James Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It might be worth pointing out that up until Allardyce left our record was... Conceded (total): 35 Conceded (first half): 13 Conceded (second half): 22 Since then we've conceded 17 goals, only one of those has been in the second half. Looks like the Keegan factor has helped about as much as Allardyce's fitness regime then? Once fitness is fucked, its hard to bring back - we'll be playing catch up in that respect for the rest of the season. I wonder, was the bad run Bolton went on after Christmas last year fitness related? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
merlin Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 FITNESS (or rather the lack of ...) Agreed - Plus too many aging players in midfield(or whose legs have gone..!). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 How many have we conceded in the first 25 mins of the 2nd half? fitness is not to blame for that, surely they are not totally knackerd after 45 mins and a 15 min rest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swissmag Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Does everybody on here think it is a physiscal problem??? I got the feeling that it has something to do with motivation/will to do it... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Lol Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 FITNESS (or rather the lack of ...) Wasn't Allardyce (Pro-Zone, heart monitors and all) meant to be the dog's swingers at getting players fit though? Obviously not. I'm assuming you agree on the fitness factor, from that. The question is then, how long will it take us to get fitness to a level that lets us compete in the second half? Seems crazy to think of professional athletes not being able to run around for more than 45mins, no? Seem to remember a Spurs player (Jenas maybe?) saying that their fitness levels have improved under Ramos, so maybe our overall player fitness levels aren't what they could be, that coupled with all our other problems - confidence, midfield, tactics etc all contribute to poor performances. Most of the team have been saying it because they are all seeing the benefit of change of diet, far more intense training than before etc and that only breeds confidence. Huddlestone lost 22lb, Malbranque (who always faded after an hour) 12lb, even Jenas lost 6lb. Newcastle's recent record of conceding second half goals is very similar to Spurs this season prior to Ramos coming in. Ramos has shown that it can be quickly turned around, whether Keegan can do the same I don't know. I'm not totally convinced tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest optimistic nit Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 FITNESS (or rather the lack of ...) Wasn't Allardyce (Pro-Zone, heart monitors and all) meant to be the dog's swingers at getting players fit though? it may take quite along time to get a squads fitness levels up. i think its more to do with the fact that our midfield lets so much go through them we have a lot of pressure on the defence. during the first 30-45 minutes we can soak this up just about, with a bit of luck along the way, but once we concede one heads drop, we dont think we can get one back (we have 0 ability in breaking down teams so we have to rely on luck and oppertunism for most our goals) and we have to chase the game, which just acts to expose our defence more and a lack of organisation coupled with having to chace the game leads to more goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sittingontheball Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 If you resolve the table, we'd be on 28 pts from first half results only and 27 pts from second half only. Villa was the first time we've been up at HT and not won the game. The other four times we've gone on to win. We've only been winning at HT five times out of twenty-six. I suppose a lot of first half/second half goals conceded bias is due to the seven (!) games where we conceded three or more. The last three are still fresh in the memory. You can check these and other stats here, starting with the first half one. http://stats.football365.com/dom/ENG/PR/fsthalf.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest johnson293 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Seems KK might think Fitness could be an issue ...from todays Chronicle: :: Meanwhile, the Chronicle understands that United have parted company with senior fitness coach Mark Howard, who was formerly with Sam Allardyce at Bolton Wanderers. Newcastle recently let head of sports science and medicine Mark Taylor leave the club. http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2008/02/13/carroll-staying-put-says-keegan-72703-20469820/ Get Steve Black back in!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Consortium of one Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I'd assume it's a fitness issue with some old legs issues as well. There could also be some mental issues coming into play as well. Once there is a breakdown in the 2nd half, many on the team may be expecting the roof to cave in and of course, with that attitude, it does. I haven't been a fan as long as any of you so this is easier for me to say but the rest of this year is kind of thrown away already. The only thing KK should be concentrating on is staying out of relegation and evaluating all of the players so he can begin to renovate the team over this summer. It's a tall order. If the players aren't fit, why? Is it the players, is it the staff? What players can play his style and how can he evaluate them if they aren't fit enough to play his style? It's a tough nut and I don't envy KK's position. The team looks a mess right now and it's probably hard for him to even figure out where to start. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scribble Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I instantly thought the same thing when I read the quote in your post Johnson293. Here's hoping. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Their concentration and focus lets them down in the 2nd half, against Boro and villa we had the lead then threw it away both times. We seemed to struggle with the fact that both Boro and Villa came out with more purpose in the 2nd half, yes physical fitness does come into it but so does mental fitness and as soon as we concede or come under a bit of sustained pressure we collapse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buzza Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 If you play football you'll know what I'm talking about: You are drained of energy and you are drained of focus. It is extremely dificult to maintain a standard of play in the second half if your fitness isn't right, you are late to tackles, your passes lack the right energy, confidence drains and everything seems a struggle. FITNESS IS HUGELY IMPORTANT (see Man Utd for their fitness and how they poach goals/games in the second half). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skirge Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 If you play football you'll know what I'm talking about: You are drained of energy and you are drained of focus. It is extremely dificult to maintain a standard of play in the second half if your fitness isn't right, you are late to tackles, your passes lack the right energy, confidence drains and everything seems a struggle. FITNESS IS HUGELY IMPORTANT (see Man Utd for their fitness and how they poach goals/games in the second half). I know its all part of the same thing but just getting them physically fit is one thing getting them mentally fit needs some positive results to get their confidence up. It was I that started the fitness level thread after the FA Cup game with Arsenal.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest johnson293 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Their concentration and focus lets them down in the 2nd half, against Boro and villa we had the lead then threw it away both times. We seemed to struggle with the fact that both Boro and Villa came out with more purpose in the 2nd half, yes physical fitness does come into it but so does mental fitness and as soon as we concede or come under a bit of sustained pressure we collapse. Another reason to get 'Blackie' back in!! http://www.steveblack.co.uk/ Our company (Architects) have had presentation sessions led by Steve Black about motivation, and achieving goals (Directors, not me personally). He isn't just a fitness/conditioning coach, and I think he could help get some of the morale back into the players, as well as helping them last 90 minutes physically! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_69 Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 If we scored more goals in the first half we wouldn't shite our pants when the opposition scores one after the break. We've got no chance of doing that with Alan Smith on the pitch. The fact that he hasn't scored since he's been here, despite playing almost every game, should be evidence enough that he isn't a potent goal scorer. Get two goal-scoring strikers on the pitch, get the ball to them over the top, through the middle or from the wings and let's try and score more than one a game. I'm not blaming our plight solely on Alan Smith but he's certainly one of the reasons we're not scoring many goals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 BELIEF! Players no longer believe in themselves and more significantly each other, or their ability to win a match or defend a lead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Logic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Need to get rid of that psychologist, if he's still there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I agree completely. Emre, Faye and viduka should all be used. Before or after Given went off? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It's not fitness although it might look as if it is, its confidence, which can drain you a lot quicker than tiredness. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazza ladra Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It's not fitness although it might look as if it is, its confidence, which can drain you a lot quicker than tiredness. ...that and a lack of leadership. Owen is not a team captain. We go down a goal and he immediately starts sulking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It isn't fitness, the players are fit, most of them anyway. It's belief which without saps energy levels and demotivates people. Of course, ability is the biggest single factor, we lack it in all areas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Knightrider Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Another thing... responsibility and accountability. We don't have any such qualities as a team. When we go a goal down, instead of the team collectively rolling their sleeves up, they look to one another to blame or start feeling sorry for themselves. We just aren't a team basically, in any form. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 i'm in the "it's not fitness" group. it's more that anything we have,confidence,belief etc disappears when we concede. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 i'm in the "it's not fitness" group. it's more that anything we have,confidence,belief etc disappears when we concede. And we always concede because we can't keep possession. It's painful watching most of our players trying to pass a ball. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufcjmc Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 i'm in the "it's not fitness" group. it's more that anything we have,confidence,belief etc disappears when we concede. totally agree. Coupled with the lack of a leader in the side that raises spirits etc the side seem to just never shrug off going a goal down. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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