Guest Knightrider Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 The best aspect about this 'performance' was the intent. The intent to play from the back, the intent to get at Bolton. However as I've been saying for ages, the quality just ins't there and if it is, it will take a while to get them playing good football as these things don't happen over night, regardless of KK's magic touch when it comes to motivation, team spirit and attacking principles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluegeordie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Imo we learnt very little more than we already knew about our players in this game. For instance, where specific players are concerned, it was reaffirmed that Shola - surprise, surprise - simply isn't good enough (but due to absences KK had very little choice but to play him); that the current Owen requires intelligent, creative players around him, along with decent service, in order to be a genuine threat; that the lack of any kind of consistency in Milner's crossing is infuriating, and with some new signings it should mean that if it doesn't improve markedly then his place in the starting line-up is in jeopardy; and that the jury is still out on whether Duff will ever approximate the player he was at Blackburn and Chelsea. More generally, as a team, it comes as no surprise to me that the quantity and quality of our movement off the ball needs serious attention, and that we are missing creativity in midfield like the desert misses the rain. As for today's performance, again I thought there were few surprises. We obviously played with a more positive and attacking spirit under KK's guidance than we had been doing under Big Sam, but as we should have been expecting, there was a pronounced lack of quality in the final third, and from set pieces (both the delivery and the attack on the ball). Where the result is concerned, I must admit to being disappointed - I thought that we might be able to manufacture the likes of a 1-0 win - but few amongst us would (or at least should) have been expecting a goal avalanche, especially taking into account the players we had missing, and the fact that Bolton were always likely to adopt an anti-football approach in their play ... ably assisted, as others have remarked, by a clueless and gutless performance by the referee. Where do we go from here? Unfortunately, to the Emirates twice in succession, but hopefully we won't be flogged too savagely there (and who knows, we might just spring a surprise?). Beyond that, let's hope that we can a make a couple of quality signings before the January transfer window closes (pleeeeaaaassse God, make that include at least one truly high class attacking midfielder), and that against Boro and Villa KK can begin to make some tangible progress with the lads, and begin to lay the foundations for better times ahead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I need an Idiots Guide to Rodhaminho Player Ratings. Pushed and probed with no real guide/barely had a sniff at goal/wasn't good enough all equal a 7. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 The best aspect about this 'performance' was the intent. The intent to play from the back, the intent to get at Bolton. However as I've been saying for ages, the quality just ins't there and if it is, it will take a while to get them playing good football as these things don't happen over night, regardless of KK's magic touch when it comes to motivation, team spirit and attacking principles. Couldn't agree more. What was refereshing was that i think the fans could see it too. It was a breath of fresh air for given to give the ball directly to the defenders almost everytime we had the ball. We attacked from the back and had we had someone, like you say, with a little bit of experianced quality we would have won. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Viduka, Smith, Barton, Martins, Beye, Emre, Geremi, Butt. If all those players had have been available Keegan might have been able to pick a team capable of winning today. The team picked itself today. What formation would Keegan have played though had all these players been available. I think he may have went with: Given Carr Cacapa Taylor Beye Zog Butt Barton Duff Owen Viduka With Keegan also saying that he wants to bring in players what positions does he see as weaknesses that need strengthening. After today I would say pacey wingers that can beat their man and get a cross in and a central midfielder that can open up a game. A decent striker would be nice as well as Owen doesn't look half the player he used to be. What do the rest of you think? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
magpie418 Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 their fans never made a peep either. where were you sitting? they only had 2 songs, but they didn't shut up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 The best aspect about this 'performance' was the intent. The intent to play from the back, the intent to get at Bolton. However as I've been saying for ages, the quality just ins't there and if it is, it will take a while to get them playing good football as these things don't happen over night, regardless of KK's magic touch when it comes to motivation, team spirit and attacking principles. Agree with what you were saying about the intent, but i think the quality is there. Not many teams will play ten men at the back, and certain key players were having off-days regardless*. We didn't have Martins/Viduka/Beye in the side either which is always detrimental. On the pitch, today, the quality wasn't there - but i think it is in the squad, infact im sure. I'll say it again - we're a quality centre-midfielder or two away from a very good team. I'll be surprised if we field a weaker/more makeshift 11 than today, again this season. *Which is understandable. From a team perspective, they've barely had two days with their new manager and its essentially a totally different system to what they've been playing all season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I need an Idiots Guide to Rodhaminho Player Ratings. Pushed and probed with no real guide/barely had a sniff at goal/wasn't good enough all equal a 7. Well firstly Yorkie you should read a little more carefully. I say Guile not guide. I believe Milner, Owen and Ameobi were all a 7. Owen worked hard and linked up well but had no goalscoring chance because none were created. Ameobi IS crap but his performance was acceptable. Not he played crap but got a 7. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 their fans never made a peep either. where were you sitting? they only had 2 songs, but they didn't shut up. They were shouting sacked in the morning and KK out which got quite loud at one point only to be drowned out by the Ultra lads and lasses and others followed. I agree, they didn't make a peep. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 The best aspect about this 'performance' was the intent. The intent to play from the back, the intent to get at Bolton. However as I've been saying for ages, the quality just ins't there and if it is, it will take a while to get them playing good football as these things don't happen over night, regardless of KK's magic touch when it comes to motivation, team spirit and attacking principles. Couldn't agree more. What was refereshing was that i think the fans could see it too. It was a breath of fresh air for given to give the ball directly to the defenders almost everytime we had the ball. We attacked from the back and had we had someone, like you say, with a little bit of experianced quality we would have won. Given was constantly racing towards the edge of his box to throw the ball to Carr or Enrique rather than long punts downfield, although as the game wore on he reverted to type a few times. It was refreshing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Imo we learnt very little more than we already knew about our players in this game. For instance, where specific players are concerned, it was reaffirmed that Shola - surprise, surprise - simply isn't good enough (but due to absences KK had very little choice but to play him); that the current Owen requires intelligent, creative players around him, along with decent service, in order to be a genuine threat; that the lack of any kind of consistency in Milner's crossing is infuriating, and with some new signings it should mean that if it doesn't improve markedly then his place in the starting line-up is in jeopardy; and that the jury is still out on whether Duff will ever approximate the player he was at Blackburn and Chelsea. More generally, as a team, it comes as no surprise to me that the quantity and quality of our movement off the ball needs serious attention, and that we are missing creativity in midfield like the desert misses the rain. As for today's performance, again I thought there were few surprises. We obviously played with a more positive and attacking spirit under KK's guidance than we had been doing under Big Sam, but as we should have been expecting, there was a pronounced lack of quality in the final third, and from set pieces (both the delivery and the attack on the ball). Where the result is concerned, I must admit to being disappointed - I thought that we might be able to manufacture the likes of a 1-0 win - but few amongst us would (or at least should) have been expecting a goal avalanche, especially taking into account the players we had missing, and the fact that Bolton were always likely to adopt an anti-football approach in their play ... ably assisted, as others have remarked, by a clueless and gutless performance by the referee. Where do we go from here? Unfortunately, to the Emirates twice in succession, but hopefully we won't be flogged too savagely there (and who knows, we might just spring a surprise?). Beyond that, let's hope that we can a make a couple of quality signings before the January transfer window closes (pleeeeaaaassse God, make that include at least one truly high class attacking midfielder), and that against Boro and Villa KK can begin to make some tangible progress with the lads, and begin to lay the foundations for better times ahead. Summed up very well, agree with it all. A real test of nerve with Arsenal twice. I expect us to perform in one of those though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmymag Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 The best aspect about this 'performance' was the intent. The intent to play from the back, the intent to get at Bolton. However as I've been saying for ages, the quality just ins't there and if it is, it will take a while to get them playing good football as these things don't happen over night, regardless of KK's magic touch when it comes to motivation, team spirit and attacking principles. Good to see Given rolling it out at every opportunity, but clear for all to see that the quality just wasn't there to play that sort of football through the middle of the park. Granted that injury, suspension, African Nations Cup, and bail conditions had a lot to do with that but even allowing for those reasons we still need two quality, creative midfielders to play the Keegan way. I'd be surprised if more than 3 of the players who started tonight are still on the books this time next year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I need an Idiots Guide to Rodhaminho Player Ratings. Pushed and probed with no real guide/barely had a sniff at goal/wasn't good enough all equal a 7. Well firstly Yorkie you should read a little more carefully. I say Guile not guide. I believe Milner, Owen and Ameobi were all a 7. Owen worked hard and linked up well but had no goalscoring chance because none were created. Ameobi IS crap but his performance was acceptable. Not he played crap but got a 7. Alright, guile then. I believe if Milner, Owen, Ameobi, N'Zogbia, Enrique were all good enough to have warrented 7+, it'd identify that we'd won the game and won it well. I'm not sure how you're working out your ratings. What would you pin as 'average'? I'm not having a go, personally, i'd say 6 is average. 7 is good, 8 very good, 9, brilliant, 10 perfect. Your ratings just looked very high for what was a pretty uneventful performance, that's all. Did we even have a shot on target? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnypd Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 their fans never made a peep either. where were you sitting? they only had 2 songs, but they didn't shut up. They were shouting sacked in the morning and KK out which got quite loud at one point only to be drowned out by the Ultra lads and lasses and others followed. I agree, they didn't make a peep. they did sing, but there was so few of them that you didn't hear much and everytime they started something up we drowned them out. and i was right next to them! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I need an Idiots Guide to Rodhaminho Player Ratings. Pushed and probed with no real guide/barely had a sniff at goal/wasn't good enough all equal a 7. Well firstly Yorkie you should read a little more carefully. I say Guile not guide. I believe Milner, Owen and Ameobi were all a 7. Owen worked hard and linked up well but had no goalscoring chance because none were created. Ameobi IS crap but his performance was acceptable. Not he played crap but got a 7. Milner was never a 7, he was fucking shite. Couldn't beat his man and couldn't cross a ball. He also dwells on the ball far too fuckin long when he was it. Would love us to get SWP in. Faster, better crosser, better at taking it past people and will score more goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Would love SWP too but cant see him coming tbh. Not now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I need an Idiots Guide to Rodhaminho Player Ratings. Pushed and probed with no real guide/barely had a sniff at goal/wasn't good enough all equal a 7. Well firstly Yorkie you should read a little more carefully. I say Guile not guide. I believe Milner, Owen and Ameobi were all a 7. Owen worked hard and linked up well but had no goalscoring chance because none were created. Ameobi IS crap but his performance was acceptable. Not he played crap but got a 7. Alright, guile then. I believe if Milner, Owen, Ameobi, N'Zogbia, Enrique were all good enough to have warrented 7+, it'd identify that we'd won the game and won it well. I'm not sure how you're working out your ratings. What would you pin as 'average'? I'm not having a go, personally, i'd say 6 is average. 7 is good, 8 very good, 9, brilliant, 10 perfect. Your ratings just looked very high for what was a pretty uneventful performance, that's all. Did we even have a shot on target? Ah i tend to have 6 as an average too but if they have given 100% throughout and at least showed the intent to attack and create then they get a 7. I dont' think anyone was poor therefore i didn't give anyone a 5 but i did give Rozenhal and Duff 6 because, like i say i thought they were average. I see your point, it wasn't meant to look like high ratings but average/good ratings though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NufcSteven90 Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 their fans never made a peep either. where were you sitting? they only had 2 songs, but they didn't shut up. They were shouting sacked in the morning and KK out which got quite loud at one point only to be drowned out by the Ultra lads and lasses and others followed. I agree, they didn't make a peep. They were terrible 700 for a 3 hour journey. Also they sang "We are by far the greatest team..." and I thought are songbook was bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 SWP is poor at crossing, he's not that type of winger anyway, he's the type who runs at the full-back and cuts in to crack a shot off or he'll fizz the ball across the goal in the hope someone latches onto it. His crossing in generall however is poor like Milner's. He'd be a better player for us in a KK team though without a doubt. I can't see Milner surviving. Squad player at the most. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 At this point I would have Routledge over Milner. I honestly believe he is a better player than Milner is. Milner can go apply his pointless workrate somewhere else to be honest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bluegeordie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Imo we learnt very little more than we already knew about our players in this game. For instance, where specific players are concerned, it was reaffirmed that Shola - surprise, surprise - simply isn't good enough (but due to absences KK had very little choice but to play him); that the current Owen requires intelligent, creative players around him, along with decent service, in order to be a genuine threat; that the lack of any kind of consistency in Milner's crossing is infuriating, and with some new signings it should mean that if it doesn't improve markedly then his place in the starting line-up is in jeopardy; and that the jury is still out on whether Duff will ever approximate the player he was at Blackburn and Chelsea. More generally, as a team, it comes as no surprise to me that the quantity and quality of our movement off the ball needs serious attention, and that we are missing creativity in midfield like the desert misses the rain. As for today's performance, again I thought there were few surprises. We obviously played with a more positive and attacking spirit under KK's guidance than we had been doing under Big Sam, but as we should have been expecting, there was a pronounced lack of quality in the final third, and from set pieces (both the delivery and the attack on the ball). Where the result is concerned, I must admit to being disappointed - I thought that we might be able to manufacture the likes of a 1-0 win - but few amongst us would (or at least should) have been expecting a goal avalanche, especially taking into account the players we had missing, and the fact that Bolton were always likely to adopt an anti-football approach in their play ... ably assisted, as others have remarked, by a clueless and gutless performance by the referee. Where do we go from here? Unfortunately, to the Emirates twice in succession, but hopefully we won't be flogged too savagely there (and who knows, we might just spring a surprise?). Beyond that, let's hope that we can a make a couple of quality signings before the January transfer window closes (pleeeeaaaassse God, make that include at least one truly high class attacking midfielder), and that against Boro and Villa KK can begin to make some tangible progress with the lads, and begin to lay the foundations for better times ahead. Summed up very well, agree with it all. A real test of nerve with Arsenal twice. I expect us to perform in one of those though. Me too. I just hope that it's in the Cup, as a decent run in that competition might help our supporters to remain as patient as I suspect we're going to need to be while KK rebuilds the team and squad for real and sustainable progress in the Premier League. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 I know we're not allowed to prefer the cup over the league, but i'd rather we won the cup game at Arsenal, if i had to pick one. For the reasons Bluegeordie says... We've got little going for us in the league tbf. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest criminalz Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 Tactics wise i think the signs look pretty encouraging.... i am just happy we are trying to play football. imagine if sam was newcastle manager for this game, geesh....we might just hear 50,000 pple snoring away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
STM Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 SWP is poor at crossing, he's not that type of winger anyway, he's the type who runs at the full-back and cuts in to crack a shot off or he'll fizz the ball across the goal in the hope someone latches onto it. His crossing in generall however is poor like Milner's. He'd be a better player for us in a KK team though without a doubt. I can't see Milner surviving. Squad player at the most. The answer.... Bentley. Great crosser of the ball, great team player and gets amongst the goals. In terms of availablity, he won't be cheap. However at somewhere about 11/12m he'd be ours IMO. As much as normally i wince at that sort of money, if we have it to throw around we might as well go for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted January 19, 2008 Share Posted January 19, 2008 On another note, how shit was that referee? Terrible performance tonight. Didn't let the game flow at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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