themanupstairs Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 <b>In the end the proper criteria for judging a manager's ability is not made-up subjective categories but what they have achieved during their careers.</b> Sir Bobby's managerial CV is one of the most illustrious in the history of the game. "Keegan at NUFC" may have achieved more than "Sir Bobby at NUFC," but objectively, Kevin Keegan as a manger isn't fit to lace Sir Bobby Robson's boots. And just as objectively you'd have to agree that Phil Neville was a far better footballer than Shearer. Using the competitions won by managers managing different teams, in different leagues, with different financial clout, at different times is far from as objective a way of measuring as may seem. Apart from with us Keegan has never managed a team which has anywhere near the resources necessary to win the big stuff. He's always taken on teams which were a challenge and needed turning around, and as such he got each of the teams he managed promoted as champions the first full year he was in charge (I think). He very nearly won us the league 3 and a half years after almost being relegated from the second division. Are those lesser achievements than winning the Dutch league with PSV, or a cup with Barcelona? Well, objectively, yes they are, but for me I'd rather have Keegan as manager than Robson because given the same resources I think he'd win out quite easily. Phil Neville isn't a better footballer, but rather a more successful footballer. FFS so is John O'Shea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simmsy10 Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 <b>In the end the proper criteria for judging a manager's ability is not made-up subjective categories but what they have achieved during their careers.</b> Sir Bobby's managerial CV is one of the most illustrious in the history of the game. "Keegan at NUFC" may have achieved more than "Sir Bobby at NUFC," but objectively, Kevin Keegan as a manger isn't fit to lace Sir Bobby Robson's boots. And just as objectively you'd have to agree that Phil Neville was a far better footballer than Shearer. Using the competitions won by managers managing different teams, in different leagues, with different financial clout, at different times is far from as objective a way of measuring as may seem. Apart from with us Keegan has never managed a team which has anywhere near the resources necessary to win the big stuff. He's always taken on teams which were a challenge and needed turning around, and as such he got each of the teams he managed promoted as champions the first full year he was in charge (I think). He very nearly won us the league 3 and a half years after almost being relegated from the second division. Are those lesser achievements than winning the Dutch league with PSV, or a cup with Barcelona? Well, objectively, yes they are, but for me I'd rather have Keegan as manager than Robson because given the same resources I think he'd win out quite easily. Phil Neville isn't a better footballer, but rather a more successful footballer. FFS so is John O'Shea. Ronny Johnsen, Jesper Blomqvist, Nicky Butt....etc,etc! Its a frightening list to say the least! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
themanupstairs Posted January 29, 2009 Share Posted January 29, 2009 <b>In the end the proper criteria for judging a manager's ability is not made-up subjective categories but what they have achieved during their careers.</b> Sir Bobby's managerial CV is one of the most illustrious in the history of the game. "Keegan at NUFC" may have achieved more than "Sir Bobby at NUFC," but objectively, Kevin Keegan as a manger isn't fit to lace Sir Bobby Robson's boots. And just as objectively you'd have to agree that Phil Neville was a far better footballer than Shearer. Using the competitions won by managers managing different teams, in different leagues, with different financial clout, at different times is far from as objective a way of measuring as may seem. Apart from with us Keegan has never managed a team which has anywhere near the resources necessary to win the big stuff. He's always taken on teams which were a challenge and needed turning around, and as such he got each of the teams he managed promoted as champions the first full year he was in charge (I think). He very nearly won us the league 3 and a half years after almost being relegated from the second division. Are those lesser achievements than winning the Dutch league with PSV, or a cup with Barcelona? Well, objectively, yes they are, but for me I'd rather have Keegan as manager than Robson because given the same resources I think he'd win out quite easily. Phil Neville isn't a better footballer, but rather a more successful footballer. FFS so is John O'Shea. Ronny Johnsen, Jesper Blomqvist, Nicky Butt....etc,etc! Its a frightening list to say the least! Yes, but it's the truth, and a true measure of a player who has had a successful career or not. Same goes for managers. And sorry like, for me, Sir Bobby Robson is 100 times the manager Keegan ever was. Keegan's time at NUFC the first time round is a fairytale story where everything just clicked. His undoubted charisma and enthusiasm and love for the club was the drive behind everything that happened. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2sheds Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 My case is simple. I went to my first match in 1971, ive supported ever since.Keegan and Sbr were the 2 best managers, in all that time. KK just edged it for me, but thats no slight on SBR, who did very well. now run along 2 shits. up yours mr majorspasm, if you say things like....not fit to lace his boots, your not being objective. For someone who first went to a match in 1971 you have a very child like mentality. Do you get off by acting like a baby on football forums.? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted January 31, 2009 Share Posted January 31, 2009 My case is simple. I went to my first match in 1971, ive supported ever since.Keegan and Sbr were the 2 best managers, in all that time. KK just edged it for me, but thats no slight on SBR, who did very well. now run along 2 shits. up yours mr majorspasm, if you say things like....not fit to lace his boots, your not being objective. For someone who first went to a match in 1971 you have a very child like mentality. Do you get off by acting like a baby on football forums.? yes, when a muppet tries to turn me over and ends up with the only thing left to call me a baby. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 So, let me get this straight cp40. Our best footballing years since 1971 and most defiantly our best footballing years in the Premier League were during Keegan's tenure? OK I wouldn't argue with that. So can you please explain why because Keegan was successful in the 90's why he'd automatically be successful now... Yes we appreciate what he's done for this club us in the past, but does that mean he would be guaranteed success second time round? No. Does it justify him walking away the way he did? Well if he was undermined I'd have serious reservations about remaining in my job, however to walk out on us at the time he did and the way he did, I don't think so. The man deserves respect for the good times he brought to this football club, but that doesn't make him exempt from criticism for the role he played in the events that lead up to the current debacle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. btw, im trying to watch Lost, so i may not be able to fully indulge in your CP40 baiting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Heneage Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. "Wins every game against Sunderland" He can't have had that man surely? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. btw, im trying to watch Lost, so i may not be able to fully indulge in your CP40 baiting. So we'd of finished that high up the league second time around? Would you like to back that up with any form of fact or any kind of logic for that matter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. btw, im trying to watch Lost, so i may not be able to fully indulge in your CP40 baiting. So we'd of finished that high up the league second time around? Would you like to back that up with any form of fact or any kind of logic for that matter? How can you give facts, on an opinion you have or a belief you have that is based on experience? its my belief, If Keegan had been backed we would be doing significantly better than we are doing now,...just an opinion based on my experience,...i may be wrong,.. its possible, im brilliant, but not perfect. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prophet Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. btw, im trying to watch Lost, so i may not be able to fully indulge in your CP40 baiting. So we'd of finished that high up the league second time around? Would you like to back that up with any form of fact or any kind of logic for that matter? How can you give facts, on an opinion you have or a belief you have that is based on experience? its my belief, If Keegan had been backed we would be doing significantly better than we are doing now,...just an opinion based on my experience,...i may be wrong,.. its possible, im brilliant, but not perfect. Can't really argue with that. I don't know about siginifcantly better but if it's of your opinion then yeah why the hell not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 Back keegan, you get finishes, of, 1st 3rd, 6th , 2nd, 2nd. and he wins every game against Sundeland. Not gonna back him,.. no point in hiring him,... unless you deceive him and the fans. btw, im trying to watch Lost, so i may not be able to fully indulge in your CP40 baiting. So we'd of finished that high up the league second time around? Would you like to back that up with any form of fact or any kind of logic for that matter? How can you give facts, on an opinion you have or a belief you have that is based on experience? its my belief, If Keegan had been backed we would be doing significantly better than we are doing now,...just an opinion based on my experience,...i may be wrong,.. its possible, im brilliant, but not perfect. Can't really argue with that. I don't know about siginifcantly better but if it's of your opinion then yeah why the hell not. wish i had said something totally keegantastic now, dont want to lose my place as the forums no1, Keegan arse licking bummer.... its far too much fun. I fucking Love Kevin Keegan,... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted February 1, 2009 Share Posted February 1, 2009 wish i had said something totally keegantastic now, dont want to lose my place as the forums no1, Keegan arse licking bummer.... its far too much fun. I fucking Love Kevin Keegan,... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 If Ashley had backed Keegan, even with just a few million, I think we would have had about 9 points more by now than the cup dog has got us,... this would have had us 6th , or 7th,.... 6th is the lowest Kev ever finished here,... in a season started with him as manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest elbee909 Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 How well did he do at Fulham? City? England? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 If Ashley had backed Keegan, even with just a few million, I think we would have had about 9 points more by now than the cup dog has got us,... this would have had us 6th , or 7th,.... 6th is the lowest Kev ever finished here,... in a season started with him as manager. can't disagree with you, for once, everything else aside we'd have won more points with KK in charge simple as Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bealios Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 How well did he do at Fulham? City? England? Changed the first two from struggling lower division clubs to established Premier League clubs. You could argue that without Keegan's time at City they would not be in the position they are now. England wasn't the greatest success, but subsequent managers show that he certainly wasn't the worst in recent years. A lot of international football is luck and "what if's" - England were unlucky to go out of the Euros with that last minute penalty when Keegan was in charge, who knows what might have happened if we hadn't. Italia 90 is considered by many to be England's best tournament performance since 1966, however we were so close to going out in the group stages - abysmal in the first two games, until a very late goal in the last game took us through. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 How well did he do at Fulham? City? England? Changed the first two from struggling lower division clubs to established Premier League clubs. You could argue that without Keegan's time at City they would not be in the position they are now. England wasn't the greatest success, but subsequent managers show that he certainly wasn't the worst in recent years. A lot of international football is luck and "what if's" - England were unlucky to go out of the Euros with that last minute penalty when Keegan was in charge, who knows what might have happened if we hadn't. Italia 90 is considered by many to be England's best tournament performance since 1966, however we were so close to going out in the group stages - abysmal in the first two games, until a very late goal in the last game took us through. in the interests of balance he had (relatively) heaps of cash to spend at fulham, and once he got man city up was given min 50m to spend there (macken, anelka etc...) but i'm not sure what he spent to get them up just to add some balance - he did will in both jobs but didn't exactly do it on a shoestring either Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 Keegan, quit England, because he knew it was an impossible job. He had sais he didnt want it when he was at Newcastle, and again at Fulham, But Al fayed, did a deal with the FA, he effectively transfered him to the England Job. In the job, Keegan could see, and ive been saying it for years, the players just arent up to it, they are over rated, big time charlies, who dont put it in for thier countries.... Keegan wouldnt bear this well, as a player he was totally commited and hard working. At least at club level keegan could ship any shirkers, and he did,. ..not an option at England,..limited choice and FA wanting the BIG stars ( lazy bastrads) playing. Its been proven with every other England manager, its an impossible job. Keegan is too loyal to say this, so being the big man he is he blamed himself publicly,.. how many people would do that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LooneyToonArmy Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Troubled ex-Toon boss Keegan in new legal battle as the circus comes to town Last updated at 12:08 AM on 04th February 2009 Kevin Keegan, who has launched an £8million action against Newcastle United for constructive dismissal after quitting as manager last September, is himself facing legal action over his Soccer Circus near Glasgow. He has found it financially heavy going as a football theme park owner. But one successful initiative has been the Soccer Tots classes that are now advertising additional sessions on the website. However, Keegan can expect correspondence this week from football coach Simon Clifford, who has pioneered both Brazilian Soccer Schools and Socatots in this country. Clifford’s classes, which have been running for nine years, offer football tuition to infants from six months to five years and have grown to 300 franchises worldwide. Clifford, who has registered his Socatots trademark and patent, will be sending Keegan a Demand to Cease and Desist letter, the first stage of a copyright infringement action. And he will take the matter to court unless Keegan stops trading under the Soccer Tots name. He said: ‘I know Kevin is having a difficult time, but I can’t allow him to use a title I have spent nine years building into a successful business. It’s not right and I’ll take the necessary steps to prevent it.’ http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1135413/Charles-Sale-Troubled-Keegan-new-legal-fight.html?ITO=1490 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Libertine Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 here we go again. 3rd coming in the summer? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcmk Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 here we go again. 3rd coming in the summer? 4th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 here we go again. 3rd coming in the summer? 3rd? Glad to see you know your history of the club and that slip was just a one off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Libertine Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 here we go again. 3rd coming in the summer? 3rd? Glad to see you know your history of the club and that slip was just a one off. obviously as a manager. i dont anticipate him coming back as a player unless he really wants the money. or are you counting the time he briefly fucked off during his first time as manager, making it a technical 4th coming? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 here we go again. 3rd coming in the summer? 3rd? Glad to see you know your history of the club and that slip was just a one off. obviously as a manager. i dont anticipate him coming back as a player unless he really wants the money. or are you counting the time he briefly fucked off during his first time as manager, making it a technical 4th coming? idiot, 82-84...1st 92-97....return 2008....3rd someday.....4th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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