Frazzle

And how did he do that? He was part of the team that got relegated?

Carroll?

Jacqui Oatley

If Barton does - I guess you'll be one of the first to rant about him (again) if he gets sent off by doing it. I don't think he'd ever say a bad word about Barton.

Ah, thanks. Sounds about right I think.

"Comentario: De seguir con esta grandísima proyección ha buen seguro sera un fijo en la selección absoluta." What does that mean? Can you translate it please VI?

Keegan himself didn't manage any wins in those first few games. I'm not suggesting we would have done any better away to Arsenal or Villa or at home to Man U but we'd have taken points against the likes of Bolton, Boro, Blackburn, Reading, Sunderland and Fulham imo. I know he didn't and remember I didn't say he DID save us. I'm just not sure Allardyce would've have won those games, and then after that would he be able to motivate the players to beat the weaker teams. You've got to bear in mind as well that Keegan quite radically changed our style/structure etc. would Allardyce have changed things around? Maybe chucked Faye upfront?

Ah.

As people have said though, 2 wins in 14 isn't 'getting results' and with the games he had coming up who's to say it wouldn't be 2 wins in 20+?

One year isn't it? His original contract runs out at the end of this season, so he's only extended it for one year.

I'm not saying that. I'm saying you can't say: "In the grand scheme of things, it was a mistake getting rid of Allardyce because we got relegated 16 months later" as it is logically inaccurate. All I'm saying is that the Allardyce sacking wasn't the problem it's the fact that we didn't stick with his replacement.

M4TT, those are amazing. I doubt we'd follow the ACoN template though. I think we'll have Spurs' shirt but with stripes.

So sacking Allardyce wasn't a mistake then (your original argument) it was getting rid of Keegan. Otherwise you could just as well say that sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated 2 seasons later, the logic doesn't work. We genuinely improved under Allardyce though. Again, I'm not sure how this is relevant to your argument. We were improving under Keegan as well and more quickly than under Allardyce. None is that is really relevant to the argument that sacking Allardyce was a mistake, as I said, we didn't get relegated because we sacked Allardyce, it's because we didn't stick with a replacement for more than a couple of months. Otherwise, using your logic, as I said, you may just as well say sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated fairly soon afterwards.

I hope we never end up like Spurs and, god forbid, have refereeing decisions go against us. It doesn't bear thinking about.

So sacking Allardyce wasn't a mistake then (your original argument) it was getting rid of Keegan. Otherwise you could just as well say that sacking Roeder was a mistake because we got relegated 2 seasons later, the logic doesn't work.

What's that got to do with anything? As someone said, we wouldn't have gone down with Keegan in charge all season. It's irrelevant what Hughton/Kinnear/Shearer did. So sacking Allardyce wasn't the problem, it was getting rid of Keegan.

I don't know who I want to lose more, Spurs or Liverpool?

Everyone thinks he's **** practically. Everyone always says our CM is ****.

Puma strips look cheap/tacky as owt. Spurs kits look crap as well.

I would guess that 90% of the teams in this division would take our bench if offered it. Exactly. He's got an England U21 and England U19 strikers on the bench. He should be getting the best out of these players but he can't.

I'd rather we had him than Hughton.

He really bossed the midfield but their midfield bossed us? He was anonymous as usual. Why can't he get the ball under control and make a pass? His fitness is embarrassing as well. Total waster.

Keegan didn't play him out wide and he's been the best manager of the lot.

It's irrelevant to be fair, if Carroll had missed it then he'd be to blame instead, as it was it's Jonas' fault. I agree with what you've said though.

Have to agree - Shola was poor tonight and still looks short of match fitness. He's looked short of match fitness his whole career. This is about as fit as he gets.