Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Despite the abysmal communication levels at Newcastle United what we do know is that Mike Ashley is going nowhere for the time being, that there is no white knight on the horizon to save us and perhaps save him and that literally, we are stuck with one another for an undetermined length of time. Now in this time we can go on protesting (NUSC), unfurling anti-Ashley banners (Kieth of Toon Travel fame), endlessly writing about our woes (Chronicle, Journal and true faith) and generally keep up with this ill-feeling towards the owner and those he has put in charge of running the club (message board, pub and city wide talk alike) while Ashley and Co can continue to antagonize fans with their lack of communication, contradictions and mismanagement. Or... we can all call a truce and start rebuilding this damaged club of ours Newcastle United. How about it Mike? I ask you because it has to start with you first and foremost and NOW before there really is no going back. What we as fans and indeed the club need from you is this: Communication - First of all we need you to inform everyone what kind of state financially the club is really in and you need to come clean on how you intend to get the club's balance sheet back in order. If that means selling our top players and heavily trimming the wage bill for example you have to be up front with us and be honest about it. I for one can accept that if there is no real alternative. I may not like it but if that's the best way to get us back to being self sufficient then so be it. You cannot however mislead us with phony attempts to keep high wage earners like Michael Owen when in reality you'd love to get him and others earning big money off the wage bill nor can you have the manager going out in public and saying any money raised from sales will be his to spend if that really isn't the case as happened in the January transfer window. There are too many amateur accountants, guess work and contradictions regarding the finances and debt levels be it the club's or your own debt and that will only lead to scare mongering, uncertainty and mistrust and much more. Come clean, tell us how bad off we are financially. But don't stop there, tell us how you plan to fix things. Level with us. Inform us of your plans and convince us that you know best and that whatever plan you have is the best route to go down. We are not all knuckle draggers or illiterate mongs like Sky and some sections of the media would have you believe. Secondly you need to personally draw a line under the whole Kevin Keegan saga and acknowledge that things could have been handled much better. I personally don't want to listen to any blame game or hear phony apologies. What is done is done. Draw a line under it, acknowledge things could have been handled better and if you insist on sticking with Wise and Co, come out and back them publicly, tell us why you appointed them, what exactly their roles are and what you expect and what we can expect from them. Again I can live with the likes of Dennis Wise and Co if I only knew what they did and what their objectives are and whether you, like you would a manager Mike, will have targets for them and whether you will hold them responsible if these targets don't get met or not. Challenge them to achieve certain goals and targets publicly, fans and the media have this image of them as your drinking buddies and that no matter what, they are immune to any kind of body check. Thirdly you need to and I can't stress this highly enough, let us all know your true intentions as owner of our club and if this means coming out and letting everyone know that you would like to sell the club on at some point, you have to be brave and say so. Sure this will cause some negative reaction and may unsettle one or two nerves but if we all knew and more importantly understood what the long-term aim REALLY is we can all accept the reality of the situation. When you put the club up for sale and then sought a buyer for it after the Hull match it did create a level of uncertainty but that was down to the manner in which you announced your intention and the manner in which you then went about trying to sell the club. That uncertainty was caused because you basically left the club to fend for itself, to be ran on its own. For example you could have appointed a manager and carried on with the plans you had for it before you put it up for sale and still sought a buyer. I once put my own business up for sale and actively sought a buyer (and succeeded eventually), but at the same time still ran the business as normal and still attended to all its needs. You can do the same. If you came out and told the fanbase of your intentions to sell but in the meantime, this is how we're going to run the club and this is the plan, providing it is a positive plan that is designed to improve the financial health of the club and improve the football team, fans will accept it and we would all then be able to carry on as per usual. When you put the club up for sale the first time however everything was basically left to chance. Knowing would be more preferable to a future of uncertainty which still exists today despite knowing the club has been taken off the market, or so you say. See Mike, no-one really knows unless you yourself come out and tell everyone your real intentions not short-term but long-term. And if you don't want to sell and want to remain in control of the club as owner, then once again, say so rather than these ambiguous half statements. You are clearly back in some context, what is it? Believe it or not Mike, many fans would give you a second chance and I include myself in that despite having zero faith in your abilities to run the club, trust in you, your choice of people to run the club nor a desire to see you remain as my club's owner for any length of time. I want you out and yesterday, but leaving all personal feelings aside for a moment what I really want is what is best for my club and if you are that then I want you to start showing it, to start producing, to start the ball rolling to get this troubled, deeply damaged club back on the right track. That doesn't have to mean spending mega money on big name players or talk of the top 4 or European football. That is not what I value as essential prerequisites of a healthy NUFC, far from it. I value good leadership, a good sustainable plan of action, action over words, progress be it slow and gradual. I value good honest people in charge of my club with good honest plans, sensible and realistic plans. If you can bring that to the table, strive towards that and one day achieve that you will be welcome at my club as owner. You have to start talking though Mike and start delivering. The manager - You may like Joe Kinnear and feel somewhat indebted to him but if you are serious about progress and turning this club around he is not the answer and never will be. You have to get rid of him at some point otherwise no matter what your intentions really are or what kind of plan you have in place behind the scenes, the one thing that glues everything together and keeps those attendances as high as they are despite most fans being against you and even Kinnear is that team of ours out on that pitch. That's what we support and spend all that money, time and emotion on, the players. Keeping Kinnear in charge will see to it that this team and those players will only ever go one way - downwards. Kinnear needs replaced with a competent manager capable of organising a team, developing players, with a grasp of tactics and good communication and motivational skills. I won't attempt to provide the name of this manager as there are too many and too few really depending on viewpoints, but someone out there with the right skills exists and can be brought to this club and it is your job to find this man. The system - You need to decide whether this system is delivering or can deliver and whether those whose jobs it is to make it work are competent enough to do so. So far the jury is well and truly still out and that's just regarding the players bought and sold and not what such a system does for the manager or not. If you are to keep the system once again you need to clearly define why and what its purpose is and the roles of those charged with making it working and you then have to find a suitable manager to work with such a system. Kevin Keegan couldn't and Joe Kinnear isn't the answer either. There exists such a manager that can work with such a system and you need to find him and bring him to the club, remembering he has to be a competent manager in terms of organisation, tactics, motivation, player development etc. and not any old manager. The manager will always be the key person at the club regardless of whether he has full and absolute control or is working under a Director of Football however and you must accept this Mike because in football that is the reality and always will be. The players - The very thing that we are all here for. You need to decide what the recruitment and selling strategy is and again you have to let fans know rather than wonder and guess. If you need to get rid of the likes of Michael Owen as his wages restrict recruitment then say so. What kind of team do you want Mike? Fans would all love a team of world-class stars capable of winning the league but we are realistic and the vast majority will accept a good honest side full of professionals with some modicum of talent that can be developed (that's where a good manager comes in Mike) and turned into a good team capable of going places. Some would say we have the nucleus of such a team despite our league position (again that's where a good manager comes in) and while I personally don't quite share that thought I do believe with some clever thought and not necessarily money, such a team can be assembled be it via a manager with absolute control or a multi-layered recruitment and scouting system that already exists at the club, even with the current personnel. It is all about identifying what the team needs and what kind of player to go for. There are many clubs and managers out there who have shown that you don't always need to spend big money to create a good side. The fans - I can only speak for myself here Mike but you guessed wrong in your post Hull match statement when it comes to the type of owner, club and players needed. I don't expect a Man City style club nor do I expect to see the world's biggest names here, much less expect mega money to be spent on players. All I expect from my club and those responsible for running it is for the club to always at all times try at least to be the best it can be and that for me is a top 6 club which isn't asking for the earth. If a good manager was brought in and players capable of developing into good players were added to the team, that can be achieved if not over night than within a few years, without a doubt, even on a frugal budget. Regarding fans in general, it is up to you Mike to win us over and you can do that without any extravagances or gimmicks, good old fashioned sensible management and gradual improvement will bring about happier faces on the stands and you are in a position to do that and that's just what you need to do. Because make no mistake about it the depth of feelings fans have for this club of ours goes a long way and if you think a few thousand empty seats and protests during the Hull match are as bad as it could possibly get for you, think again. Unless positive action is taken and this club improves, you reduce your stake in it by the day and your right to own it which will always be challenged so long as the club under performs and carries on being mismanaged in the fashion it has been and is being ran today. You decide Mike what you want and let us all know how you plan on achieving it eh Yours in vain, a NUFC supporter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.S.R. Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 tl;dr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I did warn Just getting a few things of my chest and trying a different route to the constant oh nos we are f***ed comments which I admit I have been guilty of writing myself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenham Mag Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Don't think he will read it tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robster Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Be canny if that was printed as a full page letter in the chronicle/journal Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilko Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 You make one of these bloody threads every couple of days: nobody reads them tl;dr Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 That took some reading but it's a good post and I think most would agree with it. It's what I was trying to get at a day or two ago when I questioned you about a comment that you made, again, good post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Libertine Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 can you sum it all up in a small, banner sized soundbite? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Sometimes they are worth reading, this time being one of them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sicko2ndbest Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 can you sum it all up in a small, banner sized soundbite? 'Mike Ashley: We are willing to listen if you're willing to talk' ?? Good post, pretty much sums up my opinion I do however think top 6 is too far at the minute as you have Man City and Villa who are not only further on in their development, they also have more money! This however is nitpicking on a very good post! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Liam Liam O Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Too long to read now, I'll read it at work tomorrow. In the meantime, if Mick says it's a good post, then that's good enough for now. Top post HTT Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonpete1892 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 A great post and nail plus head spring to mind! Many supporters will agree on several points you've made there, whether they're backers of ashley or not. We need to pull together as one (despite our different opinions) because its the only way the club can come out of this hole. Shame it would take a bedsheet the size of the Leazes to get this view across to the fickle media . . . . . . . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karjala Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 another boring Sunday? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Heneage Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Good idea, get Mike to divulge the plan thus destroying the element of surprise. This story has been done more times than a Mackem hooker on benefit day, its simple, we look to be buying players for cheap prices that have potential to improve,Mr Bassong, Colocinni, Jonas, and Xisco. on top of this we build a nucleus of players with previous EPL experience, Mr Barton, Nolan, and Taylor for example. While this development of the first team squad is continued we import some of the worlds young talent before bigger clubs come in and poach them, these are the likes of Vukic, Baheng, Soderberg, Kadar,Ranger, and Tozer. The latter element of the strategy allows us to build a strong youth and reserve team, so that, in the future we become a club that produces its own talent, like Arsenal, who boast the likes of Clichy (£250k) Toure (£250k) and Fabregas (Compensation). This will not be achieved overnight, there will be times we are at a low as we use the likes of Butt and see clubs such as Man City spending mega bucks on distinctly average players and bidding for Kaka, despite the fact a few years prior they were playing Preston away. I would imagine that money will be invested, but it will be invested wisely (No pun intended). We need to avoid purchases such as Luque and Boumsong, players who are too old to change leagues, or not mentally tough enough to handle the pressure that comes with Newcastle United. As for the poor communication, its funny how things change. In the summer, the majority of fans (Self included) were happy that the club conducted itself in a quiet yet astute manner, players were not identified by the newspapers or sky, till they were nigh signed by the club. Now if we look at January the same approach is enforced only this time, fans are not happy, they feel that the club are sitting back, being too slow in approach. It appeared that the few times stories broke, such as Ebondo, the club took a while to make progress. Now I imagine our team would blame Toulouse for playing "Silly Buggers" haggling over fee's. But in a way it is good we did not fold, in the days previous, we would probably pay the €6m asked, for a player who was second choice at his club with no real sign of having good potential. My one gripe with the club, feel free to tell we the fans bugger all but, achieve what your promised. Do not make promises such as 2 Loan fee's, 5 players coming in, etc. This will only lead to disaster, nothing is certain in this world. The 2 players could change their mind, the 5 targets could get freak injuries. We as fans often hang on every word that comes out of our club, "Players within 48 hours" so we speculate for 200 pages about players, that never materialize. That frustrates us, making our relationship with you a lot more strained. The manager. We are not stupid, we know that Mr Kinnear was not first choice, nor 2nd or 3rd. But we simple hope that you understand, a man of Joe's age and previous health record is not up to the task of full time management, he's done very well during his tenure, but I urge you to make sure it is a short one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I'm not trying to have a go at NUSC here but I would love them to come out with something like HTT's post. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest VegasToon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonpete1892 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I'm not trying to have a go at NUSC here but I would love them to come out with something like HTT's post. Exactly my thoughts when I was typing my reponse as it could go a long way to destroying the large divide in fans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I do however think top 6 is too far at the minute as you have Man City and Villa who are not only further on in their development, they also have more money! We are quite some distance off the top six without a doubt which I agree with you on but we can close the gap in the meantime and head towards that area of the table given a couple of years under a good competent manager with players that can be developed added to the squad and not at any big cost either as Everton are proving and Bolton under Sam Allardyce previously proved. That's not to say we can simply go out and copy what they are doing or did and achieve the same things. What I'm trying to say is there are other ways to become a good side going places outside of spending big money and if we simply don't have the money which looks that way to me, then we have to look at other alternatives instead of sulking around mid-table or worse, fighting the drop which many people seem to think is the only way if we have no money or are being ran on an extremely frugal budget, i.e. sell before we buy, net spend to a minimum etc. Of course if you want to truly compete then you have to spend money but we have to make our way up from the bottom step first which is where we are at, the bottom rungs of the Premier League ladder, if not in size and potential then certainly financially and positionally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delima Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 HTT, an excellent post. Thank you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Be canny if that was printed as a full page letter in the chronicle/journal How much would that run. I like that letter and would help fund it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 How much would that run. I like that letter and would help fund it. The Sunday Sun has a letters page, they would probably print it and it would cost nowt. They would have to extend the paper to get it all in though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Why doesn't N.O via its members knock up some questions for Mike Ashley or someone at the club to answer and send them to the people concerned, we may not get an answer but they will then know exactly what we want to see from them and what we are concerned about rather than the generic we are shit and we are sick of it feelings which is as ambiguous as the club's statements. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 How much would that run. I like that letter and would help fund it. The Sunday Sun has a letters page, they would probably print it and it would cost nowt. They would have to extend the paper to get it all in though. They may need a bigger boat Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Good idea, get Mike to divulge the plan thus destroying the element of surprise. This story has been done more times than a Mackem hooker on benefit day, its simple, we look to be buying players for cheap prices that have potential to improve,Mr Bassong, Colocinni, Jonas, and Xisco. on top of this we build a nucleus of players with previous EPL experience, Mr Barton, Nolan, and Taylor for example. While this development of the first team squad is continued we import some of the worlds young talent before bigger clubs come in and poach them, these are the likes of Vukic, Baheng, Soderberg, Kadar,Ranger, and Tozer. The latter element of the strategy allows us to build a strong youth and reserve team, so that, in the future we become a club that produces its own talent, like Arsenal, who boast the likes of Clichy (£250k) Toure (£250k) and Fabregas (Compensation). This will not be achieved overnight, there will be times we are at a low as we use the likes of Butt and see clubs such as Man City spending mega bucks on distinctly average players and bidding for Kaka, despite the fact a few years prior they were playing Preston away. I would imagine that money will be invested, but it will be invested wisely (No pun intended). We need to avoid purchases such as Luque and Boumsong, players who are too old to change leagues, or not mentally tough enough to handle the pressure that comes with Newcastle United. As for the poor communication, its funny how things change. In the summer, the majority of fans (Self included) were happy that the club conducted itself in a quiet yet astute manner, players were not identified by the newspapers or sky, till they were nigh signed by the club. Now if we look at January the same approach is enforced only this time, fans are not happy, they feel that the club are sitting back, being too slow in approach. It appeared that the few times stories broke, such as Ebondo, the club took a while to make progress. Now I imagine our team would blame Toulouse for playing "Silly Buggers" haggling over fee's. But in a way it is good we did not fold, in the days previous, we would probably pay the €6m asked, for a player who was second choice at his club with no real sign of having good potential. My one gripe with the club, feel free to tell we the fans bugger all but, achieve what your promised. Do not make promises such as 2 Loan fee's, 5 players coming in, etc. This will only lead to disaster, nothing is certain in this world. The 2 players could change their mind, the 5 targets could get freak injuries. We as fans often hang on every word that comes out of our club, "Players within 48 hours" so we speculate for 200 pages about players, that never materialize. That frustrates us, making our relationship with you a lot more strained. The manager. We are not stupid, we know that Mr Kinnear was not first choice, nor 2nd or 3rd. But we simple hope that you understand, a man of Joe's age and previous health record is not up to the task of full time management, he's done very well during his tenure, but I urge you to make sure it is a short one. I agree. Admire the HTT post as well, and it has a lot of sensible points... But the change and 'proof' you (HTT) seek from Mike Ashley can't be provided in anything other than the long term, so if people really want what you say you want, and they seem to, they'll have to be prepared to ease off Ashley for 3-5 years and let him try to make it work. We can't go mental over one transfer window and/or a couple of seasons where we struggle. I think that is what football fans seem fundamentally unable to do, anything other than immediate improvement is not accepted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Be canny if that was printed as a full page letter in the chronicle/journal How much would that run. I like that letter and would help fund it. http://www.ncjmedia.co.uk/pdfs/advertisingRatesPage/NCJMediaCoreTitlesRatecard2009.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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