Lenny

he's such a cunt.

In an ideal world, we'd give McClaren a chance but keep the heat on Ashley. Dunno how we'd achieve that though

Stop making the best of it and view it for what it actually is? Well that's it really, there's no right way to look at it. You can either remain cynical and disillusioned by an underwhelming and expected appointment, or you can try and find a glimmer of hope that the new guy is going to come in and improve us. I'm not going to tell anyone which way to look at it as everyone's entitled to view it as they please, and are also well within their rights to remain cynical given the shite we've been through. Personally though, I'm fed up with both wanting us to lose and even when I don't want us to lose, having to put up with shocking football. At this moment I'm going to look for that glimmer of hope.

Personally I'm no giving him any benefit of the doubt. Which is kind of against my general outlook on life, where I trust until someone does something that loses that trust. For this guy, I'm definitely in the camp I was in with Carver, where I knew it was going to be crap. There is a slight difference here, though as I am sure he will have a spell where people are sucked into thinking, like they were with Pardew, "well he's actually pretty good, I was wrong". There was no chance whatsover of that happening under Carver. Anyway another ill advised appointment in a key position, it's what we do, and we seem to continue to do it despite being burned by the experience over and over again. I really think this is a miles better appointment that Pardew. Pardew had been out of the game for a fair while (for a reason, he was s****) and if we start to think "he's actually pretty good" about McClaren, it's not that we've been sucked in, it's because he's actually half decent. Is he really that much better than Pardew ? Pardew got West Ham to a cup final (that people took more seriously than the league cup that McLaren won) and was only an injury time goal away from actually winning it. What is McLaren best final league position in this country as opposed to Pardew's ? Outside of that one season with Twente and of course the league cup win backed up with the UEFA cup final, the highlight of his career has been nearly getting Derby promoted. Something that Mick Mc, Steve Bruce, Paul Jewel, Chris Hughton and a bunch of other world beating managers succeed at. His last success of any kind is 5 years ago, but his last success in this country is some 10 years ago, he is a washed up has been or even never was that's made a career from being Alex Ferguson's assistant during their spell of dominance. He should never have been considered for this role, his appointment is not acceptable, but I can sense the general feeling here is moving towards, "he's the best we could have hoped for, and at least it's not Carver". Sad really. You realise you've just excluded every one of his achievements to come to the conclusion that he's no better than Pardew, right? Outside of his success at Twente/outside of winning the league cup/outside of getting into the UEFA cup final... You've excluded 3 achievements greater than the achievement you've listed as McClaren's greatest achievement. I don't think he's a spectacular appointment by any stretch, but I also don't think he's just a case of "well, he's better than Carver". Given where we are at this time, he's a step in the right direction. He's a manager that's had some success, and has been seen to play a style of football that the fans might actually like. It's not ideal as we all know we should be aiming much higher in ideal circumstances (i.e. Ashley has fucked off), but it's a step in the right direction (in my opinion, of course). Also, has it been confirmed he's having to keep the existing staff? I think I missed that.

Personally I'm no giving him any benefit of the doubt. Which is kind of against my general outlook on life, where I trust until someone does something that loses that trust. For this guy, I'm definitely in the camp I was in with Carver, where I knew it was going to be crap. There is a slight difference here, though as I am sure he will have a spell where people are sucked into thinking, like they were with Pardew, "well he's actually pretty good, I was wrong". There was no chance whatsover of that happening under Carver. Anyway another ill advised appointment in a key position, it's what we do, and we seem to continue to do it despite being burned by the experience over and over again. I really think this is a miles better appointment that Pardew. Pardew had been out of the game for a fair while (for a reason, he was shite) and if we start to think "he's actually pretty good" about McClaren, it's not that we've been sucked in, it's because he's actually half decent. Only about 2-3 months iirc. It just felt like that because he was dossing around in League One like he should be. Was that all it was? For some reason I thought it was a couple of years. God knows where I got that from. Aye, sacked by Saints at the end of August, took our job beginning of December. must have been because he was in League One, as you say.

Personally I'm no giving him any benefit of the doubt. Which is kind of against my general outlook on life, where I trust until someone does something that loses that trust. For this guy, I'm definitely in the camp I was in with Carver, where I knew it was going to be crap. There is a slight difference here, though as I am sure he will have a spell where people are sucked into thinking, like they were with Pardew, "well he's actually pretty good, I was wrong". There was no chance whatsover of that happening under Carver. Anyway another ill advised appointment in a key position, it's what we do, and we seem to continue to do it despite being burned by the experience over and over again. I really think this is a miles better appointment that Pardew. Pardew had been out of the game for a fair while (for a reason, he was shite) and if we start to think "he's actually pretty good" about McClaren, it's not that we've been sucked in, it's because he's actually half decent. Only about 2-3 months iirc. It just felt like that because he was dossing around in League One like he should be. Was that all it was? For some reason I thought it was a couple of years. God knows where I got that from.

Personally I'm no giving him any benefit of the doubt. Which is kind of against my general outlook on life, where I trust until someone does something that loses that trust. For this guy, I'm definitely in the camp I was in with Carver, where I knew it was going to be crap. There is a slight difference here, though as I am sure he will have a spell where people are sucked into thinking, like they were with Pardew, "well he's actually pretty good, I was wrong". There was no chance whatsover of that happening under Carver. Anyway another ill advised appointment in a key position, it's what we do, and we seem to continue to do it despite being burned by the experience over and over again. I really think this is a miles better appointment that Pardew. Pardew had been out of the game for a fair while (for a reason, he was shite) and if we start to think "he's actually pretty good" about McClaren, it's not that we've been sucked in, it's because he's actually half decent.

His collapse at Derby coincided with our interest in him, which suggests he lost focus. I personally think that had Derby finished in the same position, but there was no outside interference from us, they would have stood by him. I think they let him go because they don't think he's fully committed and his head was turned by the interest we showed (regardless of whether he ultimately turned us down or not).

I think I hated seeing his name on the team sheet more than I hated seeing Alan Smith's.

Think that's a fair assessment, other that him being on par with Pardew ability wise.

He was awful for pretty much the entirety of his time with us but for a couple of half decent performances after returning from Birmingham on loan.

Agreed.

I'm willing to give him a chance, and whilst he likely won't tear up any trees I'm confident he won't set the team up to pump the ball up field at every opportunity. At this point in time I just want to see us occasionally play something that resembles half decent football. It may be a "beaten down" attitude, and obviously I want more, but we are where we are at the moment, and McClaren is a half decent manager.

wat

Spot on,( with slight addition. ) We shouldn't be in a situation where keeping Jonas has much attraction. Unfortunately and disgracefully we are, due to mismanagement of the club. Seems stupid to get shot of the one player who has shown bottle, effort and anything approaching skill for months now. As we are so allergic to signing players, it begs the question who the fuck is going to play for us next season?!? Exactly

Don't think he's good enough and don't really know how much influence he has on the playing staff so I'm not bothered by this one.

Think we've made a mistake releasing him. He's shown enough since returning to suggest he's capable of being a member of a squad that is without doubt going to be short of numbers next season. Thats before considering the positive influence and experience he will offer.

underwhelming, but I'd give him a fair crack.

It just can't be true, there is literally no footballing logic to it. He's already there and cheap, that's it. He surely can't have convinced Charnley and co that the entire thing was due to him being short of players and injuries etc. can he? They can't be that clueless? I really don't think so. Ashley said in his interview that he didn't expect us to be in this situation at Christmas and that from now on we make our own luck. Doesn't sound like something a bloke ready to appoint the reason for our shite position would say. The only thing that makes me not 100% certain he's not getting it is because it's us. I think I'll lose faith in humanity itself if they give him the job after these last few months, jesus I'm not even thinking about it as a possibility tbh, I just can't, it would literally end all hope

It just can't be true, there is literally no footballing logic to it. He's already there and cheap, that's it. He surely can't have convinced Charnley and co that the entire thing was due to him being short of players and injuries etc. can he? They can't be that clueless? I really don't think so. Ashley said in his interview that he didn't expect us to be in this situation at Christmas and that from now on we make our own luck. Doesn't sound like something a bloke ready to appoint the reason for our shite position would say. The only thing that makes me not 100% certain he's not getting it is because it's us.

I don't think he'll get it.

Nah, he's not a bad footballer when he wants to play.

Looks like it says SEXY

I hope he gets one too. He can do a job as a squad player in the state he's in. He's in better shape than I've seen him for a few years. Problem is with is that if he gets a contract he'll be a regular.

That's how I read it. Not that I thought Carver was in with a shout after dragging us to the brink of relegation. Yep, I mean of course with us you can't rule anything out - but it's not likely IMO.