Cronky

I think you make a good point about Beardsley. His decline, when it came, was fairly rapid. He was a crucial player for us and his replacement was a bigger priority than another centre forward. The gap he left was only filled when Bellamy came. I'd also agree that the Shearer - Ferdinand partnership had its limitations. It seemed to end up with Ferdinand tending to drop into more withdrawn positions, which never suited him. He was an out and out centre forward and nothing else. It was logical to replace him with Tomasson, but then we had Shearer's injury and Tomasson never really had much chance after that, having to play with Asprilla or Ketsbaia.

It sounds like a sensible buy in our circumstances - we aren't able to buy players, so we've brought in an ambitious young centre back with potential. He'll be stepping up a grade, but this is something that he's achieved before so he may do so again. It sounds like a gamble, but one worth taking. It's a little worrying that his positional play is a bit suspect, because in our league a centre back only has to be slightly out of position or slow to react and the consequences are dire. On the other hand, he shouldn't have a problem winning challenges. The Premiership is a very different environment, so I hope that if he makes a few slip-ups to start off with, the crowd doesn't get on his back.

Agreed! People on here say that Shearer made a mistake coming here!! Only he could possibly answer that. Jesus wept man have you not heard of something called loyalty?? There are those of us who if we did manage to play for the club that we love and support would not leave and play for another club guaranteed trophy's or no bloody trophy's!! Loyalty is a dying thing in football and it sadens me big time seeing greed and disloyalty grow so unbelievably big its actually accepted by some . I admire the Shearers, Le Tissers and Steve Bulls of this world who stayed loyal to their clubs, when they could have taken the bigger club, better pay and trophy's. Players like them should be admired and congratulated for taking a stand. Presumably this loyal player is the one who threatened to leave if he wasn't guaranteed a first team place, right? Pressumably this is a fact that you can prove and not half baked gossip/hearsay?? Who in their right mind would drop Shearer in his hayday anyway (bar Guillit)?? It was a bit more than gossip or hearsay. It was a quote from a newspaper interview. You can believe that the journalist was making it up if you like, but earlier on in the season Shearer had publicly complained when he was rested for the Valerenga game. And if you read Sir Bob's book, it's obvious that there was difficulty between the two men that season over the issue of him playing every game.

West Ham look to be still in trouble. There was plenty of effort and passion, but I can't see how they're going to score enough goals. Their one goal tonight was the result of a foul on Pennant.

Agreed! People on here say that Shearer made a mistake coming here!! Only he could possibly answer that. Jesus wept man have you not heard of something called loyalty?? There are those of us who if we did manage to play for the club that we love and support would not leave and play for another club guaranteed trophy's or no bloody trophy's!! Loyalty is a dying thing in football and it sadens me big time seeing greed and disloyalty grow so unbelievably big its actually accepted by some . I admire the Shearers, Le Tissers and Steve Bulls of this world who stayed loyal to their clubs, when they could have taken the bigger club, better pay and trophy's. Players like them should be admired and congratulated for taking a stand. Presumably this loyal player is the one who threatened to leave if he wasn't guaranteed a first team place, right?

Ah, my favourite subject. I see it as a gamble that didn't pay off. When you put so much of your transfer kitty into one player, there's a risk that he'll get injured, and that's what happened. He did really well to get back to some sort of fitness (although he'd lost some pace), and we had two great seasons with him and Bellamy up front, but that's about it. Then I think age and the accumulative effect of a number of injuries caught up with him. Unfortunately, by then he'd become bigger than the club and that led to the disastrous policy of keeping him as a first team regular right up to his retirement. A great manager and three seasons went down the drain. It boils down to whether the £15 million would have been better spent in another way and with hindsight you'd have to say yes. I'd agree that the defence and the right wing were the priorities.

I'm a supporter of several years standing myself, and for most of that time the club was run by a group of committed local people who were convinced that they were the only ones who could run the club. Unfortunately, they weren't able to make the kind of investment that other clubs were making, and we slipped behind. It took a lot of effort and determination to get these people out. Looks to me like history is repeating itself.

Which Chairman of a top division club once publicly advocated post-match violence?

It's an interesting question. I'd say Boumsong, with Mirandinha and Marcelino close behind. I really did have high expectations of Boumsong, and right from the start he disappointed.

If money is tight because of some poor decisions made previously, then that's one dimension to the problem. I feel that the finger points at Shepherd, but at the same time he wouldn't be the only chairman to have made mistakes. But what for me is totally unacceptable is that a few weeks ago, when he was under open pressure from the fans and a takeover looked like a possibility, he said that funds would be made available to Roeder to strengthen the side, 'as had always happened with managers in the past'. It now looked like he was bullshitting his way out of a difficult situation by easing the pressure on himself, and that's just not the sort of person to be running our club.

And, the people behind the deal would know this how? I'm just saying, those people who say they are unhappy would they be unhappy if he had played half the games and been in top form. So which camp are you in? I'm glad we signed Owen, just monumental bad luck has seen him not play regularly. But I don't begrudge his signing in the first place for that reason. However much I'd like to. I think he was a good signing, just we have been unlucky. I think the price was acceptable and nobody would be moaning if he hadn't been injured. I've said it before from 4th down the rest of the league is a much of a muchness and with Owen fit we are easilt a top 6 team. More than any other incident, the Owen transfer was a demonstration of Freddie's complete incompetence in running a major football club. As I recall, the chain of events was that Liverpool had bid around £8 million. Owen had declared that he would join Liverpool, but only go to us on a loan basis. We then put in a bid of £17 million to make it impossible for Madrid to accept Liverpool's offer, and to put Owen in the position where he'd either have to join us, or stay in Real's reserves for a year, prior to a World Cup. On top of that, we had to provide a huge salary of around £5 million pa before he'd agree to come. No other major club was interested, and we clearly paid over the odds. Every transfer is a gamble, because the player can get injured or lose form. The likes of Chelsea can gamble with £17 million, but we can't. Freddie's understanding of football is limited, and he thinks in terms of buying star names rather than building a team. For sure, Souness wanted Owen, but surely not at the expense of other considerations. Not only was Freddie's behaviour morally dodgy, it was foolish. We're still paying the price now.

As I pointed out to you yesterday, why would a man name a player that he was 48 hours away from signing, have the move vetoed by either his board or the selling club and then come out with "It has come to light that this player is rubbish and is no better than what we've got." He wouldn't because it makes him look like a fucking idiot. So I think we can safely say that you're wrong about that one and that the reason we didn't get him is because some kind soul saved Roeder's arse by pointing out that he was shit. Either that, or the transfer proposal was initially set up by Shepherd, perhaps after contact from an agent. Roeder then looks into the idea, and decides against.

It doesn't sit very well with Shepherd's comment that all the uncertainty over a takeover had made it difficult to buy players because clubs were asking for more money than players were worth. If we've got no money in the first place, it doesn't make any difference. Perish the thought, but it looks like he was trying to set the Halls up for the blame when no-one is brought in. I'm sure there's some other explanation.

No surprises here. Shepherd didn't work in an open and honest manner with the last two managers so it's hardly likely that he's changed his style. The longer-term concern is that clubs like Spurs, Villa, and West Ham now seem to have more spending power in the transfer market. We've already slipped behind the big four since Shepherd took over. Now we're being overtaken by other clubs who have undergone a change of ownership. As long as this fool remains in charge, we'll become a less and less attractive proposition to any future owner. I think Sir John Hall has sussed out that Freddie isn't the right man and we're going nowhere fast with him. The only consolation is that their relationship is probably damaged beyond repair, and he and Douggie may decide to bale out on their own.

I do believe he is set to become the only player to have played for five different clubs who have won the European Cup, but who is without a European Cup winners medal himself. Tell your friends.

Nobody is forcing Roeder to do the "within 48 hours", "pole position" speeches. I'd be happier hearing nothing from him if the alternative is desperate half-truths designed to appease. What would you do if a microphone and camera were shoved in your face, mate? I'd tell them to fuck off. For Roeder, a simple no comment or 'we are doing our best and you will be the first to hear if we make any progress' might suffice. That's just as bad! The point is, there is no right answer until a transfer is complete. I don't see the reason to get all bent out of shape over some comments made to give Anal something to write about. I think Roeder ought to have learned his lesson by now and button it a bit. But the main point is that it's Shepherd, not Roeder, who is responsible for transfers and he's not working well with his manager. The same problem arose with Robson and Souness. So many posts seem to blame Roeder and I can't believe that after all that's happened over the last few seasons, people aren't a bit more savvy about this.

No chance at all. Why should Man U sell an important squad player when they're chasing three trophies in the final half of the season. Besides, we can't afford him.

I think the problem is we've got no money, but Shepherd isn't being any more honest with Roeder than he is with the fans. Despite the waffle, all we can hope for is some Sibierski-type stop gap signings. The lack of honest communication between Shepherd and Roeder means that the manager is constantly making a fool of himself by raising expectations.

When you look at the situation he inherited, where he took us to, and what's happened after he left, his ability can't be questioned. I don't like the word 'legend', but he was the best manager we've had by far.

The fact that we 'want to have a look at him' before signing him on loan doesn't sound too promising. It all points to a player who's nearing the end of his career and who can't get into the first team at his current club.

Sorry to be a pessimist, but prices are bound to be higher in January and we don't have the money, except for some short-term or loan deals for stop-gaps.

JPD - fair point on the issue of Merseyside. Perhaps it's more true to say that the cities of Birmingham and London, with large ethnic minority populations, have an advantage over the rest. On Brummie's point - I can remember reading a piece of research that was published in a paper about 20 years ago, on the subject of the origins by region of English professional footballers. Every region produced roughly the same number of players per head of population, with the exception of the North-East, where the figure was about twice the average. Until recent times, there's been very little local competition from Cricket and Rugby for the interest of children. That may have been a factor.

The Owen transfer is the one above all that has really killed us. We're not big enough to be taking the risk of £17 million plus £5 million a year on one player. Shepherd had the idea that if you get England's top goalscorer then you'll end up with England's top team, but unfortunately football is a bit more complicated than that. (Not to mention players can get injured) On the area of youth development, I have wondered whether, as an area, the North East is at a bit of a disadvantage. There's a lot of athletic talent in the Black British population, which is apparent in the players coming through at other big city clubs. Tyneside doesn't have a particularly large ethnic minority population. I've not forgotten Shola. But he's the exception, not the rule.

I don't think we've got £9 million to spend or anything like. The bit about 'we always back our managers' is crap. We spent nothing last January, and from the way we were carrying on at the end of the last transfer window, trying to sell Milner to fund a bid for a centre back, there's unlikely to be much leeway now.

My reading of it is that the Halls want to sell, but they don't want to act unilaterally and they've been trying to do everything jointly with Shepherd. They'd get a far better deal if they sold both sets of shares together because then the new people would be in a position to get the 75% of shares needed to take complete control, and not just the 51% needed for a majority shareholding. Shepherd wants to stay in charge, and so a joint sale has been doomed to fail. Freddie has now thrown down the gauntlet, challenging the Halls to either go it alone with a sale, or throw in their lot with him. The bit about it being difficult to run the club with all this going on, and clubs demanding higher transfer fees, is just bullshit.