How many new players do we need?

[afar]

What worries me more about the thin squad is that we'll be less inclined to accept an offer for other deadwood now; ie Smith and Duff. Can't see us letting them go until we get some more bodies in

[Yorkie]

I wouldn't cry into my pillow if Taylor and Faye were still the first choice pair going into next season. We do need a centre-back though.

 

 

 

(Though i'd still argue that Caçapa/Faye early in the season looked better than Taylor/Faye ever has, but that's not really the point)

I think Cacapa could do a decent job in a settled defence.  That injury he had that kept him out of the Man City game seemed to knacker him up and then when he played against Pompey he was carrying an injury and never recovered as all people remember now is that game.  It really annoys me when you see him on the Prems worst transfer lists.  You can tell the people that make them watch 1 maybe 2 games if you're lucky.

 

When Keegan first came in, the games against Arsenal, Bolton and Boro - Caçapa was running the show at the back, whilst Faye was in Africa. When Keegan had to drop one of them to accommodate Faye, i was stunned that it was Caçapa and not Taylor. He's a good defender, if a bit lightweight in the chase.

[Yorkie]

What worries me more about the thin squad is that we'll be less inclined to accept an offer for other deadwood now; ie Smith and Duff. Can't see us letting them go until we get some more bodies in

 

Yeah, that's a concern of mine. If Shola does go in the next week, then we really do have to start moving pretty sharpish. I'll be hugely disappointed if Damien fucking Duff and Alan fucking Smith are still playing games in black and white next season.

[Disco]

While people are talking about Cacapa, I thought we only got him in on a one year deal, is this true/false?

[hoppaz]

While people are talking about Cacapa, I thought we only got him in on a one year deal, is this true/false?

 

Two year deal with an option of a third.

[Disco]

While people are talking about Cacapa, I thought we only got him in on a one year deal, is this true/false?

 

Two year deal with an option of a third.

 

Ta

[Mr Logic]

 

I'm quite depressed after being made to think about this, because as it stands our squad looks like this (if we put people in their favoured/natural role):

 

GK: Harper, Given, Krul, Forster (good but overstocked, expect the latter two to go on loan unless Given gets crocked/sold)

 

RB: Beye. (oh dear - no cover)

 

LB: Enrique (oh dear - no cover)

 

CB: Faye, Taylor, Cacapa, Edgar (oh dear - Cacapa/Edgar not good enough cover, Faye/Taylor not exactly brilliant anyway)

 

RM: Milner (oh dear - no cover, not particularly good enough anyway)

 

LM: N'Zogbia, Duff (happy enough, although both could leave and Duff may well be finished)

 

CM: Butt, Geremi, Barton (oh dear - slower than treacle, one is in jail)

 

CF: Owen, Martins, Viduka, Carroll, Smith (oh dear - question marks over Owen's ability in a 4-4-2 and over Owen/Martins together, Viduka crocked, Carroll too young/raw and Smith needs no explanation)

 

At the least we're looking at 6 (LB, RB, CB, M, M, CF), if we lose more players then it could go up to 8, easily.

 

Depressing it was.

 

After reading OP I went to .com and checked it out. Pen and paper later, with everyone drawn on a makeshift pitch and a few crossed out as rather not have, or maybe won't have, and it really was an eye-opener. We're threadbare to make half a good team.

 

Need 3 good to great players and 3 'can step in and do a job whenever asked' players.

 

CB and CM absolute top priority.

[Dan Gleebals]

With Roz and Emre defineatly off, in addition to that I hope Smith and Duff, my Maths says 8.  4 quality players, 4 with potential.

 

However, Keegan said he wanted no one to leave.  Well that fucks his initial thoughts then.

 

For me we do need 8, without doubt.  That DOES NOT include the mini Shrek assuming we get him.

[Mick]

We need 4 players to replace the ones I've highlighted from the team that played most of the games at the end of last season.  If we go back to 4-4-2 then N'Zogbia would be a replacement for one of them. 

 

Harper

Beye

Faye

Taylor

Enrique

Geremi

Butt

Barton

Owen

Viduka

Martins

[Dokko]

No matter what formation we play, we need a centre-half. Either one who can walk straight into the team or someone at least capable of challenging Faye and Taylor for a starting role, preferrably the former (obviously.) Faye and Taylor are no great shakes as a partnership as it stands, but if one of them gets injured then you're looking at Cacapa and Edgar as their replacements. Cacapa AND Edgar as a partnership would be a fucking disaster, if you ask me, so we'd be bollocksed if both Faye and Taylor got injured.

 

Added to this, there is absolutely zero cover for either of the full-back positions. People will harp on about Kadar and Tozer (who can both play LB) but I highly doubt either to be ready for that kind of responsibility. On the right, there's absolutely chuff-all as far as natural positions go. So this leads me to think we need both a LB and a RB, again capable of challenging Enrique and Beye for their starting roles (I don't think either fullback should be replaced in the team, based on their performances last term.)

 

So that's us at 3 so far, and we're not even out of the defence.

 

Things get a bit more complicated in midfield, not least because of the formation stuff. You've got old legs in Geremi and Butt, who I'd imagine are both nailed-on to be kept, but then from there what else is there? Barton is up in the air, Milner and N'Zogbia are both well worth keeping but have been subject to a lot of speculation and everyone feels the same about Duff/Smith (on here at least). Emre's already on his way, and it's left us looking woefully short. If we're going 4-4-2 then we need a right-winger, because there's only Milner, and who the heck knows for the left-wing? We could end up keeping N'Zogbia and Duff, with the former being first choice, meaning I'd be happy enough with that. However, a 4-4-2 means that the centre of the park looks incredibly pedestrian. I'd say we're looking at 2 midfielders coming in, at the very least. I honestly couldn't say in what positions they should play. Depending on Barton/Duff/Smith, it could be pushed up to needing 4, as we'd only have the two young wingers and the two old central midfielders left. Oh dear. Lua Lua isn't good enough to be considered first-team, IMO.

 

Up front is complicated as well, due to the formation stuff. I think at least 1 striker is needed no matter what formation we play, as Viduka isn't reliable enough and Carroll probably won't cut it, unless we're happy with 12th place or thereabouts again. We've got Owen and Martins, who we really have to keep, but who could struggle to form an effective partnership if asked to play up top in a 4-4-2, unless the midfield was absolutely top-drawer.

 

I'm quite depressed after being made to think about this, because as it stands our squad looks like this (if we put people in their favoured/natural role):

 

GK: Harper, Given, Krul, Forster (good but overstocked, expect the latter two to go on loan unless Given gets crocked/sold)

 

RB: Beye. (oh dear - no cover)

 

LB: Enrique (oh dear - no cover)

 

CB: Faye, Taylor, Cacapa, Edgar (oh dear - Cacapa/Edgar not good enough cover, Faye/Taylor not exactly brilliant anyway)

 

RM: Milner (oh dear - no cover, not particularly good enough anyway)

 

LM: N'Zogbia, Duff (happy enough, although both could leave and Duff may well be finished)

 

CM: Butt, Geremi, Barton (oh dear - slower than treacle, one is in jail)

 

CF: Owen, Martins, Viduka, Carroll, Smith (oh dear - question marks over Owen's ability in a 4-4-2 and over Owen/Martins together, Viduka crocked, Carroll too young/raw and Smith needs no explanation)

 

At the least we're looking at 6 (LB, RB, CB, M, M, CF), if we lose more players then it could go up to 8, easily.

 

 

Its fuking depressing but spot on though.

 

The squad we've got is the weakest i've seen in a long time.

[Keefaz]

I hope we buy players just to cheer TT up. Poor fella.

[Dokko]

I hope we buy players just to cheer TT up. Poor fella.

 

 

So do I!!!

 

 

[madras]

No matter what formation we play, we need a centre-half. Either one who can walk straight into the team or someone at least capable of challenging Faye and Taylor for a starting role, preferrably the former (obviously.) Faye and Taylor are no great shakes as a partnership as it stands, but if one of them gets injured then you're looking at Cacapa and Edgar as their replacements. Cacapa AND Edgar as a partnership would be a f***ing disaster, if you ask me, so we'd be bollocksed if both Faye and Taylor got injured.

 

Added to this, there is absolutely zero cover for either of the full-back positions. People will harp on about Kadar and Tozer (who can both play LB) but I highly doubt either to be ready for that kind of responsibility. On the right, there's absolutely chuff-all as far as natural positions go. So this leads me to think we need both a LB and a RB, again capable of challenging Enrique and Beye for their starting roles (I don't think either fullback should be replaced in the team, based on their performances last term.)

 

So that's us at 3 so far, and we're not even out of the defence.

 

Things get a bit more complicated in midfield, not least because of the formation stuff. You've got old legs in Geremi and Butt, who I'd imagine are both nailed-on to be kept, but then from there what else is there? Barton is up in the air, Milner and N'Zogbia are both well worth keeping but have been subject to a lot of speculation and everyone feels the same about Duff/Smith (on here at least). Emre's already on his way, and it's left us looking woefully short. If we're going 4-4-2 then we need a right-winger, because there's only Milner, and who the heck knows for the left-wing? We could end up keeping N'Zogbia and Duff, with the former being first choice, meaning I'd be happy enough with that. However, a 4-4-2 means that the centre of the park looks incredibly pedestrian. I'd say we're looking at 2 midfielders coming in, at the very least. I honestly couldn't say in what positions they should play. Depending on Barton/Duff/Smith, it could be pushed up to needing 4, as we'd only have the two young wingers and the two old central midfielders left. Oh dear. Lua Lua isn't good enough to be considered first-team, IMO.

 

Up front is complicated as well, due to the formation stuff. I think at least 1 striker is needed no matter what formation we play, as Viduka isn't reliable enough and Carroll probably won't cut it, unless we're happy with 12th place or thereabouts again. We've got Owen and Martins, who we really have to keep, but who could struggle to form an effective partnership if asked to play up top in a 4-4-2, unless the midfield was absolutely top-drawer.

 

I'm quite depressed after being made to think about this, because as it stands our squad looks like this (if we put people in their favoured/natural role):

 

GK: Harper, Given, Krul, Forster (good but overstocked, expect the latter two to go on loan unless Given gets crocked/sold)

 

RB: Beye. (oh dear - no cover)

 

LB: Enrique (oh dear - no cover)

 

CB: Faye, Taylor, Cacapa, Edgar (oh dear - Cacapa/Edgar not good enough cover, Faye/Taylor not exactly brilliant anyway)

 

RM: Milner (oh dear - no cover, not particularly good enough anyway)

 

LM: N'Zogbia, Duff (happy enough, although both could leave and Duff may well be finished)

 

CM: Butt, Geremi, Barton (oh dear - slower than treacle, one is in jail)

 

CF: Owen, Martins, Viduka, Carroll, Smith (oh dear - question marks over Owen's ability in a 4-4-2 and over Owen/Martins together, Viduka crocked, Carroll too young/raw and Smith needs no explanation)

 

At the least we're looking at 6 (LB, RB, CB, M, M, CF), if we lose more players then it could go up to 8, easily.

 

 

Its fuking depressing but spot on though.

 

The squad we've got is the weakest i've seen in a long time.

hang on....even when you look at man utd they use centre halves as cover for full backs. like wes brown and o'shea that many deem arent good enough for us.

[Dokko]

No matter what formation we play, we need a centre-half. Either one who can walk straight into the team or someone at least capable of challenging Faye and Taylor for a starting role, preferrably the former (obviously.) Faye and Taylor are no great shakes as a partnership as it stands, but if one of them gets injured then you're looking at Cacapa and Edgar as their replacements. Cacapa AND Edgar as a partnership would be a f***ing disaster, if you ask me, so we'd be bollocksed if both Faye and Taylor got injured.

 

Added to this, there is absolutely zero cover for either of the full-back positions. People will harp on about Kadar and Tozer (who can both play LB) but I highly doubt either to be ready for that kind of responsibility. On the right, there's absolutely chuff-all as far as natural positions go. So this leads me to think we need both a LB and a RB, again capable of challenging Enrique and Beye for their starting roles (I don't think either fullback should be replaced in the team, based on their performances last term.)

 

So that's us at 3 so far, and we're not even out of the defence.

 

Things get a bit more complicated in midfield, not least because of the formation stuff. You've got old legs in Geremi and Butt, who I'd imagine are both nailed-on to be kept, but then from there what else is there? Barton is up in the air, Milner and N'Zogbia are both well worth keeping but have been subject to a lot of speculation and everyone feels the same about Duff/Smith (on here at least). Emre's already on his way, and it's left us looking woefully short. If we're going 4-4-2 then we need a right-winger, because there's only Milner, and who the heck knows for the left-wing? We could end up keeping N'Zogbia and Duff, with the former being first choice, meaning I'd be happy enough with that. However, a 4-4-2 means that the centre of the park looks incredibly pedestrian. I'd say we're looking at 2 midfielders coming in, at the very least. I honestly couldn't say in what positions they should play. Depending on Barton/Duff/Smith, it could be pushed up to needing 4, as we'd only have the two young wingers and the two old central midfielders left. Oh dear. Lua Lua isn't good enough to be considered first-team, IMO.

 

Up front is complicated as well, due to the formation stuff. I think at least 1 striker is needed no matter what formation we play, as Viduka isn't reliable enough and Carroll probably won't cut it, unless we're happy with 12th place or thereabouts again. We've got Owen and Martins, who we really have to keep, but who could struggle to form an effective partnership if asked to play up top in a 4-4-2, unless the midfield was absolutely top-drawer.

 

I'm quite depressed after being made to think about this, because as it stands our squad looks like this (if we put people in their favoured/natural role):

 

GK: Harper, Given, Krul, Forster (good but overstocked, expect the latter two to go on loan unless Given gets crocked/sold)

 

RB: Beye. (oh dear - no cover)

 

LB: Enrique (oh dear - no cover)

 

CB: Faye, Taylor, Cacapa, Edgar (oh dear - Cacapa/Edgar not good enough cover, Faye/Taylor not exactly brilliant anyway)

 

RM: Milner (oh dear - no cover, not particularly good enough anyway)

 

LM: N'Zogbia, Duff (happy enough, although both could leave and Duff may well be finished)

 

CM: Butt, Geremi, Barton (oh dear - slower than treacle, one is in jail)

 

CF: Owen, Martins, Viduka, Carroll, Smith (oh dear - question marks over Owen's ability in a 4-4-2 and over Owen/Martins together, Viduka crocked, Carroll too young/raw and Smith needs no explanation)

 

At the least we're looking at 6 (LB, RB, CB, M, M, CF), if we lose more players then it could go up to 8, easily.

 

 

Its fuking depressing but spot on though.

 

The squad we've got is the weakest i've seen in a long time.

hang on....even when you look at man utd they use centre halves as cover for full backs. like wes brown and o'shea that many deem arent good enough for us.

 

Some versatility in players would be great for the squad, why i quite like the idea of Larrson.

 

 

[Rich]

Aye Madras, they use them, but they've also got Silvestre sitting on the bench and Pique was there an' all. 8 first team defenders all-in-all.

 

The fact our "versatile" cover is Edgar and the fact that Taylor "can" play RB while Beye "can" play CB isn't exactly brilliant.

 

We need 2 defenders at the very least.

[madras]

Aye Madras, they use them, but they've also got Silvestre sitting on the bench and Pique was there an' all. 8 first team defenders all-in-all.

 

The fact our "versatile" cover is Edgar and the fact that Taylor "can" play RB while Beye "can" play CB isn't exactly brilliant.

 

We need 2 defenders at the very least.

what do you think when brown plays right back or o'shea on the left ? they arent good players there. i agree we do need defensive cover but not in the chelsea style of 2 starters in each position

[Mick]

Aye Madras, they use them, but they've also got Silvestre sitting on the bench and Pique was there an' all. 8 first team defenders all-in-all.

 

The fact our "versatile" cover is Edgar and the fact that Taylor "can" play RB while Beye "can" play CB isn't exactly brilliant.

 

We need 2 defenders at the very least.

 

We don't need defenders who need to come in and play all season, I would have no problem bringing in kids for the odd game to cover injuries and suspensions.

[Rich]

Aye Madras, they use them, but they've also got Silvestre sitting on the bench and Pique was there an' all. 8 first team defenders all-in-all.

 

The fact our "versatile" cover is Edgar and the fact that Taylor "can" play RB while Beye "can" play CB isn't exactly brilliant.

 

We need 2 defenders at the very least.

what do you think when brown plays right back or o'shea on the left ? they arent good players there. i agree we do need defensive cover but not in the chelsea style of 2 starters in each position

 

I never claimed we did need 2 starters. I said we need a centre-half to challenge Taylor/Faye for a starting place, because I don't think that partnership is up to much and that we need cover for fullbacks. As far as Brown goes, I think he was very, very solid for them this season. O'Shea didn't play much, but he's certainly good enough cover even at a club that size.

 

I'm not one of those who thinks Brown/O'Shea aren't up to much, both very decent players.

 

3 players would be ideal, but 2 would suffice.

[Mick]

 

I never claimed we did need 2 starters. I said we need a centre-half to challenge Taylor/Faye for a starting place, because I don't think that partnership is up to much and that we need cover for fullbacks. As far as Brown goes, I think he was very, very solid for them this season. O'Shea didn't play much, but he's certainly good enough cover even at a club that size.

 

I'm not one of those who thinks Brown/O'Shea aren't up to much, both very decent players.

 

3 players would be ideal, but 2 would suffice.

 

Taylor and Faye will be OK if we have the right players in front of them.

[Rich]

Aye Madras, they use them, but they've also got Silvestre sitting on the bench and Pique was there an' all. 8 first team defenders all-in-all.

 

The fact our "versatile" cover is Edgar and the fact that Taylor "can" play RB while Beye "can" play CB isn't exactly brilliant.

 

We need 2 defenders at the very least.

 

We don't need defenders who need to come in and play all season, I would have no problem bringing in kids for the odd game to cover injuries and suspensions.

 

Again, I never said we did, bar in the centre-half area, but I'm not sure I'd be chuffed having "kids" that close to the 1st team, unless they were really, really special.

 

Can't help but feel that people are setting their sights a bit low, to be honest, when there's Keegan back and a billionaire at the helm.

 

Even in Keegan's last reign we had Watson/Barton, Beresford/Elliott, Howey/Peacock/Albert - and that was when squads weren't as big as they are now.

[Rich]

 

I never claimed we did need 2 starters. I said we need a centre-half to challenge Taylor/Faye for a starting place, because I don't think that partnership is up to much and that we need cover for fullbacks. As far as Brown goes, I think he was very, very solid for them this season. O'Shea didn't play much, but he's certainly good enough cover even at a club that size.

 

I'm not one of those who thinks Brown/O'Shea aren't up to much, both very decent players.

 

3 players would be ideal, but 2 would suffice.

 

Taylor and Faye will be OK if we have the right players in front of them.

 

Hopefully, but if one gets injured (particular Big Faye) then the prospect of Taylor/Edgar or Taylor/Cacapa fills me with dread.

[Keefaz]

Beye is the best cover we hav for centre-half, imo, if you're happy with Geremi or AN Other at RB.

[Mick]

 

Again, I never said we did, bar in the centre-half area, but I'm not sure I'd be chuffed having "kids" that close to the 1st team, unless they were really, really special.

 

Can't help but feel that people are setting their sights a bit low, to be honest, when there's Keegan back and a billionaire at the helm.

 

Even in Keegan's last reign we had Watson/Barton, Beresford/Elliott, Howey/Peacock/Albert - and that was when squads weren't as big as they are now.

 

Kids need to gain experience and as long as we have a set of players that can maintain a reasonable level of fitness then the number of starts they get should be limited.

 

The last thing we should want for next season is another transitional period while we allow players to fit in with each other.  It’s going to be bad enough as we’ll probably need a new midfield as the one we had last season was nowhere near good enough.

 

[Mick]

 

Hopefully, but if one gets injured (particular Big Faye) then the prospect of Taylor/Edgar or Taylor/Cacapa fills me with dread.

 

Again, that depends on how much protection they are given.

[mrmojorisin75]

surprisingly Dave's comments on another thread made me feel better about this whole situation - IF the club goes with 3-4 first team signings and 3-4 younger players to challenge and push for first team places it'll be enough IMO

 

i hasten to add it'll really need to be 4 of both rather than 3!!! 

 

so sign one first team quality/age CB, 2 x CM and a ST then get fullback cover and more midfield cover from the younger players we'll be OK