OzzieMandias

Interesting indeed. May well work out about half a million quid per point cheaper, too.

I really don't under stand JFK's obsession with JAR. It's an initials thing.

It'd be surprising if our tendency to wallow in pessimism didn't sometimes communicate itself to the players.

Very sensible post Beermonster. Remarkably so. I was just looking at the BBC match report and the intro says something about us ending "a five-game winless run". Made me think, fuck off, that's now five games without defeat. It's a slow process and very far from spectacular, but we seem to be turning a corner. Got a feeling that a number of teams are going to be contesting that 18th place for a good while yet, though.

I swear you get some form of smug enjoyment out of seeing us struggle yet I have no clue why. thats not it, i kind of hope if everyone becomes pessimistic, then the fucking club may decide to do something about it. its like a vote of no confidence in this regime. Ever think of applying for the job of Baldrick on Blackadder?

I get the impression Kinnear is at a loss dealing with any player who doesn't speak English.

Is that Arsenal who currently lie beneath another club with a new owner, one who have shown actual ambition and are looking good for a Champions League spot? Lerner wants Villa to be the best, Ashley wants us to be Fulham. As NJS says, if we've no interest in competing we might as well go home. NJS and many others, quite likely including yourself, thought we'd be having a fantastic season if Keegan hadnt left/walked. How does that tie in with what you have just posted? The position the club would have been in under Keegan WAS Ashley's plan. His failure was not being able to execute that plan. Nevermind though eh, Hall, Shepherd, Dalglish, Gullit, Roeder, Souness, Allardyce and Kinnear, all cunts the lot of them. A fantastic season? No. Better than a relegation dogfight? Yes. No, i'm sure you wont want to put a position on where we'd be under Keegan if he had stayed. Too low and you dis-respect his skills, too high and you shoot every argument about the squad investments in the foot. Tricky one to answer.

There's a difference between an owner who's putting money in and lending to the club from his own resources, and an owner who's taking money out and borrowing against the club's assets at a commercial rate of interest.

According to the Independent, W.Ham would only want to sell Bellamy if they sign a replacement, and "would also want, at least, to recoup close to the record £7.5m spent on him."

Eh? Ashley's done nothing but whinge for months about the money still owed on transfers (as if every club isn't run that same way). Translation: Ashley said something about it once.

Ollie Bernard was the best player on the pitch at the San Siro not so long ago. I bet we could get him back to help out and who cares about his recent form and... oh, hang on.

Nearer two years ago, but more recent than Feyenoord, certainly.

Doesn't prove a damn thing about Bellamy, though. Did Hibbit or Beardsley leave the club under a cloud? When they came back, were either of them in the process of attempting, but not yet succeeding, to regain some kind of form after the kind of injuries Bellamy's been dealing with? If Pedro was sleeping in a high-altitude tent then it's news to me.

I'm sure if we all close our eyes and wish very hard then his form and fitness of six years ago will magically return.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. The idea is to learn from history. Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ? No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool. Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him. it might not have worked out. And Bellamy might work out. You can't tell. This isn't about hindsight, its about making a decision. What do you think ? A 29 year old footballer isn't old. The fact is, we need strengthening, and we have to get the best players possible. If a younger player isn't available who is better and we could get him, why would you say no ? I think it's clear I think he's not a player we need at the moment. There are four specific reasons why in the post you quote. A fifth would be that his position is not one of those that needs strengthening as a priority right now. Why would he come here at the moment anyway? As he's a player who would go straight into the team, I couldn't disagree more. If there are 2 positions we need to strengthen, its in central midfield and up front, with pace in both areas and the desire to make things happen and be a good outlet. Simple fact is Ozzie - you just don't want him back because of his personality, its nothing to do with what he does on the pitch. If you're so damn sure you already know what I think, why waste time asking me questions only to ignore the answers? (And there were at least four other reasons you haven't addressed.)

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion. Of course people look back in the past, it would be wrong not to embrace your history, but even more so at the moment due to the current situation we find ourselves in. Why? Embracing your history is different from wishing you had it back again, and solutions for the future are not found by trying to ressurrect the past.

Well, it's regional for me, too. Newcastle is my home town club. My dad was always trying to get us kids to support Liverpool, but then he dropped a bollock by taking us to SJP and that was that.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion. That's fair enough as well, I don't see how anybody could honestly dispute that as any sort of ridiculous opinion or perspective, although I would argue that it's sort of inbuilt into us as Newcastle supporters and it's inbuilt into the club in the way that players/managers always seem to come back, by hook or by crook. Obviously simply because it happens doesn't mean it's right or that it will "work" for us, but I genuinely believe it's part of the romance of being a NUFC fan and I'm not sure I would want to swap it for a less emotional, more robotic approach, despite it often being the cause of most of our woes. I admire the fact that you can distance yourself enough emotionally from the club to have that sort of opinion, like, as I'm not sure I'm quite mature enough/experienced enough to do it myself. Upthread somewhere I think I used a "girlfriend" analogy. In normal life we all have to learn how to let things go, say "Well it was good while it lasted" and move on. Remaining stuck on a lost love simply isn't healthy. The attitude you describe may well be hard-wired into the romance of being a Toon fan, but if so I'd say it was one of the club's problems. Most of the other fans I speak to -- family and old friends, rather than people on here -- have similar attitudes to my own, though. It's different for me, to be honest, and I'd imagine it's different for NE5 as well based on his perspectives on things. All the lads I talk to about the game reminisce about the "good times", like we've been doing in the thread of the same name on here and the likes of my Granddad and my Dad always hark back to the same sort of times and wish that the same people could be involved and the same effect could occur (Keegan, Shearer, etc.) I tend to agree that it can be a major problem for the club but when harnessed correctly - as has been the case with Keegan in particular on two occasions now (no matter how brief the second was) - it can be the thing that pushes us on and makes us the best that we can be. As with most things I don't think the issue resides at one end of the see-saw, it's more like somewhere in the middle. This topic is a fascinating one, though, and one that you're never going to get everyone agreeing on as it goes far deeper into things such as sociology, psychology, history and emotions than most other topics do. It takes some brains to be able to debate it effectively, basically, and a hell of a lot of time as well. It's one of those things that you can only really philosophise over yourself or talk to with your closest mates (who can actually think along the same lines) about and it's something (like most things regarding NUFC) that we, as individuals, cannot really do anything about - and is probably why things get so heated when discussing it/writing about it, as it comes bundled with a lot of frustration. The whole thing is a massive headfuck, basically, much like anything else that matters in life. I have to say I'm definitely a lot happier since I accepted the fact I cannot change anything regarding NUFC and I just tend to roll with the punches a bit now. Still get that aching in the gut though when things like Keegan-gate occur or when we throw away a 2-0 lead against one of the worst top-flight teams I've ever seen in the flesh (bear in mind I'm a young 'un.) One big difference for me is that my dad was a Liverpool supporter, my Geordie mam didn't care about football, and there were no Geordie uncles or grandparents about. I therefore didn't hear much reminiscing about the club that my brother and I decided to support, and given that my old man had a tendency to crow long and loud about scouser successes (depressingly frequent in those days), discussion of football in our house was always a kind of war. I also don't live in Newcastle and haven't for a long time. My conversations about the club are usually long-distance phone calls and focussed on what's happening right now. Meanwhile, I don't know a single Newcastle fan in the city where I live, and the lack of anyone to share this interest is the main reason I come on here.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. The idea is to learn from history. Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ? No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool. Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him. it might not have worked out. And Bellamy might work out. You can't tell. This isn't about hindsight, its about making a decision. What do you think ? A 29 year old footballer isn't old. The fact is, we need strengthening, and we have to get the best players possible. If a younger player isn't available who is better and we could get him, why would you say no ? I think it's clear I think he's not a player we need at the moment. There are four specific reasons why in the post you quote. A fifth would be that his position is not one of those that needs strengthening as a priority right now. Why would he come here at the moment anyway?

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion. That's fair enough as well, I don't see how anybody could honestly dispute that as any sort of ridiculous opinion or perspective, although I would argue that it's sort of inbuilt into us as Newcastle supporters and it's inbuilt into the club in the way that players/managers always seem to come back, by hook or by crook. Obviously simply because it happens doesn't mean it's right or that it will "work" for us, but I genuinely believe it's part of the romance of being a NUFC fan and I'm not sure I would want to swap it for a less emotional, more robotic approach, despite it often being the cause of most of our woes. I admire the fact that you can distance yourself enough emotionally from the club to have that sort of opinion, like, as I'm not sure I'm quite mature enough/experienced enough to do it myself. Upthread somewhere I think I used a "girlfriend" analogy. In normal life we all have to learn how to let things go, say "Well it was good while it lasted" and move on. Remaining stuck on a lost love simply isn't healthy. The attitude you describe may well be hard-wired into the romance of being a Toon fan, but if so I'd say it was one of the club's problems. Most of the other fans I speak to -- family and old friends, rather than people on here -- have similar attitudes to my own, though.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. The idea is to learn from history. Were you against Peter Beardsley coming back, by the way ? No, that worked out good, but there were different factors at play -- the existing relationship between him and Keegan and how that overlapping history translated into an extremely effective communication between bench and pitch regarding a particular style of play, which was to some extent influenced by both players' experience at Liverpool. Even if Bellamy a) wasn't so plagued by injury that he's been sleeping in a high-altitude tent, b) wasn't currently in very poor goal-scoring form and b) didn't already have a soured and divisive relationship to the club, I'd also doubt whether Joe "Crazy Gang" Kinnear was the right manager to get the best out of him.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like. Apologies if that is genuinely the case, but it's the impression I get from you the majority of the time in here, whereas in Gen Chat you make fantastic posts like the one about Morocco earlier on. Apology accepted. My posts on Bellamy here may sound a bit sarcastic, because they are, but I am trying to make a point too, and it's a point that I often try to make in a roundabout way -- that we spend far too much time living in the past and mooning around wishfully over long-departed players and managers. Bellamy is history. He should stay that way. Morocco... well, I was in a position to be helpful, so I tried to be. Different kind of discussion.

To be honest, I was just saying what I think when asked the question in the thread header. Sorry, like.

Craig Bellamy scored 27 goals in 87 league starts, a strike rate of 31% Your idol Tinababy scored 9 goals in league 36 starts, a strke rate of 25%, But don't let facts get in the way of your opinion, whatever you do. This is another direct comment in keeping with the thread, but I bet you ignore it as usual One goal in ten starts this season. Fact! The past is gone. You simply don't understand that, do you? Wrong circumstance, wrong players around him. Who knows. One thing you learn if you follow football, is that talent doesn't leave you at 29, and just right now, we are struggling to find effective forward players. He'd also have different players around him here to the ones he had around him five years ago at the time of your ancient stats. Fact!

Craig Bellamy scored 27 goals in 87 league starts, a strike rate of 31% Your idol Tinababy scored 9 goals in league 36 starts, a strke rate of 25%, But don't let facts get in the way of your opinion, whatever you do. This is another direct comment in keeping with the thread, but I bet you ignore it as usual One goal in ten starts this season. Fact! The past is gone. You simply don't understand that, do you?