Unbelievable

Arsenal reject went to a lower league club and came here for less than £2 million. http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/4953/andycoleeg1.th.jpg Exactly the type of signing we need to be looking for. We have no chance of getting players that played at Euro 2008 (unless they were s****) and young british players who are already being talked about in the press (like that lad from Cardiff that Arsenal signed). Somehow we have to get lucky and unearth a couple of gems (Rob Lee is another of this type) then we can push on and in a couple of season become an attractive propostion for the better known talent Geez, and they call us, the ones calling for a bit of ambition, doom mongers. After reading that I think we've all got it the wrong way around.. The people in the positive mood camp are not positive at all, they are mentally prepared for mediocrity.. On a more serious note, we are still a very attractive Premiership club and many players would jump at the chance to join us, no matter how much Shitteam will have you believe otherwise. It's just a matter of the people in charge of the club showing the required level of ambition in attracting new players, i.e. ones that will allow us to move forward.. How were Andy Cole and Rob Lee mediocre ? I didn't say that, did I? I refered to your 'we have to get lucky and unearth a few gems' mentality.. Err, we are not Hull City you know, we are Newcastle United. We have a big name, a good reputation and a billionaire owner, hence I think we can afford to set our sights a little bit higher than attracting relative nobodies for pennies in the hope that they turn out to be the next Rob Lee or Andy Cole. Capiche?

I agree and I'd like to see us in for him especially if it's a battle between Villa and Spurs. Unfortunately I think he's got ideas above our station now, and will probably see those two as better bets. This. We need to make a signing that the above two are in for, because all of the signals I'm getting this summer are that we're a mile behind even these two clubs when it comes to where players would sign. Exactly. As you can see though, even Dave is resigned to losing out on a player if it comes to a 3-way fight between those clubs and us, which is incredible and would have justly been laughed off a mere few months ago.

Arsenal reject went to a lower league club and came here for less than £2 million. http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/4953/andycoleeg1.th.jpg Exactly the type of signing we need to be looking for. We have no chance of getting players that played at Euro 2008 (unless they were s****) and young british players who are already being talked about in the press (like that lad from Cardiff that Arsenal signed). Somehow we have to get lucky and unearth a couple of gems (Rob Lee is another of this type) then we can push on and in a couple of season become an attractive propostion for the better known talent Geez, and they call us, the ones calling for a bit of ambition, doom mongers. After reading that I think we've all got it the wrong way around.. The people in the positive mood camp are not positive at all, they are mentally prepared for mediocrity.. On a more serious note, we are still a very attractive Premiership club and many players would jump at the chance to join us, no matter how much Shitteam will have you believe otherwise. It's just a matter of the people in charge of the club showing the required level of ambition in attracting new players, i.e. ones that will allow us to move forward..

Absolute nonsense and you know it.. Now a top class player for 12 million and we would be having a different debate.. i don't think its nonsense at all. i think he's absoloutely spot on. Well we haven't splashed out 12 million for him have we, so it's a complete non debate. Personally, if we would have thrown away 12 million on a player of his credentials I would have been far more unhappy than I currently am about signing two 'meh' players when we really need to inject some quality in the side.. What are his credentials? How much have you seen him play? In his mid twenties, never caught the eye of a big European club, a complete fringe player for his country and no outstanding statistics in terms of goal scoring or creating. If we would have paid 12 million for a relatively unknow player with those credentials I wouldn't have been happy.. Would you? That's a "never" then. Btw you've just described one: http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/350/robertnew2wf1.jpg and we paid £10m for him seven years ago and he was f***ing brilliant. You've also described David "tug tug tug" Bentley as well. And Andrei Arshavin. That's fair enough Wullie. Some players take their time to blossom and as I've said before, Gutierrez may turn out to be a very good player for us. I certainly hope so. Doesn't mean any player with those questionnable credentials will be a success does it?

Absolute nonsense and you know it.. Now a top class player for 12 million and we would be having a different debate.. i don't think its nonsense at all. i think he's absoloutely spot on. Well we haven't splashed out 12 million for him have we, so it's a complete non debate. Personally, if we would have thrown away 12 million on a player of his credentials I would have been far more unhappy than I currently am about signing two 'meh' players when we really need to inject some quality in the side.. What are his credentials? How much have you seen him play? In his mid twenties, never caught the eye of a big European club, a complete fringe player for his country and no outstanding statistics in terms of goal scoring or creating. If we would have paid 12 million for a relatively unknow player with those credentials I wouldn't have been happy.. Would you? Is it not you who would say in Keegan we trust so he must have seen something others have not which makes him worth 12 million.. As I have said time and time again, it's not about the money, it's about the level of player and the more importantly our ambition. This argument about spending money to shut up the people with concerns is only made by people who are perfectly happy with our signings so far. I'm fairly certain most people who remain concerned are of this opinion: by spending money you show ambition, but there is no need to spend more money than you need as long as you get the right targets in. The problem at the moment isn't the former, it's the latter..

Good shout.. Doesn't seem physical enough from what i saw of him for chelsea That must be why the nicknamed him the canibal in the German league, which is known for being very physical..

See Smith, Alan. You're having a laugh.. Please dig up my comments when we signed this fuckwit you mention for reference.. He may have been in a side that was in the CL semis, but that doesn't mean he's in the same bracket as Park..

Good shout..

The Park that was PSV's best player for two straight seasons in which they reached the quarter and semi finals of the Champions League, earning him a transfer to one of the biggest clubs in the world where he has done reasonably well? Yes, I think he's a step above anything we have in midfield at the moment and not entirely unrealistic..

Absolute nonsense and you know it.. Now a top class player for 12 million and we would be having a different debate.. i don't think its nonsense at all. i think he's absoloutely spot on. Well we haven't splashed out 12 million for him have we, so it's a complete non debate. Personally, if we would have thrown away 12 million on a player of his credentials I would have been far more unhappy than I currently am about signing two 'meh' players when we really need to inject some quality in the side..

Depends whether you give a toss about actually playing or not I suppose. He had been playing before hadn't he..? If it was just about playing he would have signed a new contract with Bolton. He went away to move up in the world and he did. Take Guthrie, are you saying he shouldn't have signed for us when we offered him a contract, because he is not likely to figure in the first team much next season? Should he have gone to Fulham because they would have probably guaranteed him a first team place, or did he make the right decision to come here and take a chance? Chelsea - some of the best players in the league if not the world in Ben Haim's position. Newcastle - Geremi, someone currently in jail, Butt, er...Smith? Spot the difference. I thought you were convinced we were going to be bringing in some first team players for the midfield? I am pretty convinced, yeah. Do you think Keegan told Guthrie that when trying to get him to sign? In any case, they're still not going to be the midfield equivalent of Terry and Carvalho, are they? I would hope that for an uninspiring signing that Guthrie is (below average Premiership midfielder with supposed promise due to his age) the competition for his place that we are trying to bring in will be at least as much of a quality gap as there is between a very good Premiership defender and a world class defender, otherwise we're fucked..

I think it's fair to say we would have been and probably were willing to pay them at least the same wages Chelsea do considering they are squad players. What will they be on, somewhere near the 50k mark, that's what we pay players of their calibre as well. They went there to be part of a top football club in the world, possibly win a few trophies and have the chance the dreamt of as little boys to play at the highest possible level. Is it really that painful for Newcastle fans to consider players would rather go to a better club if offered similar wages than come here? I would find that slightly irronic considering money is one of the few things we've got going for us when it comes to attracting players nowadays. Is there something wrong with being ambitious and wanting to earn good money while trying to constantly improve at what you do, because if there is count me in as being guilty,,

Depends whether you give a toss about actually playing or not I suppose. He had been playing before hadn't he..? If it was just about playing he would have signed a new contract with Bolton. He went away to move up in the world and he did. Take Guthrie, are you saying he shouldn't have signed for us when we offered him a contract, because he is not likely to figure in the first team much next season? Should he have gone to Fulham because they would have probably guaranteed him a first team place, or did he make the right decision to come here and take a chance? Chelsea - some of the best players in the league if not the world in Ben Haim's position. Newcastle - Geremi, someone currently in jail, Butt, er...Smith? Spot the difference. I thought you were convinced we were going to be bringing in some first team players for the midfield?

Depends whether you give a toss about actually playing or not I suppose. He had been playing before hadn't he..? If it was just about playing he would have signed a new contract with Bolton. He went away to move up in the world and he did. Take Guthrie, are you saying he shouldn't have signed for us when we offered him a contract, because he is not likely to figure in the first team much next season? Should he have gone to Fulham because they would have probably guaranteed him a first team place, or did he make the right decision to come here and take a chance? I reckon Guthrie will get a lot more chances than Ben Haim has at Chelsea. We will see, but if he does indeed you have to wonder if we as a club are moving in the right direction..

Absolute nonsense and you know it.. Now a top class player for 12 million and we would be having a different debate..

Depends whether you give a toss about actually playing or not I suppose. He had been playing before hadn't he..? If it was just about playing he would have signed a new contract with Bolton. He went away to move up in the world and he did. Take Guthrie, are you saying he shouldn't have signed for us when we offered him a contract, because he is not likely to figure in the first team much next season? Should he have gone to Fulham because they would have probably guaranteed him a first team place, or did he make the right decision to come here and take a chance?

Can't say he's ever looked that good to me. Would have taken him on a free the other year but he chased the cash like Sidwell IMO; never stood a chance of getting in before Terry and Carvalho. That´s easy for us to say on the sidelines isn´t it? As a player you just want the chance to prove yourself at the highest level possible and, yes, maybe earn a decent wage while you´re at it. People go on like going to Chelsea is just about the money way too much. It´s not like a top player going to a Middle East club when they´re competing for every trophy around is it..? A cynic would argue players that cho(o)se us over other clubs went for the money rather than for sporting reasons.. As a free transfer from Bolton, if he honestly thought he would get in the Chelsea team ahead of club captain John Terry and £20m Ricardo Carvalho - one of the best defenders in the world - I wouldn't want him as he's clearly a mentalist. You'd have to be a mentalist to not move from a club like Bolton to a club like Chelsea when given the chance..

Can't say he's ever looked that good to me. Would have taken him on a free the other year but he chased the cash like Sidwell IMO; never stood a chance of getting in before Terry and Carvalho. That´s easy for us to say on the sidelines isn´t it? As a player you just want the chance to prove yourself at the highest level possible and, yes, maybe earn a decent wage while you´re at it. People go on like going to Chelsea is just about the money way too much. It´s not like a top player going to a Middle East club when they´re competing for every trophy around is it..? A cynic would argue players that cho(o)se us over other clubs went for the money rather than for sporting reasons.. Sadly in a number of cases you have those two things the wrong way round. Huh?

Can't say he's ever looked that good to me. Would have taken him on a free the other year but he chased the cash like Sidwell IMO; never stood a chance of getting in before Terry and Carvalho. That´s easy for us to say on the sidelines isn´t it? As a player you just want the chance to prove yourself at the highest level possible and, yes, maybe earn a decent wage while you´re at it. People go on like going to Chelsea is just about the money way too much. It´s not like a top player going to a Middle East club when they´re competing for every trophy around is it..? A cynic would argue players that cho(o)se us over other clubs went for the money rather than for sporting reasons..

Much better off with personalities like Barton and Smith..

And half of the rest I wouldnt want here. For someone who preaches about not getting the quality in there's some average players on that list IMO Examples please.. Besides, there will always be some players I rate and you don't and vice versa. That is hardly the point is it? The players on that list are invariably a level or two above players like Guthrie..

Oh well, in that case another illustration of my point about needing to move early..

Never heard of him. You say you remain unconvinced by the club, fair enough. So who would convince you? Well, if you insist, here´s my ambitious yet not entirely unrealistic target list, just from the two leagues I know reasonably well. I would expect the club to be able to identify many more targets of this calibre from leagues I don´t follow like in South America, France, Portugal, Germany, Italy, Turkey etc. Bentley SWP Morten Gamst Pedersen McCarthy Santa Cruz Diouf Ben Haim Anelka Arteta Benayoun Park Zarate Ashton Bent Aissati Nuri Sahin De Guzman Luigi Bruins And before anybody starts, no, I wouldn´t expect us to sign all these players, but this is the kind of level we should be aiming at. And yes, most will not come cheap, which is why investment is needed. And no, there are no guarantees that these players will be succesful if they move to us, but them being good players to begin with helps.. It´s getting harder to come up with these lists though, because a number of players that could have been on there have already moved to other clubs or committed their futures to their current club (Modric, Crouch, Sulejmani, Dunne, Farfan, just to name a few). Of course it seems target we thought we would have a chance with are now beyond our reach as well (Bentley possibly, Arshavin, Arda Turan seemingly). Which is exactly why it is important to identify targets and move early in the transfer window.

`Pacify you´..

My personal outlay? I have had a season ticket for two years when I lived in Newcastle. Since moving back to Holland I have gone to matches whenever I am in the region, which is about once every two months. I have also subscribed to a paid television station here that broadcasts nearly all Newcastle matches, and would gladly pay to watch a match online if there is no other way. Does it matter to my argument? Is this the only hole you can pick in it? It´s a good thing you are never online during our matches or you would look a little silly asking that question.. It was a simple question that you answered, thanks. No need to be so defensive about it. I'm online during games I don't go to btw, which is half of the home games (I share an ST) and most of the away ones. Ok