Tooj Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi has played better in this World Cup than Ronaldinho ever has in anyone he played in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Scholes > Messi. Messi (the poster) > Froggy Aye, take THAT! Seriously ask all the players, they'll say Scholes too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I thought the whole leadership thing was quite well put by a journalist who said that in terms of charisma, comparing Maradona and Messi is like comparing Hendrix and Kraftwerk. Nolan was a very good leader but a poor midfielder imo Cabaye was a very good midfielder but a poor leader imo I'd go as far to say that the gap in football ability between Messi and Zidane is great enough to negate the need for the supposed need for a vocal player. If Cabaye was a poor leader what the fuck is Coloccini? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Scholes > Messi. Messi (the poster) > Froggy Aye, take THAT! Seriously ask all the players, they'll say Scholes too. I'll ask Paul Scholes, he'd fucking laugh in my face. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi has played better in this World Cup than Ronaldinho ever has in anyone he played in. ?? get lost. Ronaldinho was an integral part to a winning side in 2002. He single handedly turned a game around in the quarters and as a relatively young guy stepped up when needed the most. Messi is the best player in the world, but not once did I watch Messi in the World Cup and think of him as the best in the world. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi has played better in this World Cup than Ronaldinho ever has in anyone he played in. ?? get lost. Ronaldinho was an integral part to a winning side in 2002. He single handedly turned a game around in the quarters and as a relatively young guy stepped up when needed the most. Messi is the best player in the world, but not once did I watch Messi in the World Cup and think of him as the best in the world. 7-1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 He dragged a poor Argentina team through the group stages completely on his own, and even though he looked lethargic in the knockout stages still produced a moment of magic to set up Di Maria against the Swiss. He was man of the match and praised for his performace against Belgium in the QF. His only poor performance was against the Dutch. Had he scored a chance that he usually would 9 times out of 10 or Higuain and Palacios didn't miss sitters we'd talking about him being a World Champion. One kick of a ball away, that's how thin the line is, it just didn't go his way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I thought the whole leadership thing was quite well put by a journalist who said that in terms of charisma, comparing Maradona and Messi is like comparing Hendrix and Kraftwerk. Nolan was a very good leader but a poor midfielder imo Cabaye was a very good midfielder but a poor leader imo I'd go as far to say that the gap in football ability between Messi and Zidane is great enough to negate the need for the supposed need for a vocal player. If Cabaye was a poor leader what the f*** is Coloccini? An absolutely fucking atrocious one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Scholes > Messi. Messi (the poster) > Froggy Aye, take THAT! Seriously ask all the players, they'll say Scholes too. Give Scholdiers the World Cup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 He dragged a poor Argentina team through the group stages completely on his own, and even though he looked lethargic in the knockout stages still produced a moment of magic to set up Di Maria against the Swiss. He was man of the match and praised for his performace against Belgium in the QF. His only poor performance was against the Dutch. Had he scored a chance that he usually would 9 times out of 10 or Higuain and Palacios didn't miss sitters we'd talking about him being a World Champion. One kick of a ball away, that's how thin the line is, it just didn't go his way. A poor Argentina team Change your name back to Pissi ffs. Anyone who has seen Messi play knows that his best World Cup to date was the 2010 and that WC performance was comparable to James Rodriguez this year. They both went as far as they could with their team. But to tell it straight to my face that he was one kick away from winning the World Cup is ridiculous as if Iran scores against them they might not even have won their group or advanced. It's not as easy as that Pissi. Messi had a good World Cup, but there are 10 players who had a better one in my opinion. I'm not saying this because I'm taking the piss, I'm being honest. Messi was decisive, but his general play was quite poor. There's a reason to why a guy who is 'impossible' to take the ball away from, lost the second most balls in this World Cup. He lost in average 7 balls per game, which let's be honest is quite a lot. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 2010 was a good World Cup for Messi? Even when you pick a time that you think he's been good you're wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 2010 was a good World Cup for Messi? Even when you pick a time that you think he's been good you're wrong. Individually it was his best World Cup, most definitely. He created far more in 5 games than he did in 7 games in this one. I'm not even going to have this discussion anymore. It's quite clear you're making points based on statistics and not performances Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 As I remember it, most of the big players had pretty shit World Cups in 2010, but I would have this as his best, which was a bit disappointing again, but better than 2010. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Excluding Messi; Romero, Rojo, Mascherano and Lavezzi (who was inexplicably taken off every time) were the only players to walk away with respect. No one is saying Messi was the best player of the tournament, so don't know why you are bringing that up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi's individual performances during the WC were average and not the stamp of the greatest player ever or even the greatest today. That said, it tells you how good he is when 4 goals, some assists and a final appearance are deemed not quite good enough. By the way, all I wanted from him was to turn up against Germany and run the show. He could have done that and won the Final with zero goals to his name and he would have cemented his place, but he just didn't turn up and his performance was actually embarrassing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Snrub Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 2010 was a good World Cup for Messi? Even when you pick a time that you think he's been good you're wrong. Individually it was his best World Cup, most definitely. He created far more in 5 games than he did in 7 games in this one. I'm not even going to have this discussion anymore. It's quite clear you're making points based on statistics and not performances 2010 he was Argentina'a best player, 2014 Javier Mascherano was. But Messi still managed to produce more this WC than last. They wouldn't even have got out of the group stages without him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Howaythetoon Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Mascherano is obviously a good player, but I don't buy the great tournament line or that he is indeed great. He was quite poor in the final, he gave away so many sloppy balls it was unreal. He's another who has benefited more than most from the Barca system/style. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I think the Mascherano thing is a lot to do with the whole leadership quality that you were talking about before. He was colossal in that match against Holland and even though he was sloppy in the final, he didn't shirk responsibility. Defensively as a midfielder I can't think of anyone better tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest n4e Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi bailed out an Argentinian team filled with excellent players who mostly underpefromed a few times with pieces of individual brilliance. But he simply just couldn't impose himself enough and lift and bring out the best of his team mates in a way that Zidane done for France in those big games. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggs Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I think Messi just doesn't have the stamina to be as involved in games anymore. He got sick on the pitch again Sunday and until he gets that sorted out he won't be at his best. Despite this, when he did get the ball Sunday he generally did something really good with it, he just didn't get the ball enough Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I think Messi just doesn't have the stamina to be as involved in games anymore. He got sick on the pitch again Sunday and until he gets that sorted out he won't be at his best. Despite this, when he did get the ball Sunday he generally did something really good with it, he just didn't get the ball enough I think it's clear he needs a break. He is either carrying an injury that won't clear without an op, like a hernia type ailment, or he's just jaded. He hasn't looked himself for a while imho. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I'd like to see him leave Barca and go to Bayern or something tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
timeEd32 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I know, stats are bad, but here ya go. http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/was-lionel-messi-tired/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Messi bailed out an Argentinian team filled with excellent players who mostly underpefromed a few times with pieces of individual brilliance. But he simply just couldn't impose himself enough and lift and bring out the best of his team mates in a way that Zidane done for France in those big games. That's why I don't regard him as the best player ever. On par with Cruyff and Zidane, but not a level above. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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