Guest firetotheworks Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 If it was Newcastle I think I'd get a bit carried away too tbf. Not Messi obviously, but they signed Robinho, that's pretty fucking big. Players like Ribery are well within their grasp if they want to out-muscle any other team with their money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I'd say that (Not taking into consideration players not just wanting a shitload of money but want to be playing for an actual club.) Man City now are fourth in the world re: attractiveness behind Man Utd, Real Madrid and Barcelona due to their money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I'd say that (Bar players not just wanting a shitload of money but want to be playing for an actual club.) Man City now are fourth in the world re: attractiveness behind Man Utd, Real Madrid and Barcelona due to their money. You're mad if you think they are ahead of Inter, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Milan, Juve, Valencia, and Olympique Marseille. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I'd say that (Bar players not just wanting a shitload of money but want to be playing for an actual club.) Man City now are fourth in the world re: attractiveness behind Man Utd, Real Madrid and Barcelona due to their money. You're mad if you think they are ahead of Inter, Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Milan, Juve, Valencia, and Olympique Marseille. Man City can outbid any of those clubs regarding wages these days, and I dare say at least 70-75% of all footballers today only care about money. Chelsea could probably sneak in ahead of them, though. It doesn't do them any bad that the PL is generally a more attractive league for players to go to than the French and Italian, either. Option A: "Hey player X, here's £40k a week, come play in Italy." Option B: "Don't listen to them player X, come to England and get £80k a week, not enough you say? Why, here's £100k. And here's a motivational speech as well regarding how we'll break into the top four and get CL to top it all off." I dare say most players would go for option B. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Marseille was actually put in their as a bitter, bitter joke, but I think there is a lot more prestige in playing for teams with more history who are already constantly in Europe and near the top of their leagues anyway. Most players don't want help build a club, they want to go to one that is established and continue the tradition. Unless you are talking about giving out outrageous wages for average players (tbf, City do this occasion), all those clubs would be willing to pay top players very high wages. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Marseille was actually put in their as a bitter, bitter joke, but I think there is a lot more prestige in playing for teams with more history who are already constantly in Europe and near the top of their leagues anyway. Unless you are talking about giving out outrageous wages for average players (tbf, City do this occasion), all those clubs would be willing to pay top players very high wages. The issue is City could trump any wage offer, and footballers these days are money hungry whores. I don't like it, but it's reality. I don't disagree there's more prestige playing for clubs with a history, but in today's footballing world it's mostly just the fans who have the pipe dream that the players actually care about clubs. Well, some do, but they're in a massive minority. Having said that, I don't think they can take players away from the biggest clubs. Just steal their transfer targets should they go for the same players. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 You're being too negative about the modern footballer. If you'll notice, the players they've gotten thus far are outcasts from other top clubs after a pay day, or the top players from middling sides that are in a different stratosphere financially. The top, top players who have their pick of any club in the world, have almost universally rejected them. They've had the money for four windows now. At what point have they beaten out any of the clubs I mentioned, or any other top club for a top player? Eto'o, Kaka, and Ronaldo all went to more established, popular, and historically successful clubs. City are still nouveau riche. This counts for something in the minds of players and everyone else. They have a way to go, yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 You're being too negative about the modern footballer. If you'll notice, the players they've gotten thus far are outcasts from other top clubs after a pay day, or the top players from middling sides that are in a different stratosphere financially. The top, top players who have their pick of any club in the world, have almost universally rejected them. They've had the money for four windows now. At what point have they beaten out any of the clubs I mentioned, or any other top club for a top player? Eto'o, Kaka, and Ronaldo all went to more established, popular, and historically successful clubs. City are still nouveau riche. They have a way to go, yet. I said they're behind Real Madrid in attractiveness, why use players they've signed as examples? Eto'o was a part of the Zlatan deal as well, which was to one of the other clubs I said was ahead of them when it came to attractiveness. Not to mention we have no idea if they ever were in for the same targets as the clubs you've mentioned, bar the ones I said was above them. So in that sense we'll never find out which one of us is right or wrong. And I fully believe that some players still value history in their clubs above money, I just don't believe that most of them do. If City ever gets CL football there will be no stopping them tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ross magoo Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Dundee United one. Rangers nil. That is all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Tevez is a top player they outdid a top team to sign, and a one that the player was already at, at that. I agree with what you're saying like Baba, but as soon as it comes down to a bidding war, they can more or less force a player's hand if they really want to, purely by blowing other bidding teams out of the water. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Tevez is an interesting example. I thought of him as an outcast from a club. Mr. Ferguson wasn't playing him too much and Man U didn't show any urgency in getting him to sign permanently. (i.e. they didn't enter serious negotiations during the season) From what I could understand, they just weren't very interested in paying 30-40 million pounds for a backup striker. Regardless of all that though, I agree with the point about forcing the players hand. Especially these days, when agents exert such a heavy influence over players. That will definitely be the case in some situations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaizero Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Tevez is an interesting example. I thought of him as an outcast from a club. Mr. Ferguson wasn't playing him too much and Man U didn't show any urgency in getting him to sign permanently. (i.e. they didn't enter serious negotiations during the season) From what I could understand, they just weren't very interested in paying 30-40 million pounds for a backup striker. Regardless of all that though, I agree with the point about forcing the players hand. Especially these days, when agents exert such a heavy influence over players. That will definitely be the case in some situations. So what are we discussing now? I mean.. You say some players still fancy history over money, I agreed. I said Man City have the potential to buy whoever they wanted (given the players they would be buying would be wanting money over history), you agreed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Tevez is an interesting example. I thought of him as an outcast from a club. Mr. Ferguson wasn't playing him too much and Man U didn't show any urgency in getting him to sign permanently. (i.e. they didn't enter serious negotiations during the season) From what I could understand, they just weren't very interested in paying 30-40 million pounds for a backup striker. Regardless of all that though, I agree with the point about forcing the players hand. Especially these days, when agents exert such a heavy influence over players. That will definitely be the case in some situations. So what are we discussing now? I mean.. You say some players still fancy history over money, I agreed. I said Man City have the potential to buy whoever they wanted (given the players they would be buying would be wanting money over history), you agreed. The arguments you've presented have been quite ample imo. As far as I'm concerned, if the Man City owners keep pumping the money in they'll be a staple of the top 4 for many years, whether it begins this season or not. They've drawn far too many games this season like, and it'll be interesting to see what happens with Mancini in the summer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliMag Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 Dundee United one. Rangers nil. St. Mirren four Celtic nil. That is all. FYP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely fucking knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely fucking knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. It's interesting you mention about him playing the same side - it's something I've noticed when watching you lot play, it's always, give or take 1 or 2 occasions, the same eleven. I'm pleased that Moyes has changed in that respect - he's much more open to squad rotation (well, sometimes enforced) nowadays. I don't think you'll finish as poorly as last season but I still don't think you'll end the season strongly. Crunch game at yours (any idea when it may be re-arranged for?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenham Mag Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely f***ing knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. These mongs disagree : http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=483365 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely f***ing knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. These mongs disagree : http://www.readytogo.net/smb/showthread.php?t=483365 They're deluding themselves, then. Cheers when they scored, and a few renditions of "We are Sunderland, we are Sunderland" and that was it. They're usually quite noisey but last night they were terrible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brummie Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely fucking knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. It's interesting you mention about him playing the same side - it's something I've noticed when watching you lot play, it's always, give or take 1 or 2 occasions, the same eleven. I'm pleased that Moyes has changed in that respect - he's much more open to squad rotation (well, sometimes enforced) nowadays. I don't think you'll finish as poorly as last season but I still don't think you'll end the season strongly. Crunch game at yours (any idea when it may be re-arranged for?) It is April 14th, confirmed last week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Zaius Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I've got the pleasure of watching them from the Kop on Sunday. Going down with a liverpool supporting mate and two mackems for the weekend seeing as they came down with me last year for the Newcastle game. Not particularly looking forward to it like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 What an awful night that was. We've got the most stubborn manager I can ever remember us having. Persists in playing Cuellar at RB when the entire world can see it doesn't work. When we're not having things go our way, he can't seem to change things - or more accurately, doesn't want to do so. And for all the "Martin plays his strongest side every time" worship from the press, what that actually means is "Martin plays the same side every time". Petrov, Milner and Dunne look absolutely fucking knackered. Everton now have a decent chance of finishing above us. To make it worse, it pissed down with rain all night long. Sunderland watchers will be interested to know they were the worst fans we've had at our place this season, barely a peep out of them. Sold about 1500 of the 3200 usually available, which in itself isn't too bad given it is a rearranged night game, but those who came were mute. Most unlike them. It's interesting you mention about him playing the same side - it's something I've noticed when watching you lot play, it's always, give or take 1 or 2 occasions, the same eleven. I'm pleased that Moyes has changed in that respect - he's much more open to squad rotation (well, sometimes enforced) nowadays. I don't think you'll finish as poorly as last season but I still don't think you'll end the season strongly. Crunch game at yours (any idea when it may be re-arranged for?) It is April 14th, confirmed last week. The Everton website is truly useless. Interesting that it's so close, then. I'd arguably take a draw, if we can make up 3 more points this weekend which is a decent possibility. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1878 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I'm sure it was announced on our O/S last week Neil. I remember reading about it somewhere anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 I'm sure it was announced on our O/S last week Neil. I remember reading about it somewhere anyway. It probably is me really. I was looking about it for a couple of days ago, might have been another site that still had it as "TBC". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leffe186 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 That's going to be an insane week. We have the Semi on Sunday, then Arsenal at home the 14th, then Chelsea at home the 17th. Brummie's got the Semi on the Saturday, then you guys the 14th. It's the Manchester derby on the 17th as well. Liverpool have an easy run that week, can see them clawing a lot of points back on us all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
1878 Posted March 25, 2010 Share Posted March 25, 2010 That's going to be an insane week. We have the Semi on Sunday, then Arsenal at home the 14th, then Chelsea at home the 17th. Brummie's got the Semi on the Saturday, then you guys the 14th. It's the Manchester derby on the 17th as well. Liverpool have an easy run that week, can see them clawing a lot of points back on us all. We've got by far the easiest run-in of the lot but we've left it a bit too late to get fourth. It would take a collapse by more than one side. tbh I wouldn't mind finishing 6th/7th and still missing out on the Europa League because less games would make it easier to have a proper push for 4th next season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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