Pancrate1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 I can't remember the media upset about Callum Wilsons goal against Brentford that would have sewn up a 1-3 win but we had to hold on for 1-2 that season. That didn't even go directly in, it bounced off the bicep area then he put it in Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 2 minutes ago, Pancrate1892 said: Aye, small margins, but if it was our goal disallowed they'd say 'correct decision', just like the small margins of schars headbutt where his head travelled 1cm like a bruce lee punch. If it hits the deltoid, then it's a goal, but clearly hits below that on the bicep which is not a goal. It's harsh but when all we heard last week was the 'letter of the law' then the uproar on this is basically hypocrisy Especially as the replays showed it was Brereton Diaz who initiates the "headbutt". We were told constantly that it has to be a red for Schar. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pancrate1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 1 minute ago, Skeletor said: Especially as the replays showed it was Brereton Diaz who initiates the "headbutt". We were told constantly that it has to be a red for Schar. I know. It's like that specific replay didn't exist and wasn't available to VAR Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 28 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: I don’t see it that way and I haven’t seen a still photo pinpointing the exact part of his arm that it hits which makes it a handball. It could have come off anywhere from the top of the shoulder to mid bicep. However, it isn’t conclusive which part it did hit. The red line is clearly way below his armpit, not sure how that isn't conclusive to some Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 10 minutes ago, Geordie Ahmed said: The red line is clearly way below his armpit, not sure how that isn't conclusive to some The ball doesn’t make contact with the player where the red line is though. A ball is spherical, not flat, so any line drawn should be through the centre of the ball and not the edge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 3 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: The ball doesn’t make contact with the player where the red line is though. A ball is spherical, not flat, so any line drawn should be through the centre of the ball and not the edge. Even if you move the line further up it's still below his armpit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Just now, Geordie Ahmed said: Even if you move the line further up it's still below his armpit It clearly isn’t, which is why you drew it at the bottom to try and add weight to your point. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordie_b Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: The ball doesn’t make contact with the player where the red line is though. A ball is spherical, not flat, so any line drawn should be through the centre of the ball and not the edge. So this only hit the tip of Obriens nose ? Edited August 26 by geordie_b Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 1 minute ago, Matt1892 said: It clearly isn’t, which is why you drew it at the bottom to try and add weight to your point. I didn't draw it but can ask the person that did to move it further up if it helps? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 1 minute ago, geordie_b said: So this only hit the tip of Obriens nose ? Clearly it doesn’t hit his arm with that much power or force. No point in having a dogawful officiating thread if people cannot put their own bias to the side when judging an incident. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geordie_b Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Just now, Matt1892 said: Clearly it doesn’t hit his arm with that much power or force. No point in having a dogawful officiating thread if people cannot put their own bias to the side when judging an incident. You might want to look into ball compression when hitting different surfaces. For the ball to bounce off him almost the entire perimeter of the ball will have made contact with him Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theregulars Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 It’s our side of borderline, if that makes sense. I think the benefit of the doubt just tilts in our favour (which is why I’m surprised he ruled it out, I didn’t think there was enough in it to change). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 4 minutes ago, Geordie Ahmed said: I didn't draw it but can ask the person that did to move it further up if it helps? There you go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Just now, Theregulars said: It’s our side of borderline, if that makes sense. I think the benefit of the doubt just tilts in our favour (which is why I’m surprised he ruled it out, I didn’t think there was enough in it to change). VAR should not be ruling goals out on benefit of the doubt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 1 minute ago, Matt1892 said: There you go. Whilst I accept the red line is on the edge there's not a chance I'm accepting only that blue line is where contact was made, it's a ball not a toblerone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt1892 Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 (edited) Just now, Geordie Ahmed said: Whilst I accept the red line is on the edge there's not a chance I'm accepting only that blue line is where contact was made, it's a ball not a toblerone Show me definitively where the ball made contact with the player then. Again, VAR is for clear and obvious errors. Edited August 26 by Matt1892 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theregulars Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Just now, Matt1892 said: VAR should not be ruling goals out on benefit of the doubt. I sort of agree but there are too many debatable calls in football to be that absolutist about it. The way it’s been deployed hasn’t helped: it should either clearly be based on a pure technical application of the rules (in which case the decision was rightly in our favour), or referee’s interpretation with the benefit of different angles and slower time (which may not have gone in our favour). I don’t think it’s a travesty of a decision or a naked injustice. It’s tough luck and a bitter pill but the decision is logical and justifiable for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingArthur Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 40 minutes ago, Matt1892 said: Show me definitively where the ball made contact with the player then. Again, VAR is for clear and obvious errors. 99,9% certainty that the ball hit his bicep there. And even a small contact with the arm means no goal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abacus Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Peter Walton thinks it was a red for Joelinton. But he also thinks it's a good thing he wasn't sent off, since it was a subjective decision where VAR were right not to intervene. So, well done refs. Also thinks the goal should have stood as he couldn't see clear evidence that the ball hit his arm and VAR should only intervene in this case if it was a factual decision. But, however, that if VAR did think it's a handball, then it has to intervene and rule out the goal. Well done refs again. Hope that's cleared everything up. That's former PL ref Peter Walton folks. Confusing subjectivity with facts and finding ways to agree with referees even when he thinks they're wrong because he often was himself, since 2003. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 The real issue here is that there's only one camera angle available for VAR to use, yet in other games there would have been several different angles. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsunami Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Pretty sure Dermott Gallagher said on ref watch that it was like was the ball over the line. If the circumference is included it’s handball and the laws of physics suggest the ball would have compressed sufficiently for it to have hit the arm. Gallagher then says he’d have allowed the goal, wtf? Also seen stay with the on-field decision. The ref is completely unsighted and VAR is there to make a factual decision. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingArthur Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 43 minutes ago, OCK said: The real issue here is that there's only one camera angle available for VAR to use, yet in other games there would have been several different angles. Are there? Most likely there were number of angles but we only saw 1 in the broadcast. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cf Posted August 26 Share Posted August 26 Ask the ref where it hit and the answer would be "his head I assume". Not sure why on field decision would be given any weight. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
huss9 Posted August 31 Share Posted August 31 Declan Rice shouldnt have been sent off (glad he was though). The brighton lad should have seen Red for his kick at him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JigsawGoesToPieces Posted August 31 Share Posted August 31 2 hours ago, huss9 said: Declan Rice shouldnt have been sent off (glad he was though). The brighton lad should have seen Red for his kick at him. Watching it again on MOTD (did see it live at the time), think Rice knew what he was doing tapping the ball away trying to be cute and the Brighton player went to take a quick FK so for me its a yellow for Rice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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