Robster

Wise was following the programme Keegan wasn't. It's hardly surprising Ashley came down on his side, I doubt personality had much to do with it. Ashley is running the club as a business, that much is clear. I'm just not convinced anyone else who comes in won't do any different, unless they put the club into debt. That's what has happened at Liverpool and Man U and they have far bigger income resources than us. I thought it was Wise not following the programme that caused Keegan to have his tantrum

It's certainly not closure for me. Not the way it has all ended. I dont know what to think at the minute if I am honest. Sometimes I think about whats gone and I get frustrated that he walked, then when I see a picture of him in toon gear like in your avatar, I just feel sad he isnt here any more and that it ended so shite for him. Whatever his flaws, he doesnt deserve to leave the club this way. Its just not right

Ashley might want to hope he doesnt get another Premier League job any time soon. Be fucking chaos at SJP when he came back

We talk about this emotional attachment to Keegan now but it has been suggested that we have never really let go since he was here the last time and his shadow over the club has been one of the reason of our inability to maintain any decent standards since. Maybe this latest episode is our "closure" ?

Ah but he can work withint the structure remember

I agree in part. I think the manager will only take flack if he was someone who was intrinsicly linked to Ashley/Wise... like Poyet or just plain shite like O'Leary However, if for example Zico was sitting in the dug out, I think he would get whole hearted support.

Anyone know what happened at that time. Did we not follow it up? I know I had a feelinghe would have been a good choice and was disappointed when he didnt get the job. I have no idea why I had a good feeling about him. I have no knowledge of him or his managerial abilities

Subconsiously, I think most people are angry at Keegan but just cant bring themselves to either admit it or accept it. I would openly hold my hands up and admit to being one of those. Its hard to blame those that you hold so much affection for. Its just human emotion. So people take it out on someone else, an easier target. Its up to Ashley to get it right this time, to prove his system and his staff work and to maybe put this whole story to bed. The pressure is on. I hope for the clubs and all our sakes he does.

This summers influx of south american/spanish speakers is maybe a hint as to where they may be directing their search for a new man. I have a feeling your fears will be realised.

I am absolutely fed up of the word "source"

Am i a dumb cunt ??

tbf, there's not much written about this situation one way or another that isn't ridiculous hyperbole these days. "SHOOT ASHLEY IN THE FACE WITH A ROTTWEILER, SACK WISE, COME BACK KK", blah blah blah. It's all gotten rather boring. No, what's got boring is the fact that we have bent over and taken it up the arses from the club for the last 10 years or so. That's the point though isn't it, it's a different regime now and they shou;dn't have to take the backlash for what has gone before them - no matter how bad it was. The backlash is nothing to do with previous regimes it's of their own making. Totally ignoring key areas we needed cover. Undermining the Manager forcing him to resign. Screwing up season tickets and ripping fans off with the vision they thought they were buying into over the next 3 years. Lack of communication and respect for the paying public. Disrupting the dressing room with word that everyone was up for sale. I'd say quite a few of their own there like. I don't want to use this thread to go through all of those points again, as it's obvious people just have opposite viewpoints on a lot of that - both based on a lot of speculation and not a lot of fact. All I'm saying is that the overly-dramatic reaction to what has happened this week has a lot to do with what has gone before... Souness, Allardyce, our decline over recent seasons. Why else would anyone mention the last 10 years? As far as I'm concerned that has nothing to do with what is happening now. I think the reason people are referring to the last 10 years is because despite the complete change of ownership/personnel, absolutely nothing has changed. We are still completely fucked up as a football club. If you had gone to the moon for 2 years, in coming back, you would have thought that the ownership hadnt changed at all. I would guess that when Ashley came in,nearly everyone hoped it would be an end of the choas that seemed to constantly surround. Basically, nothing has changed nor seemingly impreoved with Ashley being in charge.

No not really. I think most people know that his attitude certainly added to the problem. He generally gets the benfit of any doubt though. Just up to people to decide whether he has earned that right. Its just about who was trying to do things in the best interests of the club. We have to hope that they all were but there was a clash over the way they went about it. Most people would assume that Keegan always does things with the fans and the team in mind. People are waiting for Ashley and his guys to prove they do likewise. yeah, fair point. but isnt a successful club in the best interest of everyone? and doesnt the owner have the right to manage the club with his own vision? of course the have alot to learn, and communicating with the fans is one of them, but dont just jump on the bandwagon. give them a chance to prove themselves first before shifting blame. I think we are living up to every stereotype. lets get all the facts and make informed decisions before we jump on the "Ashley Out" bandwagon, which i think is disgraceful. Absolutely. I am sure everyone at the club wants success but you know what its like when ego's start clashing in any given work environment. For me I think Ashley has made 1 fundamental mistake He didnt come back to sort out the Keegan problem personally. If he wants the club to be run in his vision, when the shit hits the fan like it did, he really should have been on hand to take care of it. This is probably as big a "shit hits the fan" situation imaginable for him... the fans messiah walks out because of a despite with his board. He could have immediately won brownie points with the fans by making the effort and even making a personal statement to say he was coming back to discuss it with Kevin. The fact that he didnt has led to every one questioning his intentions. People will point and say he has employed people to look after this kind of thing but when something this major happens, it needs the man at the top involved and he decided (apparently) to stay away.

No not really. I think most people know that his attitude certainly added to the problem. He generally gets the benfit of any doubt though. Just up to people to decide whether he has earned that right. Its just about who was trying to do things in the best interests of the club. We have to hope that they all were but there was a clash over the way they went about it. Most people would assume that Keegan always does things with the fans and the team in mind. People are waiting for Ashley and his guys to prove they do likewise.

If Fat Mike plans on riding it out, then that's surely the only option going. The world has to keep on turning in some form. I still can't see why he'll want to stay if he's not able to watch the games with the fans/wear the shirt, though. If he genuinely wanted to buy the club to have some fun, then surely those days are done with as some will never forgive or forget. I think those days are gone. Using the opinion of the people of Birmingham that I talk to at work, as outsiders, they see those antics very strange and think he is an utter joke. This is the image people have of him and it reflects on the club. The novelty has worn off now, its time for him to just enjoy the football and be sensible. Will he want to do that, though? He has said himself that his intention in buying us was to have a challenge and have some fun and that his favourite part has been the away trips and celebrating in the city after big wins. He can't do that now so it just becomes another business for him - one which probably won't make him any money. What is the point? I dont think he will want to do that, so what the answer is I dont know. Will he just get straight into it and see what flack he gets and take if from there ? Some risk, that. Its all desperately disappointing. Personally I liked the whole thing. Seeing him with Coloccini on his shirt before the signing had been made official was one of the highlights of pre-season for me. Just feels like it will never be quite the same again.

I think it will be a smaller crowd and not because of some fist stamping act of protest. I think people will just give a shrug of their shoulders and say "I cant be arsed anymore"

If Fat Mike plans on riding it out, then that's surely the only option going. The world has to keep on turning in some form. I still can't see why he'll want to stay if he's not able to watch the games with the fans/wear the shirt, though. If he genuinely wanted to buy the club to have some fun, then surely those days are done with as some will never forgive or forget. I think those days are gone. Using the opinion of the people of Birmingham that I talk to at work, as outsiders, they see those antics very strange and think he is an utter joke. This is the image people have of him and it reflects on the club. The novelty has worn off now, its time for him to just enjoy the football and be sensible.

I think the way some of the conversations on here have gone could sadly suggest thet there could easily be some fighting amongst ourselves this weekend. Bad news if that happens

I dont want the appointment to pacify me. I want our league standing in May 2009 to pacify me. I refuse to get excited by an appointment ever again. Just been let down too many times

the squad is better than last years and we've made a good start to the season. saying that, i long for the days of wasting tens of millions on shit players, pushing us into leeds-esque debt and finishing lower by the season. brick by brick. You have noticed that we have knocked down a ton of bricks this week havent you if by "we" you mean "keegan" then yes, "we" have. Not getting into that discussion again but by "we" I mean the club. Who ever is to blame, the club has had a shite week and gone backwards. But I agree that the brick-by-brick policy is the way forward

the squad is better than last years and we've made a good start to the season. saying that, i long for the days of wasting tens of millions on shit players, pushing us into leeds-esque debt and finishing lower by the season. brick by brick. You have noticed that we have knocked down a ton of bricks this week havent you

What the fuck would Zico make of Alan Smith and Ameobi ?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008/apr/06/football.comment Good article and some insight into the type of manager Zico is Keep a hold of that article because when he walks through our doors he will get ripped limb by limb by the daily mail

I have absolutely no idea whether he will be the right man for the job but lets be honest, he is as good a choice as any really.