Cajun Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Lots of clubs are associated with 'shitty' brands, not sure it affects their potential. Surely Sports Direct must be the biggest sports company in the country at the moment? On the payday loans thing I can't see how they can be criticised, if you are in a position where you HAVE to use them then surely it is better they are there and charging what they do than them not being there at all? "Surely if you're starving and someone offers you a meal for your left arm it's best to take that meal." In the short term, possibly, and only especially if the situation was of your own creation. That might be up for debate though. They are predatory and can absolutely ruin people. The practice has been banned in a lot of places. But in the long term, if people have to flock to services like that, if they stay popular, if circumstances of the economy/law drive them into it (e.g. situations not of their own making), then I think it says a lot about the failings of the safety net of a society that businesses like that are allowed to flourish. If people couldn't take loans like this what would they do instead? Fair play on what Mick posted though, that sounds very, very wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomas Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Lots of clubs are associated with 'shitty' brands, not sure it affects their potential. Surely Sports Direct must be the biggest sports company in the country at the moment? On the payday loans thing I can't see how they can be criticised, if you are in a position where you HAVE to use them then surely it is better they are there and charging what they do than them not being there at all? "Surely if you're starving and someone offers you a meal for your left arm it's best to take that meal." In the short term, possibly, and only especially if the situation was of your own creation. That might be up for debate though. They are predatory and can absolutely ruin people. The practice has been banned in a lot of places. But in the long term, if people have to flock to services like that, if they stay popular, if circumstances of the economy/law drive them into it (e.g. situations not of their own making), then I think it says a lot about the failings of the safety net of a society that businesses like that are allowed to flourish. If people couldn't take loans like this what would they do instead? Probably whatever people in dire straits did before payday loan cunts existed? Tough it out? Seek help from friends and family, charity or church or government? There's too many people who use it for too many different purposes for me to give a universal answer to your question. edit because I'm fuming at the idea of usury at the moment: To me though it's the exact same as the mediums and psychics who go up to the still mourning and tell them they can speak with their dead husband/nan/child for a price. It's preying on someone who is not a rational actor and not in a correct frame of mind. And they may not even understand all of what they're getting into. And before you pop the "well they shouldn't sign the contract if they don't know what it says" gem I can tell you where to put that Unless you'd also like to subsidize a course in contract law for everyone (although let's be honest not everyone would pass it, what then?) so that they could understand the 20 pages of forms they have to sign? Fees and terms can be glossed over, ommitted or even lied about and it's really fucking shitty to take advantage of people like that and then hide behind "oh well, should have read it better :iamatwat:" I certainly don't understand 100% of all contracts I've ever signed and think there are few that have. There's a reason laws are in place to protect against exploitative clauses because otherwise society would devolve in an instant to "whoever writes the best contract wins." There's a reason things like "good faith" exist etc. edit 2: apologies to any payday loan cunts reading this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I have only seen their shit adverts but I can read the '20,000,000,000,000 APR' thing at the bottom. I think it's a bit far excusing people the blame of taking these loans, as you say there were ways before these companies were around. Just struggle to believe anyone would HAVE to use this company. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 It seems like the majority of people using Wonga are people who have lost jobs and are finding it hard to adjust to a different lifestyle. Some people have lost jobs, others have come down with an illness and aren’t getting paid and still have bills to pay. I would hate to think what I would do if I lost my job and had to go from earning good money to living off the state. How do you keep a car going on the dole? I would find it hard to get a job if I had to rely on public transport. Can you cancel mobile phone contracts and things like sky subscriptions if you lose your job and have a contract? I don't know the answer but I bet it's easier getting a loan off a shitty legal loan shark than getting out of a contract that was taken out with the expectation that you could easily meet your obligations only to find things have gone tits up. I know nothing of Wonga before they were linked to us other than cringe worthy adverts. I've spent some time (not much) looking at what they do and it's disgusting that they're allowed to operate the way they do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 I have only seen their s*** adverts but I can read the '20,000,000,000,000 APR' thing at the bottom. I think it's a bit far excusing people the blame of taking these loans, as you say there were ways before these companies were around. Just struggle to believe anyone would HAVE to use this company. They don't have to use the company, it looks like it's the easy option for some people who jump without fully understanding what they are getting into. They are giving out loans to people who can't always pay them back and when people can't afford to pay them back they threaten them with debt collection agancies but don't refer them to anybody until they've reached a legal limit of £1000. So they hang on to small debt and keep throwing interest at the loans so they go from tens of £'s to a £thousand and it's all legal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Again I have to ask what if they weren't there? There doesn't seem to be a realistic workaround, I suppose if you have these luxuries then you make sure you have sufficient savings to sustain them if the worst happens? I struggle to accept the 'well I have all this nice, expensive stuff now, what if I lost my job' like you should be entitled to them? That probably sounds harsh but it is honestly how I view these things. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Again I have to ask what if they weren't there? There doesn't seem to be a realistic workaround, I suppose if you have these luxuries then you make sure you have sufficient savings to sustain them if the worst happens? I struggle to accept the 'well I have all this nice, expensive stuff now, what if I lost my job' like you should be entitled to them? That probably sounds harsh but it is honestly how I view these things. Another one: Hi, I had a loan from wonga and got in the same situation as many, paid back then had to re borrow as it kept on leaving me short. Had a problem this month and did not have enough in bank to repay them. I only realised it yesterday so never had time to contact them. I am dissabled so my benefits are paid straight in to my bank account. Got a shock today, went ot check my bank account to find it EMPTY and in the red. Wonga had got there first thing and taken all of my money, even gone up to my overdraft limit. I also had email from them telling me that they are going to try to take the remaining £95 plus interest plus fee's on 1st Feb. They have left me with NO money for the next month!!! What do I do, I am pulling my hair out with worry. I can not get any more money until the end of next month. Are they going to just go and take it all from me again then. HELP!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 So they borrowed money on set terms, couldn't afford to pay it back and are now moaning about it? Apologies if I have read that wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Again I have to ask what if they weren't there? There doesn't seem to be a realistic workaround, I suppose if you have these luxuries then you make sure you have sufficient savings to sustain them if the worst happens? I struggle to accept the 'well I have all this nice, expensive stuff now, what if I lost my job' like you should be entitled to them? That probably sounds harsh but it is honestly how I view these things. That's easy to say when you only have your own mouth to feed. I've always been on good money, had plenty of disposable income and haven't lost a job but I could imagine others not being so lucky. I would hate to think what it must have been like for people who were less fortunate and unable to save anything because they weren’t well paid and had kids to bring up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 So they borrowed money on set terms, couldn't afford to pay it back and are now moaning about it? Apologies if I have read that wrong. That's how I read it too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorJ_01 Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 So they borrowed money on set terms, couldn't afford to pay it back and are now moaning about it? Apologies if I have read that wrong. That's how I read it too. Me too The old disabled story will pull at the heartstrings though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 So they borrowed money on set terms, couldn't afford to pay it back and are now moaning about it? Apologies if I have read that wrong. It's not even legal loaning to people who are classed as vulnerable yet they do it. The person taking the loan acted daft, the company acted illegally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Again I have to ask what if they weren't there? There doesn't seem to be a realistic workaround, I suppose if you have these luxuries then you make sure you have sufficient savings to sustain them if the worst happens? I struggle to accept the 'well I have all this nice, expensive stuff now, what if I lost my job' like you should be entitled to them? That probably sounds harsh but it is honestly how I view these things. That's easy to say when you only have your own mouth to feed. I've always been on good money, had plenty of disposable income and haven't lost a job but I could imagine others not being so lucky. I would hate to think what it must have been like for people who were less fortunate and unable to save anything because they weren’t well paid and had kids to bring up. Again I probably sound harsh but if you can't afford something you shouldn't be committing to it. In my experience those 'struggling' are still able to afford things they don't really need. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 FFS why are we debating the ethics of Wonga. The important thing is, it's a stupid fucking name and ugly-ass logo to have on our kits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 So they borrowed money on set terms, couldn't afford to pay it back and are now moaning about it? Apologies if I have read that wrong. It's not even legal loaning to people who are classed as vulnerable yet they do it. The person taking the loan acted daft, the company acted illegally. If they acted illegally I am sure the victim was duly compensated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 If they acted illegally I am sure the victim was duly compensated. I'm sure knowing that made them feel so much better while they had nothing to live off until our speedy legal system came to the rescue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
maybe_next_year Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Loan danger: Fury as Newcastle prepare to sign "financial predators" as sponsors by Which one of you is Simon Bird? Local MP Ian Lavery has pledged to send his season tickets back if, as expected, the sponsorship deal goes through imminently. Lavery, Labour MP for Wansbeck, has vowed to return his two platinum club tickets and break off all ties with the club. http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/newcastles-wonga-shirt-sponsors-spark-1367970 labour MP with a pair of platinum tickets. what a cunt he sounds, complaining about this deal. aye, spending his wage on something he likes, what a cunt Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I used them once a few years ago to pay for a weekly bus pass. Lent £30 for a week, paid something daft like £36 back a week later. Never had to use them again. If you use them correctly they do a job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest NobbyOhNobby Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 It's distasteful but in the long list of Ashley f*** ups, it's barely in the top ten. Talk of handing back season tickets is just melodramatic attention seeking. Couldn't disagree with you more, and your comment is unbelievably condescending. I'm furious about the prospect of Wonga being our potential sponsors - I didn't know I'd react like this, but reading the suggestion of their sponsorship provoked more anger than any other Ashley decision. To quote the earlier article, it's the straw that broke the camel's back for me. Just like everybody else I've put up with all of the other shite, but associating our club with such a company is a step too far for me, and is seriously making me think about whether I want to give £600/year to a club that associates itself willingly with such fundamentally disgraceful corporate partners. I am honestly dismayed at the thought of nufc buying players using Wonga's money, it just feels unbelievably wrong. We'll be funded by desperation, essentially, and it doesn't sit comfortably with me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ7 Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Our commercial revenue is shocking compared to similar sized clubs. We arent a brand companies want to be associated with. That is Ashleys fault. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Our commercial revenue is shocking compared to similar sized clubs. We arent a brand companies want to be associated with. That is Ashleys fault. True. My main gripes with any Wonga deal is that it is bringing in comparative peanuts and also sounds too close to "wanker". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedudeabides Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 If people want to get all ethical about it and what they do, alcohol has blighted the lives of literally millions of more people than Wonga ever has/will, and we were proud to have the Blue Star on our shirt. Same goes for any team sponsored by a betting company. Not that I want Wonga, but just saying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BooBoo Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Good point. Any peddler of alcohol is indirectly responsible for a whole host of physical, mental and social issues that will dwarf anything that this mob do. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobby_solano Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 if you squint really hard... http://imageshack.us/a/img547/3167/wonga.jpg ...it'd still look shit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam1 Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 George Caulkin @CaulkinTheTimes #NUFC shirt deal with Wonga promote concern from fans & MPs http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/sport/football/premierleague/article3562442.ece#.UHPLZDPvFhM.twitter … (£) ((and, yes, I appreciate the irony of the £ sign)) Expand 29m Adam Wardle Adam Wardle @AdamWardle @CaulkinTheTimes So is it official now then? Expand 26m George Caulkin George Caulkin @CaulkinTheTimes @AdamWardle imminently. Expand 24m Adam Wardle Adam Wardle @AdamWardle @CaulkinTheTimes Shite. There's me thinking it was going to be a blue-chip company or an international airline.. Expand 21m George Caulkin George Caulkin @CaulkinTheTimes @AdamWardle afraid not - nothing to do with stadium name though. Expand Caulkin sounds sure its definitely Wonga Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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