking bs and Smith's creative abilities is limited. We're lacking the drive that we lacked when Emre and Parker was in the middle. There needs to be a balance, something which will be hard to find if Smith and Butt are paired together in a game in which the onus to attack is on us. I'm not sure if Barton will be a better fit but we need a playmaker or at least give Zoggy/Emre a real go. Overall though, we shouldn't be displeased; 4 points from the first couple of games was something most of us would have been happy with and we should be looking at that. Our next few games aren't the hardest as well so we should at least be picking up more points, especially if we continue to be solid at the back, something which most people have overlooked in criticizing the attack today. What he said. best analysis i have read by far on the board. Just want to add a couple of points. 1) Playing 4-3-3 the midfield trio and strikers need more movement.... i dont mean bombing forward but switching and rotating positions making us alot harder to track. 2)Will be better when Barton and emre is Back, they are the midfielders capable of dribbling into space and make something happen IN THE MIDFIELD. Shame we lost the Bling bling man coz he was ace at doing this.(or maybe switch zog to the middle during the game which i though BS could have done) 3)However the biggest disappointment of the game was that our counterattacking was either none exsistant due to the ball being in the hands of butt and smith or effectively not fluent enough as the move broke down many times before we got into danger areas. 4) I am also quite unsure of BS on the strikers. thought Sho should have came on 1st before owen for viduka. and martins for owen at 80mins. Summary on team performance: Well overall it wasnt pretty to watch but i though it was a game of chess....villa obviously had the upper hand since they already had a year to blend. We showed a dicipline display and are still adapting to the new system... Overall quite happy with the defensive performance but for us to start looking like a force to be reckon with Like BS said might take time. Therefore be patient for now things will only get better. The system needs a bit of work on it and i am quite confident we can do well this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 sorry to have to say this...but some of the posts on here indicate that we have some unbelievably fickle and shortsighted supporters following this club!! im shocked by some of the doom mongering going on here, and all the player bashing!!! some of you lot are f****** pathetic!!! get a f****** grip!! in the past we would have lost games like this one! easily! but we didn't, and thats what matters at this point! none of us is any of the players, and none of us is the manager. Im certain the manager, staff and players will study the tapes come monday morning, and will do their best to put things right! it was a mighty tactical battle between two sides who simply cannot field their strongest line ups at the moment. MON didnt want to lose, and big sam didnt want to let the pressure get to his players seeing as we couldn't score in the first hour. both teams played for the draw in the last 30 mins, and that was obvious for all to see. just one of them days. i suggest some of you get over it, look forward to the next game and move the f*** on!! I agree with this post - i watched the whole game on Foxtel until 2.15 am our time, and make the following observations ;- I expected this to be a tough match and I wasn't wrong - those who have knocked O'Neill in the past should eat humble pie as he had Villa really well organized ; they defended excellently and we hardly got a sniff. The closest we came to scoring was Rozehnal's shot(well-saved)and Viduka's header(deflected over). They could also have scored twice through Laursen & Carew, and should have scored through Agbonhalor, so a draw was a fair result athough we did shade the possession. Our Positives - the high tempo of play and work-rate - last years' team would have lost this match. Smith & Butt were instrumental in keeping us going & Milner's work rate is exceptional ; he must have been knackered at the end as he was the only man taking defenders on . Also, we ARE keeping shape as a unit which is good for the long-term- no-one gave up. The negatives - as I said last week, we lack a midfielder with vision & passing ability. We lack pace up front which will probably not be solved with Owen as he will have lost some of his acceleration off the mark ; we could do with signing Anelka who would give us a whole new look up front. For those criticizing Viduka - get real ; he was virtually isolated among 3 defenders for much of the match as Martins & the midfielders were slow to support him on breakaways.he got very little help from the ref either, who gave Laursen the benefit 8 times out of 10. It was noticeable that the best forward pass of the game was from Viduka in the first half and should have opened them up. Martins does not, in my view, possess the vision to be a really top forward - athleticism yes, frightens defenders when running at them, yes, but control is not good and he doesn't see the quick forward pass when a team-mate is making a run. N'Zogbia needs to be further forward in order to use his pace against the full=back - he is playing out of position, and we need a good L/B asap - I thought Shorey was excellent again yesterday against Everton and he would be a good buy.. Neither side wanted to lose, and it was noticeable that the 2 managers had a long and friendly chat at the end - there is obviously mutual respect,and so there should be as both men are building decent sides from a low base. I agree with those demanding patience - we have fallen far from the heights of 1996, and even from 2002 but I believe that SA WILL get it right - but probably not this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Just wanted to add to my earlier comment about Shorey - I had temporarily forgotten about Enrique and we can only hope he is the business, but he IS young and has no Prem experience. Only time will tell if he IS the answer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MaetihS Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Martins came off cos he is injured. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest unrealterrorist Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 Only saw thwe second half on the telly, thought we didn't create one clear cut chance the whole of the second half and villa were virtually the same. Milner and zog were trying hard to create something and Sam made a mistake by replacing martins with owen, I thought he should have taken Viduka off, who coincidentally looked fukcing useless... Thought Roz was very composed and carr wasn't bad either. Butt looks the business in midfield aswell. I would agree 100% apart from "carr wasn't bad either" he was crap through out imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest unrealterrorist Posted August 19, 2007 Share Posted August 19, 2007 I'm disappointed, tbh, but I had unrealistic expectations along with everyone else. I thought maybe there would be some magic fix. But, apparently, we're living in the real world so we just have to get on with it. :clap:nuff said Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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