AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 A bit of looking on the bright side, since that's the point of this thread: We have the most honest, hard working, down-to-earth 'group of lads' that we've had for years. Gone are (most) of the overpaid and useless wasters that dragged the club to the point of financial meltdown. We got relegated, but we bounced back instantly and with great pride. This season is already surpassing expectations, we could be looking at a top 10 finish, which would be an outstanding achievement in our first season back in the top flight. Everything didn't fall apart when Hughton was fired, Pardew has settled in well and is making all the right noises. We're on the back of a solid run of results, which could have been even better had it not been for a couple of late goals. And this is without Andy Carroll, the supposedly-irreplaceable talisman. Danny Simpson is looking the Man Utd academy product he is. Colocinni looks one of the league's best centre backs, and Mike Williamson has slotted in alongside him nicely. Enrique will probably become the best LB in the league, let's hope it's for NUFC. We have two excellent young goalkeepers ready to make the step up, waiting behind one of England's most underrated stoppers of the last 15 years. We have Tiote, a man monster in central midfield, a player who came out of nowhere and transformed our play in a way I can't remember a signing doing for years. On the way back we have Ben Arfa, one of Europe's most talented and creative young attackers. Even Leon Best is showing that he can get goals for us - let's not forget he's only 24. Joey Barton seems to have put his past behind him and has produced some excellent performances this season. We have an extra £35m in the coffers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 A bit of looking on the bright side, since that's the point of this thread: We have the most honest, hard working, down-to-earth 'group of lads' that we've had for years. Gone are (most) of the overpaid and useless wasters that dragged the club to the point of financial meltdown. We got relegated, but we bounced back instantly and with great pride. This season is already surpassing expectations, we could be looking at a top 10 finish, which would be an outstanding achievement in our first season back in the top flight. Everything didn't fall apart when Hughton was fired, Pardew has settled in well and is making all the right noises. We're on the back of a solid run of results, which could have been even better had it not been for a couple of late goals. And this is without Andy Carroll, the supposedly-irreplaceable talisman. Danny Simpson is looking the Man Utd academy product he is. Colocinni looks one of the league's best centre backs, and Mike Williamson has slotted in alongside him nicely. Enrique will probably become the best LB in the league, let's hope it's for NUFC. We have two excellent young goalkeepers ready to make the step up, waiting behind one of England's most underrated stoppers of the last 15 years. We have Tiote, a man monster in central midfield, a player who came out of nowhere and transformed our play in a way I can't remember a signing doing for years. On the way back we have Ben Arfa, one of Europe's most talented and creative young attackers. Even Leon Best is showing that he can get goals for us - let's not forget he's only 24. Joey Barton seems to have put his past behind him and has produced some excellent performances this season. We have an extra £35m in the coffers. I don't think anyone would disagree with any of that. As I've said before, the sheer number of positives at present is what makes the prospect of key players being sold etc so alarming. It's a double-edged sword. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EastEndGeordie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I don't think we've sold too many players, its not like we're getting rid of everybody, only Carroll has left tbh maybe we're all overreacting a bit about the whole thing? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I don't think we've sold too many players, its not like we're getting rid of everybody, only Carroll has left tbh maybe we're all overreacting a bit about the whole thing? Nobody has said we're doomed, have they? Enrique might be off and Barton is stalling over a new contract whilst coming out with comments that are hardly complimentary. Including Carroll that is three key players we could conceivably lose. There's also nothing to suggest Ashley is willing to spend £35m on transfer fees in one window. Again, I can't see why discussing possibilities automatically means people are being overly negative or overreacting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 because half the people aren't "discussing the possibility", they're talking nail in coffin, "he's already gone" bullshit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Three or four equals half. Okay. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Nah, I think you've been fair Dave. It's more the prospect of the players leaving that's scary, and the people posting about it as if it's fact is the annoying thing. Probably because we all know there's no way we can say it won't happen. I would be gutted to lose Enrique (less so Barton) but until it happens I'll try not to worry about it too much. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quayside Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Got to laugh at Everton being used as an example. Kenwright rivals Ashley for lack of ambition, he's a very hated man on the blue side of Liverpool. Kenwright has got no money behind him whatsoever. Never said he had, did I? I was simply questioning how he can show "ambition" with no money, and its also obvious their ability to borrow is limited. They've tried to sell the club but no buyer wants to know because the club isn't going to get anywhere unless they get a new stadium (about £300m I think). And your point about selling Rooney was crap btw Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Got to laugh at Everton being used as an example. Kenwright rivals Ashley for lack of ambition, he's a very hated man on the blue side of Liverpool. Kenwright has got no money behind him whatsoever. Never said he had, did I? I was simply questioning how he can show "ambition" with no money, and its also obvious their ability to borrow is limited. They've tried to sell the club but no buyer wants to know because the club isn't going to get anywhere unless they get a new stadium (about £300m I think). And your point about selling Rooney was crap btw How was it crap? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
quayside Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Got to laugh at Everton being used as an example. Kenwright rivals Ashley for lack of ambition, he's a very hated man on the blue side of Liverpool. Kenwright has got no money behind him whatsoever. Never said he had, did I? I was simply questioning how he can show "ambition" with no money, and its also obvious their ability to borrow is limited. They've tried to sell the club but no buyer wants to know because the club isn't going to get anywhere unless they get a new stadium (about £300m I think). And your point about selling Rooney was crap btw How was it crap? It's all relative. League positions: 2000/2001 16th 2001/2002 15th 2002/2003 7th 2003/2004 17th Sell Rooney 2004/2005 4th 2005/2006 11th 2006/2007 6th 2007/2008 5th 2008/2009 5th 2009/2010 8th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredbob Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Everton sold Wayne Rooney on 31st August 2004. When the January 2005 transfer window opened, they were in 4th position in the table. That January they added James Beattie for £6.5m, Mikel Arteta on loan for £1m and then in February(?) bought Nick Chadwick for £250k. They finished the season in 4th. The following season they finished 11th. Sources: http://www.toffeeweb.com/players/transfers.asp http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2004-2005/table/2004-12-29 http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2004-2005/table http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2005-2006/table Come on Dave, you're better than this. 2009-10 8th 2007-08 5th 2006-07 6th 2005-06 11th 2004-05 4th 2003-04 17th 2002-03 7th 2001-02 15th 2000-01 16th 1999-2000 13th 2004/05 was the season that Rooney was sold, obviously this season is looking crap for them. Obviosuly this doesn't take the management skills of Moyes into account but we dont seem to be interested in what a manager does for the team anyway when it comes how much moolah we spend. My point was that Everton were perfectly capable of finishing 4th that year anyway. They were clear in 4th halfway through the season, before they even had chance to 'strengthen' with the Rooney money. They hardly spent extravagantly in January to ensure that finish either. The year after they actually went backwards, a lot. Rubbish example, IMO. There's just too much detail to this and I dont have the time to give you a respectable reply. What I will say though is that, I dont think Everton were ever in a position to make signings such as Yakubu, Saha, Jagielka, Lescott and Arteta etc had rooney not been sold. The league positions would suggest that they're better off as a club after the sale of Rooney. To me there just seems no way that as a club they could have managed to have kept rooney, built a sqaud capable qualifying for the group stage, qualifying for the group stages AND qualifying for the CL the following year, without significantly gambling the safety of the club. It just doesnt seem feasible. What a frustratingly shit reply. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Got to laugh at Everton being used as an example. Kenwright rivals Ashley for lack of ambition, he's a very hated man on the blue side of Liverpool. Kenwright has got no money behind him whatsoever. Never said he had, did I? I was simply questioning how he can show "ambition" with no money, and its also obvious their ability to borrow is limited. They've tried to sell the club but no buyer wants to know because the club isn't going to get anywhere unless they get a new stadium (about £300m I think). And your point about selling Rooney was crap btw How was it crap? It's all relative. League positions: 2000/2001 16th 2001/2002 15th 2002/2003 7th 2003/2004 17th Sell Rooney 2004/2005 4th 2005/2006 11th 2006/2007 6th 2007/2008 5th 2008/2009 5th 2009/2010 8th It's only relative compared to how they would have done if they hadn't sold Rooney, which is conjecture but I reckon a player of his capability might have made the difference in a two-legged Champions League qualifier - for comparison, they played with James Beattie and Marcus Bent up front instead. I'd say their upturn in form over eight years correlates more with David Moyes getting the job than them getting a load of money they didn't even get the chance to spend before this upturn started. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EastEndGeordie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Nah, I think you've been fair Dave. It's more the prospect of the players leaving that's scary, and the people posting about it as if it's fact is the annoying thing. Probably because we all know there's no way we can say it won't happen. I would be gutted to lose Enrique (less so Barton) but until it happens I'll try not to worry about it too much. TBH a lot of people may not like me saying this but it's just my opinion. The uncertainity around players futures can be attributed to the sacking of Chris Hughton, now I'm not saying that he was better/worse than Pardew that's a different topic altogether. What I am saying is that it was no secret that they players got on very well with him and indeed looked up to him. It was after his sacking IIRC that doubt started to arise around players futures and who could blame them? It's like having a fatherly boss who taught you everything then sacking him for the owners best mate, now this best mate could be a million times better and the friendliest guy ever, but the fact that he replaced the guy you grew attached to, you'll want to leave due to the distrust you have with the owner. The same applies here, the loss of Hughton meant that the players had no-one they attached to and thus no reason to be attached to the club. It doesn't make their attitude right but at the very least it makes it understandable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I see what you're saying, but I really think the biggest factor is the sale of Andy Carroll. After that we went (in some people's view) from being a club that was just restrained in its spending to one that was prepared to let go of its most promising players. The fact that he was a local hero added to the effect of course. That opened the door for the fans to speculate constantly about who will be next to be sold, and for the players to come out and whinge about lack of squad building. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredbob Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Everton sold Wayne Rooney on 31st August 2004. When the January 2005 transfer window opened, they were in 4th position in the table. That January they added James Beattie for £6.5m, Mikel Arteta on loan for £1m and then in February(?) bought Nick Chadwick for £250k. They finished the season in 4th. The following season they finished 11th. Sources: http://www.toffeeweb.com/players/transfers.asp http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2004-2005/table/2004-12-29 http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2004-2005/table http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/premier-league/2005-2006/table Come on Dave, you're better than this. 2009-10 8th 2007-08 5th 2006-07 6th 2005-06 11th 2004-05 4th 2003-04 17th 2002-03 7th 2001-02 15th 2000-01 16th 1999-2000 13th 2004/05 was the season that Rooney was sold, obviously this season is looking crap for them. Obviosuly this doesn't take the management skills of Moyes into account but we dont seem to be interested in what a manager does for the team anyway when it comes how much moolah we spend. My point was that Everton were perfectly capable of finishing 4th that year anyway. They were clear in 4th halfway through the season, before they even had chance to 'strengthen' with the Rooney money. They hardly spent extravagantly in January to ensure that finish either. The year after they actually went backwards, a lot. Rubbish example, IMO. There's just too much detail to this and I dont have the time to give you a respectable reply. What I will say though is that, I dont think Everton were ever in a position to make signings such as Yakubu, Saha, Jagielka, Lescott and Arteta etc had rooney not been sold. The league positions would suggest that they're better off as a club after the sale of Rooney. To me there just seems no way that as a club they could have managed to have kept rooney, built a sqaud capable qualifying for the group stage, qualifying for the group stages AND qualifying for the CL the following year, without significantly gambling the safety of the club. It just doesnt seem feasible. What a frustratingly shit reply. EDIT: I think you need to look at Evertyons squad 2004-2005 to see how much they overacheived and how much they needed to improve in order to compete at any level in the CL. I do remember a club who did gamble all that to qualify for the CL - can't remember the name of the team though or what subsequently happened to them... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest EastEndGeordie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I see what you're saying, but I really think the biggest factor is the sale of Andy Carroll. After that we went (in some people's view) from being a club that was just restrained in its spending to one that was prepared to let go of its most promising players. The fact that he was a local hero added to the effect of course. That opened the door for the fans to speculate constantly about who will be next to be sold, and for the players to come out and whinge about lack of squad building. I should have included my belief that it was a huge combination of the two. I mean getting rid of the two men widely regarded within the team and in and around Newcastle couldn't have been more retarded. Once again not saying that Pardew is any worse, just saying that figureheads are figureheads and as such it's a very bad idea to be getting rid of them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benwell Lad Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 From nufc.com In 13 home games so far this season, SJP attendees have seen a grand total of 49 goals scored (30 for, 19 against). That's entertainment. I think this has been a great season so far on the pitch, generally very positive and entertaining despite the injuries,bad decisions etc. It's hard to remember a season which contained more epic games as well (Villa,mackems,Chelsea,Arsenal h&a, West Ham) andalso good to see a team playing with such pride in the shirt after some of the heartless displays we have endured in the last decade or so. So yes, things look bright, the short term progress over the last 2 years has been excellent, greater stability off the pitch could see this continue onwards. I'm now sure the doom mongers will never see anything positive as they put a negative spin on anything that happens so the club is basically damned if they do and damned if the don't in their eyes, but I think a lot of other "big" clubs would love to be in our present position. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punk77 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 A bit of looking on the bright side, since that's the point of this thread: We have the most honest, hard working, down-to-earth 'group of lads' that we've had for years. Gone are (most) of the overpaid and useless wasters that dragged the club to the point of financial meltdown. We got relegated, but we bounced back instantly and with great pride. This season is already surpassing expectations, we could be looking at a top 10 finish, which would be an outstanding achievement in our first season back in the top flight. Everything didn't fall apart when Hughton was fired, Pardew has settled in well and is making all the right noises. We're on the back of a solid run of results, which could have been even better had it not been for a couple of late goals. And this is without Andy Carroll, the supposedly-irreplaceable talisman. Danny Simpson is looking the Man Utd academy product he is. Colocinni looks one of the league's best centre backs, and Mike Williamson has slotted in alongside him nicely. Enrique will probably become the best LB in the league, let's hope it's for NUFC. We have two excellent young goalkeepers ready to make the step up, waiting behind one of England's most underrated stoppers of the last 15 years. We have Tiote, a man monster in central midfield, a player who came out of nowhere and transformed our play in a way I can't remember a signing doing for years. On the way back we have Ben Arfa, one of Europe's most talented and creative young attackers. Even Leon Best is showing that he can get goals for us - let's not forget he's only 24. Joey Barton seems to have put his past behind him and has produced some excellent performances this season. We have an extra £35m in the coffers. I don't think anyone would disagree with any of that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fenham Mag Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Feeling very positive of our future at the moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Feeling very positive of our future at the moment. Apart from the Enrique situation, me too. Isn't it normally at around this point something happens to get us all riled up again? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JH Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Feeling very positive of our future at the moment. Apart from the Enrique situation, me too. Isn't it normally at around this point something happens to get us all riled up again? Yup. No doubt someone will be sold or sacked or Barton will punch something Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 meh- best talent will be sold, team spirit will be lessend next season. we will struggle. hope to fuck im wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 meh- best talent will be sold, team spirit will be lessend next season. we will struggle. hope to fuck im wrong. We all do. I just have absolutely no idea what next season will bring, we could progress, but just as likely a few bollocks dropped in the transfer market and we could tumble down the leagues again. It would be bloody miracle the way things have been going for a fair few years now, to just get the whole way through without a change of manager. I think just that bit of stability would be a plus for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cp40 Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 meh- best talent will be sold, team spirit will be lessend next season. we will struggle. hope to fuck im wrong. We all do. I just have absolutely no idea what next season will bring, we could progress, but just as likely a few bollocks dropped in the transfer market and we could tumble down the leagues again. It would be bloody miracle the way things have been going for a fair few years now, to just get the whole way through without a change of manager. I think just that bit of stability would be a plus for me. when was the last time we started and finnished a season in the prem with the same manager? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BottledDog Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 meh- best talent will be sold, team spirit will be lessend next season. we will struggle. hope to fuck im wrong. We all do. I just have absolutely no idea what next season will bring, we could progress, but just as likely a few bollocks dropped in the transfer market and we could tumble down the leagues again. It would be bloody miracle the way things have been going for a fair few years now, to just get the whole way through without a change of manager. I think just that bit of stability would be a plus for me. when was the last time we started and finnished a season in the prem with the same manager? Robson possibly? Was pretty stunned when someone brought it up a few weeks back. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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