The old Chris Hughton discussion thread

[Parky]

Anyone else really enthused about what it appears Hughton has said to Ben Arfa?

 

What was that exactly? He said something about playing him in a free role or something did he?

 

I started reading the Ben Arfa interview but my eyes began to vomit.

 

 

Well it's not clear what was said, but obviously it was exciting enough to convince the player to want to come here and play for us. Also obviously implies Hughton wants a player in that über-creative mould in the team.

 

[Ronaldo]

We just don't have the players for 4-2-3-1. I'd be surprised if we were to play with that system.

[Shak]

We just don't have the players for 4-2-3-1. I'd be surprised if we were to play with that system.

 

What system do you think our current squad are more suited to?

 

EDIT: Assuming we sign Ben Arfa, that is.

[Guest je85]

I always thought it'd be 4-5-1/4-4-1-1 style effort.

[Guest]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------A.N.Other-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

[Shak]

4-4-1-1 and 4-2-3-1 are more or less the same thing really.

[Shak]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------A.N.Other-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

 

Guthrie in the open spot, for me.

[Unbelievable]

I'd be highly encouraged if Hughton does want Ben Arfa to play in the hole in a 4-2-3-1 system, definitely.

 

Would show that he's not just going to try and play 4-4-2, long ball football with two big guys up front and try and grind out results.

 

Really hope he'll give Barton and Guthrie an extended run together in CM as well, no doubt they're the best duo we have in terms of trying to play through the middle a bit.

 

As the two "holding" midfielders on a 4-2-3-1? We'd get slaughtered as there is a distinct lack of physical strength there IYAM.

[Parky]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------A.N.Other-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

That looks nice.

 

But it will end up more like this...

 

 

----------------Carroll-------------

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

----------------Bafra--------------

 

 

 

 

 

 

---Guti----

--Ricky-----------------------Routledge

-------------Barton---Nolan--------------Perch

--------------------Collo----

[Unbelievable]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------A.N.Other-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

 

Guthrie in the open spot, for me.

 

Where do our captain and vice captain fit in all of that?

[Guest]

He might go with Nolan alongside Barton.

[Shak]

I'd be highly encouraged if Hughton does want Ben Arfa to play in the hole in a 4-2-3-1 system, definitely.

 

Would show that he's not just going to try and play 4-4-2, long ball football with two big guys up front and try and grind out results.

 

Really hope he'll give Barton and Guthrie an extended run together in CM as well, no doubt they're the best duo we have in terms of trying to play through the middle a bit.

 

As the two "holding" midfielders on a 4-2-3-1? We'd get slaughtered as there is a distinct lack of physical strength there IYAM.

 

It's not perfect admittedly, ideally I'd want a more imposing type in there to replace either Guthrie or Barton long term.

 

But that said I don't think Guthrie and Barton are any pushover in CM either, and as a duo I'd be confident enough they could do a decent job in protecting the back 4.

[Shak]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------A.N.Other-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

 

Guthrie in the open spot, for me.

 

Where do our captain and vice captain fit in all of that?

 

The bench.

 

Nolan would be a handy enough player to be able to throw on late in games.

[Cajun]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Carroll----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------Arevalo-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

Fixed your post, fwap fwap fwap.

[Parky]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Anichebe----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------Arevalo-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

Fixed your post, fwap fwap fwap.

 

FYp

[Guest BlacknWhiteArmy]

He might go with Nolan alongside Barton.

 

That'd be a bit deep for Nolan

[Shak]

I think 4-2-3-1 with

 

------------------------Anichebe----------------------

 

Jonas----------------Ben Arfa-----------Routledge

 

------------------Barton------Arevalo-----------

 

Is exactly the formation which would suit the personnel we have.

 

Fixed your post, fwap fwap fwap.

 

FYp

 

No you didn't.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

He's an easy guy to root for, would be nice to see him make a good job of it after some of the tossers we've had in charge in recent years (has any other club ever had three bigger arseholes than Kinnear, Souness and Fat Sam manage them in the space of a few years?).

 

I'm still unconvinced he's got what it takes, but he's earned a fair crack at it with what he did last year.

 

I'm quite interested to see what sort of formation he's planning to use, the fact that we don't appear to be looking at any strikers at all combined with the fact that Ben Arfa seems to reckon Hughton wants to play him in a free role has me thinking he wants to go with a 4-2-3-1 like Germany and Holland used at the World Cup.

 

Good post.

 

I think his formation selection in the first 4 weeks will say a lot about how he's planning on setting about keeping us up.

[Guest BlacknWhiteArmy]

If we got Arevalo and HBA in, I'd love us to try a 4-2-3-1, like NUT Chris posted

[Parky]

He might go with Nolan alongside Barton.

 

That'd be a bit deep for Nolan

 

He's quite a bright lad apparently.

[SteveMc]

He might go with Nolan alongside Barton.

 

That'd be a bit deep for Nolan

 

He's quite a bright lad apparently.

 

[80]

He's an easy guy to root for, would be nice to see him make a good job of it after some of the tossers we've had in charge in recent years (has any other club ever had three bigger arseholes than Kinnear, Souness and Fat Sam manage them in the space of a few years?).

 

I'm still unconvinced he's got what it takes, but he's earned a fair crack at it with what he did last year.

 

I'm quite interested to see what sort of formation he's planning to use, the fact that we don't appear to be looking at any strikers at all combined with the fact that Ben Arfa seems to reckon Hughton wants to play him in a free role has me thinking he wants to go with a 4-2-3-1 like Germany and Holland used at the World Cup.

 

Good post.

 

I think his formation selection in the first 4 weeks will say a lot about how he's planning on setting about keeping us up.

 

Yes, although one thing I've been pretty impressed with by Hughton is that underneath what has appeared to be a pretty static front, he's shown he does think about revisions and is prepared to go with them as and when circumstances allow. For example making us more attacking at probably the right time, and moving Guthrie inside to his best position once he no longer served the overall club best on our extremely weak right flank following Routledge's arrival etc. Basically what I'm trying to say is if I see something weak in the way we're going about things in the early season, I'd give credit to the idea that he sees it too but has valid reasons for not having resolved the issue as yet.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

He's an easy guy to root for, would be nice to see him make a good job of it after some of the tossers we've had in charge in recent years (has any other club ever had three bigger arseholes than Kinnear, Souness and Fat Sam manage them in the space of a few years?).

 

I'm still unconvinced he's got what it takes, but he's earned a fair crack at it with what he did last year.

 

I'm quite interested to see what sort of formation he's planning to use, the fact that we don't appear to be looking at any strikers at all combined with the fact that Ben Arfa seems to reckon Hughton wants to play him in a free role has me thinking he wants to go with a 4-2-3-1 like Germany and Holland used at the World Cup.

 

Good post.

 

I think his formation selection in the first 4 weeks will say a lot about how he's planning on setting about keeping us up.

 

Yes, although one thing I've been pretty impressed with by Hughton is that underneath what has appeared to be a pretty static front, he's shown he does think about revisions and is prepared to go with them as and when circumstances allow. For example making us more attacking at probably the right time, and moving Guthrie inside to his best position once he no longer served the overall club best on our extremely weak right flank following Routledge's arrival etc. Basically what I'm trying to say is if I see something weak in the way we're going about things in the early season, I'd give credit to the idea that he sees it too but has valid reasons for not having resolved the issue as yet.

 

See I'd say the opposite in that it took him until well after Christmas to realise how much better we were than all of the sides we were facing and go out and just try and beat them.

[80]

He's an easy guy to root for, would be nice to see him make a good job of it after some of the tossers we've had in charge in recent years (has any other club ever had three bigger arseholes than Kinnear, Souness and Fat Sam manage them in the space of a few years?).

 

I'm still unconvinced he's got what it takes, but he's earned a fair crack at it with what he did last year.

 

I'm quite interested to see what sort of formation he's planning to use, the fact that we don't appear to be looking at any strikers at all combined with the fact that Ben Arfa seems to reckon Hughton wants to play him in a free role has me thinking he wants to go with a 4-2-3-1 like Germany and Holland used at the World Cup.

 

Good post.

 

I think his formation selection in the first 4 weeks will say a lot about how he's planning on setting about keeping us up.

 

Yes, although one thing I've been pretty impressed with by Hughton is that underneath what has appeared to be a pretty static front, he's shown he does think about revisions and is prepared to go with them as and when circumstances allow. For example making us more attacking at probably the right time, and moving Guthrie inside to his best position once he no longer served the overall club best on our extremely weak right flank following Routledge's arrival etc. Basically what I'm trying to say is if I see something weak in the way we're going about things in the early season, I'd give credit to the idea that he sees it too but has valid reasons for not having resolved the issue as yet.

 

See I'd say the opposite in that it took him until well after Christmas to realise how much better we were than all of the sides we were facing and go out and just try and beat them.

 

No, I'm sympathetic. Think we were brittle well into the campaign. Also because the other sides were so crap we could rely on the notion that they wouldn't score while we sat back. I think we could have started looking bad, in our own eyes and in the eyes of the competition, if we'd started having more shots and getting less points. I really feel one of the single biggest factors in our success last year was the opposition literally expecting to lose. Failure of ambition. Any sign of weakness (games dominated and three points not taken) would have fed into a 'bottling geordies shown up' narrative. That had to be avoided at all costs, even if a few short-term losses were incurred. Better to be envisaged as solid and unremarkable than flashy and vulnerable.

 

Fact is we didn't have much attacking talent prior to January. Gutierrez individually is as potent as a wet fart, I don't think Lovenkrands is much special and we had no right winger. Our most creative, fit central midfielder was the only one much who was much use at filling that role, which left us with Smith and Nolan in the middle.

 

Dealing specifically with Hughton and my idea that he doesn't just plump with decisions until something has to change, I think stuff along the lines of the above were what fed into his actions last year, even if he was wrong.

[Yorkie]

He's an easy guy to root for, would be nice to see him make a good job of it after some of the tossers we've had in charge in recent years (has any other club ever had three bigger arseholes than Kinnear, Souness and Fat Sam manage them in the space of a few years?).

 

I'm still unconvinced he's got what it takes, but he's earned a fair crack at it with what he did last year.

 

I'm quite interested to see what sort of formation he's planning to use, the fact that we don't appear to be looking at any strikers at all combined with the fact that Ben Arfa seems to reckon Hughton wants to play him in a free role has me thinking he wants to go with a 4-2-3-1 like Germany and Holland used at the World Cup.

 

Good post.

 

I think his formation selection in the first 4 weeks will say a lot about how he's planning on setting about keeping us up.

 

Yes, although one thing I've been pretty impressed with by Hughton is that underneath what has appeared to be a pretty static front, he's shown he does think about revisions and is prepared to go with them as and when circumstances allow. For example making us more attacking at probably the right time, and moving Guthrie inside to his best position once he no longer served the overall club best on our extremely weak right flank following Routledge's arrival etc. Basically what I'm trying to say is if I see something weak in the way we're going about things in the early season, I'd give credit to the idea that he sees it too but has valid reasons for not having resolved the issue as yet.

 

See I'd say the opposite in that it took him until well after Christmas to realise how much better we were than all of the sides we were facing and go out and just try and beat them.

 

Unfair imo.

 

Bar the occassional poxy away game (Leicester comes to mind); i don't think he's ever had anything other than a 'go out and beat em' philosophy. That's just typically cynical really, but somewhat predictable given the fact he was a defender... also taking into account our recent track record of old-fashioned managers.

 

The problem in the early months was simply the lack of balance; but shoehorning Guthrie in was hardly Hughton's major plan. It was simply down to the fact we didn't replace Duff, and only had one winger in the squad come September. Hughton signed a right-winger even before the iffy Christmas period, so it wasn't as if he didn't recognise the side's major flaw. The fact he then signed Routledge after Pancrate only proves that he was desperate to get the balance and philsophy to the side absolutely right. (Pancrate having proved he was gash).

 

I can't say i'm convinced by the 'narrow the pitch' idea, but i think it's a bit cheap and easy to label him as cautious/defensive. We still won 16 matches before the turn of the year in our so called 'cautious' spell (you didn't coin it as such but i'll dub it so).