Alan Shearer contract latest: long gone

[Dave]

Shearer should be given at least two seasons (unless we're going to get relegated from the Championship).

 

We're in the second tier now, and we should take the time to properly rebuild.  I genuinely believe Shearer can have the effect Keegan had, but no one could motivate the squad we have atm.  Owen being Captain was just so symptomatic.  Shearer's a not a fool, he will be able to assemble his own squad.  

 

Let's see what he can do, and I mean two years.  If I see steps forward, I'm happy.  Even baby steps, so long as they keep going forward.  Because we've been going back for five years now.

 

Agree with every word of that, and I don't care if it's blind faith.

[Neil]

Shearer should be given at least two seasons (unless we're going to get relegated from the Championship).

 

We're in the second tier now, and we should take the time to properly rebuild. I genuinely believe Shearer can have the effect Keegan had, but no one could motivate the squad we have atm.  Owen being Captain was just so symptomatic.  Shearer's a not a fool, he will be able to assemble his own squad.  

 

Let's see what he can do, and I mean two years.  If I see steps forward, I'm happy.  Even baby steps, so long as they keep going forward.  Because we've been going back for five years now.

 

Summed it up.

 

 

[cubaricho]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a good manager? There isn't any at present and unfortunately the present is where we find ourselves. People are supporting Alan Shearer for manager because he's Alan Shearer, not because he's a good manager because no-one knows the answer to that question - either way. If this was anyone other than Alan Shearer we wouldn't be having this conversation.

 

This is about as clear as it gets.  I agree with you 100% on this point and have no clue why everyone is jumping on your back, it's pretty incredulous.  Then again, this probably isn't the best time to be talking any sense on this board.

[Dave]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

[ChrisMcQuillan]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

 

Man United fans wanted Ferguson out at the start.

[cubaricho]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

 

That's the whole point indi is trying to make.  There is no evidence in either direction and that's a big gamble to take when we're clearly "in the shit" and need a serious rebuilding - why not give that job to someone with a proven track record?

[Guest Heneage]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

I acknowledge that it's largely assumption and gut instinct, but just some of his substitutions left me thinking it wasn't going to work.

[Dave]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

 

That's the whole point indi is trying to make.  There is no evidence in either direction and that's a big gamble to take when we're clearly "in the shit" and need a serious rebuilding - why not give that job to someone with a proven track record?

 

We don't know for certain either way tbh.

 

All I can offer as an opinion is that I think we need some stability and continuity. This means keeping Shearer on. If he's shit then so be it, we'll sack him (or he'll walk) and we're free of the 'messiah' stuff for good. If he's not shit we'll be making progress.

[Dave]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

I acknowledge that it's largely assumption and gut instinct, but just some of his substitutions left me thinking it wasn't going to work.

 

Have a think about some of the substitutions Robson made then have a think about whether that defines a manager being good enough or not.

[Yorkie]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

I acknowledge that it's largely assumption and gut instinct, but just some of his substitutions left me thinking it wasn't going to work.

 

Especially the ones at home to Boro.

[Kasper]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

 

That's the whole point indi is trying to make.  There is no evidence in either direction and that's a big gamble to take when we're clearly "in the shit" and need a serious rebuilding - why not give that job to someone with a proven track record?

 

Exactly. If you suggest we start picking managers based on what they HAVENT done instead of HAVE done then I'm putting my name in the hat too. Could use the extra money!

 

 

Although I also agree with the point that we have to get the messiah stuff over with...

[indi]

I really don't imagine there are many better candidates out there to be manager than Shearer.

 

If we could get a proven top class manager to take over then that'd be the way to go, but how likely is that when we're no longer a Premiership club? Not very would be my guess, particularly with the clowns we'd have trying to make the appointment.

 

Hoping Ashley will agree to Shearer's vision for the club and support him in what he wants to do.

 

If not, we won't be a Premiership club again for a long time.

 

Of course there are better candidates out there than an unproven manager with a track record consisting of eight games, most of which were defeats!! If people can forget for a moment that his name is Alan Shearer, then you'll see just how ridiculous that statement is. This is what I mean by the insular thing, everyone's reduced the number of potential managers down to a list consisting of one name. Already, before we've even begun looking!! There's more out there than Alan Shearer, there's more places to look than a list of previous players, than the Premiership, than England, than Europe. Look at where the two best managers in the league came from: Scotland, not even the Old Firm, Aberdeen; and Japan, Japan for fuck's sake, do people seriously not think we could attract someone from the fucking J-League!?!

 

There's loads of potential candidates out there, it's whether or not we actually go and look for them or just go with the easy option and appoint Shearer uncontested. If he is the best that we can get then fine, but let's not assume that without even looking at the alternatives first.

 

Do you honestly believe we have an owner and chairman capable of going out and finding the next management sensation in fucking Japan like?

 

They'd probably come back with some ageing Japanese racist called Jo Kin Ira.

 

What exactly gives you hope that Ashley and Llambias will produce a moment of brilliance and find the right man for the job given their record of absolute and total failure in running the club to this point? Do you think they're due or something?

 

In Shearer we have a man who was one of the best players of his generation, a man who will command respect and do everything in his power to make this club great. He's always come over as someone who really understands the game, and while that's no gaurantee that he'll make a good manager it does make him a pretty decent managerial prospect, especially for a Championship football team.

 

So they shouldn't even look? Let's give up before we've even started, shall we?

 

Like I said, if he turns out to be the best we can get then fine, but let's not start from that position.

 

So what are you actually proposing exactly? Have you actually got someone else in mind for the post? Would they be able to unite the fans in the way Shearer can? Would they be able to give the job a really serious go and bring stability to the club? If so, who is it you have in mind?

 

Or do you have an alternative position we should be starting from? If so, please spell it out for us.

 

I'm proposing that we (the club) put some actual thought and effort into going out and looking at the options available to us. You know, like what the successful clubs do.

 

Wins, points, goals, clean-sheets, good football and ultimately promotion to the Premiership is what will unite the fans. You think we'll be united having spent a few seasons in the Championship, even if Shearer's our manager? I don't. Success is what unites a football club and I think we should be going out and finding the person most likely to get us that, whoever that is. Appointing a manger simply to unite the fans is pointless if he doesn't deliver the goods. We've had it all arse-about-tit for ages when it comes to appointing managers and it's about time it stopped. I'm sick of the club's continual obsession with appeasing the fans, that's what's lead us to where we are now.

 

I have no suggestion as to who we should appoint, I don't know who's available and I've no experience of running a football club. That doesn't mean that I can't see that the only way to address the first point is to go and find out and that it might be a good idea for those doing the second to get some advice and apply a bit of thought as to who they get to be the manager before they make the decision.

 

The position we should be starting from is: We have a vacancy for manager, who is the best man for the job and can we get him? If not, then who is the next best and so-on.

 

So, in summary, your alternative starting point is that basically we need to get a good manager in, plan for the long term but that you haven't got a fucking clue who we should appoint?

 

As for "appeasing the fans" - are you sure about that...do the names "Souness" and "Allardyce" and "Roeder" mean nothing to you?

 

If it was my job to make that decision then I'd make damn sure that I went out and got a clue!!

 

You realise that you're arguing in favour of them remaining clueless, not even trying to get a clue? You want them to remain ignorant and yet you've chosen to attack me for my ignorance in an attempt to back up your argument! Come on man, think about what you're saying and where you're coming from here. If you think Shearer is the best man for the job then justify that opinion with evidence and argument to prove it. The fact that the people who are baking Shearer have only made a token attempt to make his case and have instead put all their energy into attacking those that dare to hold a dissenting view speaks volumes.

 

All those appointments were made for very limited and simplistic reasons: Souness = discipline, Roeder = cheap, Allardyce = "modern" approach. In no case did those in charge give enough thought as to who was the best man for the job and we ended up in the shit because of it. All I'm asking for is some real consideration to be given to the appointment, it's amazing that people are arguing against that, to be honest. If we just appoint Shearer with no further thought, then we continue down the path that has lead us to where we are now. Yeah, we might fluke it and have another Robson on our hands, but we also might not and we won't have learned anything for the next time.

[GM]

What real evidence is there that Shearer will be a bad manager?

 

That's all I see people asking.

 

That's the whole point indi is trying to make.  There is no evidence in either direction and that's a big gamble to take when we're clearly "in the shit" and need a serious rebuilding - why not give that job to someone with a proven track record?

 

"Proven track record" - ah, that old chestnut. How I wish NE5 was here to rehearse that old line...

 

If everyone in the world, in all lines of business and all lines of work, always insisted on having someone with a proven track record, then we'd never get any new managers, directors coming through...at some point you have to take the leap of faith. When recruiting to a vacant post in your team, you look to find the "best available fit" not the "perfect candidate"...mainly because the latter doesn't exist.

 

On gut instinct alone, you have to say Shearer has shown passion, determination, pride, resolution, grace under fire and a sense of humour in adversity. Those qualities alone would be enough for me right now - because there's an inestimable value in having someone at the helm right now who actually cares about the club - rather than someone who is doing it just for the money. He needs to be involved in the club's plans going forward from this point onwards.

[Dave]

Well if the club look into who else is available and pick someone experienced and with a proven track record and pick him over Shearer I don't think many will be complaining.

 

Thing is that's not going to happen, because they have they shown no sort of ability to think beyond club legends and mates, so the point is moot.

 

You should be happy Indi. If Shearer does poorly we'll be rid of his shadow. If he does well we'll be moving back towards the Premier League. How can you lose?

[Dave]

I think it's pretty poor form to claim you're being attacked btw. I've seen nothing that's beyond simple disagreement.

[GM]

I really don't imagine there are many better candidates out there to be manager than Shearer.

 

If we could get a proven top class manager to take over then that'd be the way to go, but how likely is that when we're no longer a Premiership club? Not very would be my guess, particularly with the clowns we'd have trying to make the appointment.

 

Hoping Ashley will agree to Shearer's vision for the club and support him in what he wants to do.

 

If not, we won't be a Premiership club again for a long time.

 

Of course there are better candidates out there than an unproven manager with a track record consisting of eight games, most of which were defeats!! If people can forget for a moment that his name is Alan Shearer, then you'll see just how ridiculous that statement is. This is what I mean by the insular thing, everyone's reduced the number of potential managers down to a list consisting of one name. Already, before we've even begun looking!! There's more out there than Alan Shearer, there's more places to look than a list of previous players, than the Premiership, than England, than Europe. Look at where the two best managers in the league came from: Scotland, not even the Old Firm, Aberdeen; and Japan, Japan for fuck's sake, do people seriously not think we could attract someone from the fucking J-League!?!

 

There's loads of potential candidates out there, it's whether or not we actually go and look for them or just go with the easy option and appoint Shearer uncontested. If he is the best that we can get then fine, but let's not assume that without even looking at the alternatives first.

 

Do you honestly believe we have an owner and chairman capable of going out and finding the next management sensation in fucking Japan like?

 

They'd probably come back with some ageing Japanese racist called Jo Kin Ira.

 

What exactly gives you hope that Ashley and Llambias will produce a moment of brilliance and find the right man for the job given their record of absolute and total failure in running the club to this point? Do you think they're due or something?

 

In Shearer we have a man who was one of the best players of his generation, a man who will command respect and do everything in his power to make this club great. He's always come over as someone who really understands the game, and while that's no gaurantee that he'll make a good manager it does make him a pretty decent managerial prospect, especially for a Championship football team.

 

So they shouldn't even look? Let's give up before we've even started, shall we?

 

Like I said, if he turns out to be the best we can get then fine, but let's not start from that position.

 

So what are you actually proposing exactly? Have you actually got someone else in mind for the post? Would they be able to unite the fans in the way Shearer can? Would they be able to give the job a really serious go and bring stability to the club? If so, who is it you have in mind?

 

Or do you have an alternative position we should be starting from? If so, please spell it out for us.

 

I'm proposing that we (the club) put some actual thought and effort into going out and looking at the options available to us. You know, like what the successful clubs do.

 

Wins, points, goals, clean-sheets, good football and ultimately promotion to the Premiership is what will unite the fans. You think we'll be united having spent a few seasons in the Championship, even if Shearer's our manager? I don't. Success is what unites a football club and I think we should be going out and finding the person most likely to get us that, whoever that is. Appointing a manger simply to unite the fans is pointless if he doesn't deliver the goods. We've had it all arse-about-tit for ages when it comes to appointing managers and it's about time it stopped. I'm sick of the club's continual obsession with appeasing the fans, that's what's lead us to where we are now.

 

I have no suggestion as to who we should appoint, I don't know who's available and I've no experience of running a football club. That doesn't mean that I can't see that the only way to address the first point is to go and find out and that it might be a good idea for those doing the second to get some advice and apply a bit of thought as to who they get to be the manager before they make the decision.

 

The position we should be starting from is: We have a vacancy for manager, who is the best man for the job and can we get him? If not, then who is the next best and so-on.

 

So, in summary, your alternative starting point is that basically we need to get a good manager in, plan for the long term but that you haven't got a fucking clue who we should appoint?

 

As for "appeasing the fans" - are you sure about that...do the names "Souness" and "Allardyce" and "Roeder" mean nothing to you?

 

If it was my job to make that decision then I'd make damn sure that I went out and got a clue!!

 

You realise that you're arguing in favour of them remaining clueless, not even trying to get a clue? You want them to remain ignorant and yet you've chosen to attack me for my ignorance in an attempt to back up your argument! Come on man, think about what you're saying and where you're coming from here. If you think Shearer is the best man for the job then justify that opinion with evidence and argument to prove it. The fact that the people who are baking Shearer have only made a token attempt to make his case and have instead put all their energy into attacking those that dare to hold a dissenting view speaks volumes.

 

All those appointments were made for very limited and simplistic reasons: Souness = discipline, Roeder = cheap, Allardyce = "modern" approach. In no case did those in charge give enough thought as to who was the best man for the job and we ended up in the shit because of it. All I'm asking for is some real consideration to be given to the appointment, it's amazing that people are arguing against that, to be honest. If we just appoint Shearer with no further thought, then we continue down the path that has lead us to where we are now. Yeah, we might fluke it and have another Robson on our hands, but we also might not and we won't have learned anything for the next time.

 

I wasn't arguing any such thing indi. I was merely pointing out that Shearer could be a good choice for us right now. As per my previous post above.

[GM]

I think it's pretty poor form to claim you're being attacked btw. I've seen nothing that's beyond simple disagreement.

 

Aye, indi - you're acting like someone's spat in your tofu and used your copy of the Guardian as bog roll. Calm down man.

[Dave]

I think it's pretty poor form to claim you're being attacked btw. I've seen nothing that's beyond simple disagreement.

 

Aye, indi - you're acting like someone's spat in your tofu and used your copy of the Guardian as bog roll. Calm down man.

 

[indi]

Well if the club look into who else is available and pick someone experienced and with a proven track record and pick him over Shearer I don't think many will be complaining.

 

Thing is that's not going to happen, because they have they shown no sort of ability to think beyond club legends and mates, so the point is moot.

 

You should be happy Indi. If Shearer does poorly we'll be rid of his shadow. If he does well we'll be moving back towards the Premier League. How can you lose?

 

I had hoped we'd be at that position now though.

 

Just to remind people of the managerial appointments under Ashley:

 

Keegan - I was dubious, but almost everyone else seems to think he was the Messiah.

 

Kinnear - Only person willing to take us on? Don't think any of us think he was the man for the job long-term and it appears he isn't going to be.

 

Shearer - I'm dubious, you lot all think he's the best man for the job.

 

So out of three appointments made under Ashley, you lot think two are great and I think all three either weren't right, or might not be right, and yet you lot are arguing that there's no chance of them finding someone good and I'm arguing that they should at least try. How does that work!?!

[Neil]

I don't know if people think he's the best man for the job; it's perhaps more the fact that, due to the situation the club is in, he's the only man for the job.

[Taylor Swift]

He's the best man in our current situation. We're relegated, we have no time for a new guy to come in and assess the squad. We need someone who knows who's good and who's bad, and which areas need fixing and which areas are fine.

 

If we could get Rijkaard then go for it. I'd obviously want the club to sound out some other managers if Shearer refuses, but because of the situation that we're in and based on what Shearer's actually shown, I think Shearer's the best man for the job.

 

Edit: I'd obviously like the board to actually think about other candidates too, and not just think 'If Shearer says no then we go back to Kinnear'.

[indi]

I think it's pretty poor form to claim you're being attacked btw. I've seen nothing that's beyond simple disagreement.

 

Apologies, if that's how it came across, I wasn't meaning people were attacking me personally, rather that people are attacking my opinion, yet not backing up their own. No-one's really made an extensive positive case for Shearer as manager, yet many people have taken the time to disagree with my view that he might not be.

[Dave]

I think it's pretty poor form to claim you're being attacked btw. I've seen nothing that's beyond simple disagreement.

 

Apologies, if that's how it came across, I wasn't meaning people were attacking me personally, rather that people are attacking my opinion, yet not backing up their own. No-one's really made an extensive positive case for Shearer as manager, yet many people have taken the time to disagree with my view that he might not be.

 

It's basically blind faith. I've no problem admitting that.

[indi]

I really don't imagine there are many better candidates out there to be manager than Shearer.

 

If we could get a proven top class manager to take over then that'd be the way to go, but how likely is that when we're no longer a Premiership club? Not very would be my guess, particularly with the clowns we'd have trying to make the appointment.

 

Hoping Ashley will agree to Shearer's vision for the club and support him in what he wants to do.

 

If not, we won't be a Premiership club again for a long time.

 

Of course there are better candidates out there than an unproven manager with a track record consisting of eight games, most of which were defeats!! If people can forget for a moment that his name is Alan Shearer, then you'll see just how ridiculous that statement is. This is what I mean by the insular thing, everyone's reduced the number of potential managers down to a list consisting of one name. Already, before we've even begun looking!! There's more out there than Alan Shearer, there's more places to look than a list of previous players, than the Premiership, than England, than Europe. Look at where the two best managers in the league came from: Scotland, not even the Old Firm, Aberdeen; and Japan, Japan for fuck's sake, do people seriously not think we could attract someone from the fucking J-League!?!

 

There's loads of potential candidates out there, it's whether or not we actually go and look for them or just go with the easy option and appoint Shearer uncontested. If he is the best that we can get then fine, but let's not assume that without even looking at the alternatives first.

 

Do you honestly believe we have an owner and chairman capable of going out and finding the next management sensation in fucking Japan like?

 

They'd probably come back with some ageing Japanese racist called Jo Kin Ira.

 

What exactly gives you hope that Ashley and Llambias will produce a moment of brilliance and find the right man for the job given their record of absolute and total failure in running the club to this point? Do you think they're due or something?

 

In Shearer we have a man who was one of the best players of his generation, a man who will command respect and do everything in his power to make this club great. He's always come over as someone who really understands the game, and while that's no gaurantee that he'll make a good manager it does make him a pretty decent managerial prospect, especially for a Championship football team.

 

So they shouldn't even look? Let's give up before we've even started, shall we?

 

Like I said, if he turns out to be the best we can get then fine, but let's not start from that position.

 

So what are you actually proposing exactly? Have you actually got someone else in mind for the post? Would they be able to unite the fans in the way Shearer can? Would they be able to give the job a really serious go and bring stability to the club? If so, who is it you have in mind?

 

Or do you have an alternative position we should be starting from? If so, please spell it out for us.

 

I'm proposing that we (the club) put some actual thought and effort into going out and looking at the options available to us. You know, like what the successful clubs do.

 

Wins, points, goals, clean-sheets, good football and ultimately promotion to the Premiership is what will unite the fans. You think we'll be united having spent a few seasons in the Championship, even if Shearer's our manager? I don't. Success is what unites a football club and I think we should be going out and finding the person most likely to get us that, whoever that is. Appointing a manger simply to unite the fans is pointless if he doesn't deliver the goods. We've had it all arse-about-tit for ages when it comes to appointing managers and it's about time it stopped. I'm sick of the club's continual obsession with appeasing the fans, that's what's lead us to where we are now.

 

I have no suggestion as to who we should appoint, I don't know who's available and I've no experience of running a football club. That doesn't mean that I can't see that the only way to address the first point is to go and find out and that it might be a good idea for those doing the second to get some advice and apply a bit of thought as to who they get to be the manager before they make the decision.

 

The position we should be starting from is: We have a vacancy for manager, who is the best man for the job and can we get him? If not, then who is the next best and so-on.

 

So, in summary, your alternative starting point is that basically we need to get a good manager in, plan for the long term but that you haven't got a fucking clue who we should appoint?

 

As for "appeasing the fans" - are you sure about that...do the names "Souness" and "Allardyce" and "Roeder" mean nothing to you?

 

If it was my job to make that decision then I'd make damn sure that I went out and got a clue!!

 

You realise that you're arguing in favour of them remaining clueless, not even trying to get a clue? You want them to remain ignorant and yet you've chosen to attack me for my ignorance in an attempt to back up your argument! Come on man, think about what you're saying and where you're coming from here. If you think Shearer is the best man for the job then justify that opinion with evidence and argument to prove it. The fact that the people who are baking Shearer have only made a token attempt to make his case and have instead put all their energy into attacking those that dare to hold a dissenting view speaks volumes.

 

All those appointments were made for very limited and simplistic reasons: Souness = discipline, Roeder = cheap, Allardyce = "modern" approach. In no case did those in charge give enough thought as to who was the best man for the job and we ended up in the shit because of it. All I'm asking for is some real consideration to be given to the appointment, it's amazing that people are arguing against that, to be honest. If we just appoint Shearer with no further thought, then we continue down the path that has lead us to where we are now. Yeah, we might fluke it and have another Robson on our hands, but we also might not and we won't have learned anything for the next time.

 

I wasn't arguing any such thing indi. I was merely pointing out that Shearer could be a good choice for us right now. As per my previous post above.

 

So given the fact that I'm simply arguing that some serious thought should be given to who our next manager is, why are you disagreeing with me then?

[Taylor Swift]

Indi, I posted this in another thread.

 

The other argument that can be made for Shearer is based on stability. We need it. He's actually seen the squad and the players, so he won't need time in preseason to judge the players again. And this summer, it's even more important that whoever our manager is judges right, because we can't afford to keep shit players. So because Shearer's actually seen our players in training everyday, I'd rather he stayed because of that (on top of the other reasons that I've mentioned).

 

Of course there's still a lot of doubt about Shearer. He's no Fergie or Wenger (yet...), he hasn't shown real tactical nous in changing the way we actually play (i.e. increasing width, or more passing and movement in general etc.), but I think it's way too early to judge him on a set of players who were known to be very shit and the fact that he had 8 games which is nothing.

 

Give him two years. Let him clear out the squad, let him work the transfer market and let's see how next year's team does. If we clear out everyone and start again, then I wouldn't mind it if we only challenged for the playoffs but had a squad full of youngsters with potential.

 

and

 

Shearer did what he could to put the best players on the pitch. He dropped Owen for a few games and actually got Viduka playing again. That is a credit to his management.

 

The only main disappointment I have is with how he handled Jonas: This was a guy who, if properly motivated, runs his legs off (Old Trafford, first match). But ever since Shearer's got here, his play has looked uninspired, and he just looks tired. Maybe he is tired, but I was expecting more from him and Shearer's gotta be partially responsible for the shit end to Jonas' season.

 

Other than that, Shearer's been much better than I thought he'd be. He's not afraid to try different formations, even if some of them had bad results, but the attempt counts a lot in my opinion. He also gave up on them as soon as he found out that they didn't work, which again counts a lot. Shearer's obviously not the finished product and I imagine that if he does stay for the long term, he'll make some permanent changes to the backroom staff which will have a bigger effect on the way the team plays. I think he's shown that he can improve, and on that basis, I believe he'll get better as time passes. That, to me, makes me comfortable with the thought of him being our long-term manager.

 

That's my argument for keeping him.