Alan Pardew

[madras]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Cracking post.

except arguably hughes,o'brien,dabizas,griffin was worse but got us into the champs league ?

[Frazzle]

All we need is another world class manager to links to the area then eh? 

 

 

[Wullie]

The difference between that team and this one was that this team deliberately invites pressure by giving the ball away with long balls, that team preferred to keep possession so that the other team couldn't get at the defence so easily.

[Guest Dontooner]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Cracking post.

Dont rate Pardew, too negative in my view, things can quickly change when things aint going well. Still prefer football that could grant results by scoring and not focusing all on defending. When you go through a goal drought, there is no way you can win.

[Guest BooBoo]

Dabizas, Hughes and Griffin were all fairly decent defenders tbh. Better than Simpson, Williamson and Santon anyhow.

[madras]

Dabizas, Hughes and Griffin were all fairly decent defenders tbh. Better than Simpson, Williamson and Santon anyhow.

none as good as colo or saylor though

[madras]

The difference between that team and this one was that this team deliberately invites pressure by giving the ball away with long balls, that team preferred to keep possession so that the other team couldn't get at the defence so easily.

exactly, that team had a midfield that both attacked and defended and had clever players who knew how to read a good game, cover for each other when they moved. now we have 2 midfielders incapable of doing other than what they are (tiote and jonas), 1 looking fucked and a bit lost (cabaye) and take your pick on the right

[thedudeabides]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Cracking post.

except arguably hughes,o'brien,dabizas,griffin was worse but got us into the champs league ?

 

With the exception of Colo, they were all better defenders than our current crop.

 

And the rest of that team pisses all over this one.

 

Apart from that, it's a good comparison.

[madras]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Cracking post.

except arguably hughes,o'brien,dabizas,griffin was worse but got us into the champs league ?

 

With the exception of Colo, they were all better defenders than our current crop.

 

And the rest of that team pisses all over this one.

 

Apart from that, it's a good comparison.

i'd take saylor over dabizas,o'brien and titus.

[Beren]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Disagree with most of the bolded tbh.

 

Few (if any?) have suggested HBA as some cure-all. His inclusion is integral to our progression as a team, I would concede that. His defensive work has never been feeble nor does it cause us major problems. What causes us problems is being unable to take the ball out of defence and keep possession (in fact only Jonas can do it, so far). What causes us problems is that by having omitted HBA from the side, we have more readily given the ball back to the opposition, and given them a chance to repeatedly prod, probe and scrutinise a defence you deem to be the worst we've ever had in Premiership history.

 

HBA doesn't need fixing, tbh. His contribution going forwards, and for players around him so far outweighs any defensive foibles he has that that any argument to the contrary isn't really worth entertaining... yet here we are. Pardew has been completely wrong about his use of HBA IMO. His defensive contribution and application is no better now than it was in November - but Pardew is now full of praise for the same performances "his side couldn't afford" earlier in the season. It's horseshit 101. He's just reached desperation point - and that has prompted HBA's latest run.

 

Incidentally, HBA's attitude as a three-quarter player was to play football on the deck and destroy teams (as his quotes from earlier in the season attest to). That seems more befitting of a top four side who hopes to stay there for the long-term, than a team hanging on for dear life 2-0 up at home against an out-of-sorts Everton. Defensive performances and grit have their place in grinding out reults, but to characterise HBA's attitude as the antithesis of what would have kept us in the top four is asinine.

 

I think the squad is capable of doing much better, and I think you've been very, very kind to Pardew saying that this is the most this squad is capable of. Our defensive personnel is weak, but our midfield personnel IMO is among the very best in the Premiership. Given that we have had the power to take initiative of games and protect our defence from scrutiny by controlling the tempo. Instead we've mis-used our midfield personnel to focus the attention of games on our defence - whilst relying on Ba's superhuman form to keep us picking up points.

[thedudeabides]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Cracking post.

except arguably hughes,o'brien,dabizas,griffin was worse but got us into the champs league ?

 

With the exception of Colo, they were all better defenders than our current crop.

 

And the rest of that team pisses all over this one.

 

Apart from that, it's a good comparison.

i'd take saylor over dabizas,o'brien and titus.

 

I'd take anyone of them alongside Woodgate over Colo and Taylor any day of the week.

[Wullie]

Some canny fucking revisionism going on here like - singing the praises of O'Brien, Griffin and Dabizas?!

 

The defence isn't even the problem by and large so I don't know why Simpson and Williamson have become the focus. They certainly weren't the problem against Wolves and the mackems were they? The problem is the movement in midfield, how rigid we are, our inability to get hold of a game - none of this is a defensive problem and apart from silly mistakes, we actually defended pretty well last night.

[madras]

Some canny f***ing revisionism going on here like - singing the praises of O'Brien, Griffin and Dabizas?!

 

The defence isn't even the problem by and large so I don't know why Simpson and Williamson have become the focus. They certainly weren't the problem against Wolves and the mackems were they? The problem is the movement in midfield, how rigid we are, our inability to get hold of a game - none of this is a defensive problem and apart from silly mistakes, we actually defended pretty well last night.

we only tend to agree about once a year. it's come early this time round.

[ponsaelius]

Some canny fucking revisionism going on here like - singing the praises of O'Brien, Griffin and Dabizas?!

 

The defence isn't even the problem by and large so I don't know why Simpson and Williamson have become the focus. They certainly weren't the problem against Wolves and the mackems were they? The problem is the movement in midfield, how rigid we are, our inability to get hold of a game - none of this is a defensive problem and apart from silly mistakes, we actually defended pretty well last night.

 

Yep, and this leads to our defence being put under far too much pressure to the point where they're bound to buckle. Second half yesterday was so infuriating, there was no need to be under as much pressure as we were. We clearly don't have the first fucking clue how to get hold of possession, move for each other and keep hold of the ball for any more than 20 seconds. Problem has to stem from the training grond because the players are more than good enough to do so.

[ponsaelius]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

[Ikon]

When we break up attacks we have almost all of our players behind or in line with the ball, too many too deep, when we get possession at that moment we have no players able to find space behind and stretch the opponent, that results it being too tight and us making either waay too short and risky passes or hoof it long with maybe Ba there all alone. There's just no flow.

[Guest neesy111]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

 

Aye, the football we've played this calendar year (bar Man Utd) has been awful and there are very little signs it's going to improve.

[madras]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

 

Aye, the football we've played this calendar year (bar Man Utd) has been awful and there are very little signs it's going to improve.

fulham first half was as good football as we've played since we came back up. reminiscent of both villa away games.

[Dr Venkman]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

 

They'll all cotton on next season unless he sorts his approach out, can't see it though.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Fulham first half was class, makes the second half all the more bizarre really.

[Guest neesy111]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

 

They'll all cotton on next season unless he sorts his approach out, can't see it though.

 

He's slowly being found out now.

[Jagten]

I can't believe the lack of criticism Pardew is getting for yesterday away from these boards. I'd have honestly been annoyed even if we'd escaped with the draw such was the ineptitude of our display yet again. Stealing a draw would have meant very little in the grand scheme of things - the way our football is going we're not going to build towards anything.

I agree, apparently we should be proud of the commitment and effort.

[TRon]

At the start of the season I thought a defence of Simpson, Perch, RTaylor, STaylor, Coloccini, Williamson, Ferguson, and no one except later Santon was at least as bad as what got us promoted and possibly the worst I had ever seen us have in the Premiership.

 

I think Pardew would like to play more attacking football but I can see why he wants to focus on protecting the back 4 and agree with the approach. We have seen them completely collapse on several occasions, to have the best defence in the league after 10 games with that lot was a remarkable achievement.

 

We haven't got good enough wide players to compensate for constantly leaking two or three goals a game, and while we could get more from Cabaye in the final third, Tiote will never offer much in this area. We were fortunate (and Pardew deserves credit) that at the start of the season that Ryan Taylor (at leftback, unbelievably) and Jonas were in the the form of their lives.

 

Obertan just isn't good enough, we took a gamble on the cheap option with a poor injury record in Marveaux and it didn't work. The result, inevitably, is the ball ends up in the air a lot. With that midfield and Williamson and Simpson at the back it would be the same regardless of who the manager is.

 

Its a shame because in Ba and Cisse we could potentially have a very good strikeforce, but they need the ball on the deck. The solution everyone wants is to just play BenArfa on the wing and go for it. I'd obviously like to see more from him and couldn't understand what Pardew was doing with him but his defensive play really is feeble and does cause us problems. He represents the complete opposite of the attitude that had us in the top 4.

 

In simple terms the squad isn't good enough for us to do any better. We were a very direct team last year, Pardew wanted us to be more entertaining this year. He didn't get enough backing to make the full transition and now we are stuck half way between the two, with a manager who is correctly inclined to err towards defence.

 

If we do manage to finish 6th or 7th it will be because of Pardew's ability to extract passable and sometimes decent performances from RTaylor, Best, Guthrie, Williamson, Simpson, Shola, and even James Perch on a regular basis. I reckon Souness could get that lot relegated and thats why Pardew's a decent manager regardless of what formation he plays.

 

 

Disagree with most of the bolded tbh.

 

Few (if any?) have suggested HBA as some cure-all. His inclusion is integral to our progression as a team, I would concede that. His defensive work has never been feeble nor does it cause us major problems. What causes us problems is being unable to take the ball out of defence and keep possession (in fact only Jonas can do it, so far). What causes us problems is that by having omitted HBA from the side, we have more readily given the ball back to the opposition, and given them a chance to repeatedly prod, probe and scrutinise a defence you deem to be the worst we've ever had in Premiership history.

 

HBA doesn't need fixing, tbh. His contribution going forwards, and for players around him so far outweighs any defensive foibles he has that that any argument to the contrary isn't really worth entertaining... yet here we are. Pardew has been completely wrong about his use of HBA IMO. His defensive contribution and application is no better now than it was in November - but Pardew is now full of praise for the same performances "his side couldn't afford" earlier in the season. It's horseshit 101. He's just reached desperation point - and that has prompted HBA's latest run.

 

Incidentally, HBA's attitude as a three-quarter player was to play football on the deck and destroy teams (as his quotes from earlier in the season attest to). That seems more befitting of a top four side who hopes to stay there for the long-term, than a team hanging on for dear life 2-0 up at home against an out-of-sorts Everton. Defensive performances and grit have their place in grinding out reults, but to characterise HBA's attitude as the antithesis of what would have kept us in the top four is asinine.

 

I think the squad is capable of doing much better, and I think you've been very, very kind to Pardew saying that this is the most this squad is capable of. Our defensive personnel is weak, but our midfield personnel IMO is among the very best in the Premiership. Given that we have had the power to take initiative of games and protect our defence from scrutiny by controlling the tempo. Instead we've mis-used our midfield personnel to focus the attention of games on our defence - whilst relying on Ba's superhuman form to keep us picking up points.

 

cracking post.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I don't think anyone has said this is all the squad is capable of TBF. What some people have pointed out is that we have players who lack confidence and technique in positions that are supposed to start moves - GK, CB and FB.

 

Obviously it's Pardew's job to address these things like, that's fair enough.

[ponsaelius]

The first half was OK at best, the second half was beyond clueless. It's okay going to games like Arsenal away with a gameplan but frankly we had nothing of the sort. Long ball up to Ba that he is completely incapable of winning followed by an attack for Arsenal where they somehow managed to not score - rince and repeat for the second half. That's not a gameplan, it's a suicide note. No attempt to keep possession or offer anything going forward whatsoever. We came here last year with a weaker team and mugged them a bit for a 1-0 win but when we got the ball in that game we were confident and sensible in possession. It was poles apart from that rubbish yesterday. Fuck sake even Stoke playing away from home have more clue and idea with the ball than we did yesterday.

 

We could have easily lost by 4 goals if they weren't so wasteful infront of goal. Shame we didn't in all honesty then people might start giving Pardew the criticism he deserves.