johnnypd Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 england played well when rooney first arrived, culminating in euro 2004 when rooney and the team shone Shone?! when?? England didn't play well...Rooney did. If the team shone then why the hell did Sven get all the flak he got? Do what Italy did. They went to Euro 2000 with Del Piero being their most gifted player. Instead though, they played the better partnership, which was Delvecchio & Totti. Got them within a minute of being champions. I'd seriously consider doing similar with Heskey/Owen. that's just plain inaccurate. first of all sven was getting flak before rooney came into the side, because England had been poor with Heskey and Owen up front, starting from the immediate build up to, and finals of, 2002 world cup. if anything the height of sven's criticism was the game against the aussies when rooney made his debut. for a short while after the criticism partially abated as a rooney inspired england won 6 games in a row (plus another in which rooney didnt feature). second of all, the team played well in the euro 2004 finals, that can't reallt be denied. anything else is deluded revisionism in order to support a contrived argument. the criticism of that tournament is almost in its entirety aimed at the time we played without rooney against portugal. third of all, del piero was only the star player in name, anyone who'd seen him play around that time knew he wasn't as good as he was, despite the fact that the italy team was centered around him. bit like raul now. fourthly del piero only missed the first two games of italy's tournament and then was then recalled to play as a linkman, starting the quarter, semi and final. perhaps star quality does show after all. i don't disagree with the general sentiment, that sometimes the coherency of the team comes before star players, but i feel its being twisted in order to support one of our players and have a go at rooney. based on two games, that's pretty damn kneejerk. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kingdawson Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 What do you mean by not a "settled" team? Without much argument, England's potential squad for the finals (if they even make it) would be: James, Robinson, Carson A. Cole, Shorey, Terry, Ferdinand, Lescott, Richards, G. Neville Gerrard, Barry, Lampard, Wright-Phillips, J. Cole, Lennon, Beckham, Hargreaves, Carrick Owen, Heskey, Rooney, Crouch With the odd exception, maybe Bridge or Bentley for Shorey & Beckham, that would have to be it. You say the team isn't settled, but your only point is that you want Rooney in for Heskey. One of those midfielders would have to miss out for a centre back and i doubt lescott would even get in there tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 What do you mean by not a "settled" team? Without much argument, England's potential squad for the finals (if they even make it) would be: James, Robinson, Carson A. Cole, Shorey, Terry, Ferdinand, Lescott, Richards, G. Neville Gerrard, Barry, Lampard, Wright-Phillips, J. Cole, Lennon, Beckham, Hargreaves, Carrick Owen, Heskey, Rooney, Crouch With the odd exception, maybe Bridge or Bentley for Shorey & Beckham, that would have to be it. You say the team isn't settled, but your only point is that you want Rooney in for Heskey. as the second half showed, england still haven't solved the problem of keeping possession or controlling tempo, especially in the second half of matches. against a decent side owen would not have scored both goals, especially the first goal, and a team like say, ooh, portugal, probably would've done more with the second half, let's say, take us the penalties, at which point the hectic pace at which we'd played the previous 120 minutes at would fuck us over stamina wise. the way i see it, england need to remedy this and haven't, and it's probably the biggest problem we have to tackle at international level. nor have we sorted out how to accommodate Owen, Rooney and Gerrard in the same side, or which one to leave out. that's before McClaren inevitably puts Lampard back in the side, as well as reinstating Hargreaves, and then dropping Richards for Neville, and sticking with Robinson when he makes more inevitable clangers, and persisting with a Terry-Ferdinand partnership that looks average, or using Joe Cole as a left-winger ina 4-4-2 even though he is palpably ill-equipped for such a role, or when the top defensive teams mop up the one-dimensional long-ball to heskey and knock down to owen with incredible ease. i remember in the world cup when everyone was creaming over Germany's attack of Podolski and Klose, tmonkey on this forum said that said a defence like Italy would deal with them with ease cos they had not the flair or magic to get past them. he was right, same is probably true for owen and heskey. sorry to come across as negative, but people have gotten carried away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 Oo this might be fun... G: James, Robinson, Carson D: Richards, G Neville, Terry, Ferdinand, King, Woodgate, Cole, Bridge M: Wright-Phillips, Beckham, Gerrard, Hargreaves, Lampard, Carrick, Cole, Barry S: Owen, Rooney, Crouch, Heskey Obviously, that's if the Euros are tomorrow (injuries not considered)... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted September 12, 2007 Share Posted September 12, 2007 G:James, Robinson, Foster/Carson - not sure about the last two D: Richards, Neville, Terry, Ferdinand, Campbell, Lescott, Cole, Bridge - woodgate and king can't be relied upon to play games in short spaces of time, especially not at the end of the season M: SWP, Lennon, Gerrard, Lampard, Hargreaves, Barry/Carrick, Cole, Young - two players for each position, no beckham who'll be finished after playing for galaxy, undecided over barry or carrick. S: Owen, Rooney, Crouch, Bent - if you include heskey you have one goalscorer and three support strikers, so no owen back-up, this way you have two goalscorers, two support players. if anything the question is Heskey or Crouch, would be tempted to go for Heskey tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor Swift Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Credit to McLaren for recalling Heskey. Tis was a brave decision which has worked out really well for him and England. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
womblemaster Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 whats damning for mclaffen is that he didnt have the brains to work out this `better` team without the guiding hand of injuries. basically the muppet hasnt got a clue. ANy manager with an intelligent brain would have dropped lampard after the world cup , thank god for the booing fans in the m,alta game!! Really hope we drop crouch too, he did nothing last night after he came on, just ran about in circles. Well done barry!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beren Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 McClaren is one lucky mother-trucker. His team concedes a bucketful so he throws on two extra strikers - the only real available recourse = McClaren is praised for his tactics! Lampard and Crouch are unavailable - they're replaced with Barry and Heskey = McClaren is praised for his selection! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ross magoo Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Woohoo!! Charles de Gaulle, Jean-Paul Sartre, Joan of Arc, Rene from 'Allo 'Allo, your boys took one hell of a beating!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 am i the only one who'd find it hilarious, if , after doing the double over france the scots still failed to qualify ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 fourthly del piero only missed the first two games of italy's tournament and then was then recalled to play as a linkman, starting the quarter, semi and final. perhaps star quality does show after all. Euro 2000 - Quarter Final v Romania Toldo, Maldini, Albertini, Cannavaro, Conte, Inzaghi, Nesta, Iuliano, Zambrotta, Fiore, Totti. Euro 2000 - Semi Final v Holland Toldo, Cannavaro, Iuliano, Nesta, Zambrotta, Fiore, Di Biagio, Albertini, Maldini, Del Piero, Inzaghi. Euro 2000 - Final v France Toldo, Cannavaro, Nesta, Iuliano, Maldini, Pessotto, Di Biagio, Albertini, Fiore, Delvecchio, Totti. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 am i the only one who'd find it hilarious, if , after doing the double over france the scots still failed to qualify ? How would it be funny? I reckon Scotland have done better in this group than what England would have done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottish Mag Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 am i the only one who'd find it hilarious, if , after doing the double over france the scots still failed to qualify ? How would it be funny? I reckon Scotland have done better in this group than what England would have done. I still don't think we will tbh and even if we don't we have still done fanatastic in a group that had 3 of the World Cups quarter finalists and one in which no one had given us a chance in. I dunno about having done better but I would certainly have rather had Englands group than the one we have any day of the week... Anyway http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/ritchiemarshall/BooHoo.jpg Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 am i the only one who'd find it hilarious, if , after doing the double over france the scots still failed to qualify ? How would it be funny? I reckon Scotland have done better in this group than what England would have done. not disagreeing, that would make it even funnier Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 am i the only one who'd find it hilarious, if , after doing the double over france the scots still failed to qualify ? How would it be funny? I reckon Scotland have done better in this group than what England would have done. I still don't think we will tbh and even if we don't we have still done fanatastic in a group that had 3 of the World Cups quarter finalists and one in which no one had given us a chance in. I dunno about having done better but I would certainly have rather had Englands group than the one we have any day of the week... Anyway http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b367/ritchiemarshall/BooHoo.jpg Will also no doubt boost Scotland's seeding for the World Cup Qualifiers. Think they were in pot 4 for these ones, will be Pot 2 or 3 this time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ross magoo Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 We've got no easy games left. France and Italy still have to play the Faroes so we've got to beat Ukraine and Georgia. If we can do that then a point against Italy will be enough. If we lose to Italy, and France don't win in Kiev in their last game, we'll qualify anyway. It's no gonna be easy but if i'd been offered this scenario when the group was drawn i'd have bitten your hand off. We've been dreadful for years and nobody (myself included) gave us a chance in this group. What a turnaround. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LucaAltieri Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 We've got no easy games left. France and Italy still have to play the Faroes so we've got to beat Ukraine and Georgia. If we can do that then a point against Italy will be enough. If we lose to Italy, and France don't win in Kiev in their last game, we'll qualify anyway. It's no gonna be easy but if i'd been offered this scenario when the group was drawn i'd have bitten your hand off. We've been dreadful for years and nobody (myself included) gave us a chance in this group. What a turnaround. Aye, they've still got a chance, which is good going. Gives you a fuzzy warm feeling in your sporran I'll bet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TêteDeMaure Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 At the match last night, France vs Scotland that is. Whilst i desperately wanted them to get fucking hammered, and on the whole still dislike them, the atmosphere was quite brilliant, give or take the fact only 2 songs were sung constantly, one from the sound of music (Why? Enlighten me) and something about the tartan army boys, put the french to shame, the ground was bouncing after they scored. Can't begrudge the fair fellas that were beside me. Scotland were surely close to outnumbering the french. Brilliant atmosphere before the game aswell apart from a few pricks bang in the middle throwing glass bottles around. HOWEVER, for the largest part of the game, it was 11men defending, Ribery should have scored 2 at least, Anelka wanted to pass the ball instead of shooting and the amount of crosses went in that nobody was up for was ridiculous. Not to mention Landreau, Scotland had a chance near the end to crack it into the net from not far off half way. On the other hand Gordon was canny good. Good night anyhoo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottish Mag Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Whilst i desperately wanted them to get f****** hammered, and on the whole still dislike them Well theres a fucking surprise... :giggle: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TêteDeMaure Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Whilst i desperately wanted them to get f****** hammered, and on the whole still dislike them Well theres a f****** surprise... :giggle: Taketh the praise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottish Mag Posted September 13, 2007 Share Posted September 13, 2007 Whilst i desperately wanted them to get f****** hammered, and on the whole still dislike them Well theres a f****** surprise... :giggle: Taketh the praise. All this hatred of anything Scottish is just an act..We know you love us really! :giggle: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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