Yorkie Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 He also went on a brilliant run of form after Pardew left which kept WHU up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ujpest doza Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 The issue is about managing flair players like Tevez and HBA, who people like SBR and Keegan would have loved and nurtured much like they did with other "self self self" players such as Robert, Bellamy, Ginola, etc. I'm not defending Tevez here, but highlighting an issue that seems to have been repeated at our club. I seem to recall Robert being dropped by SBR and replaced in some games by Hugo Vianna and/or Olivier Bernard without much complaint from the fans either. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_NUFC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 are you simply choosing not to see any wrong being done here by Pardew? So there is nothing in his track record that suggests he has an issue with flair players? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 He also went on a brilliant run of form after Pardew left which kept WHU up. West Ham would have gone down under Pardew, probably with Tevez and Mascherano on the bench. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ujpest doza Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 are you simply choosing not to see any wrong being done here by Pardew? So there is nothing in his track record that suggests he has an issue with flair players? Nope. He's a massive gobshite who loves his little self but I think people have rose tinted specs when it comes to how they think other managers we've had would manage HBA or how they managed other "flair" players we've had in the past. It certainly wasn't all plain sailing for "flair" players under both SBR or KK as both of them expected a fair bit graft as well as guile. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ_NUFC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Agree in some ways with you. However. Just finishing up my morning dump, so will be back later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ujpest doza Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. He seemed to manage Cabaye ok and he seemed to manage to bring HBA on gently to good effect in 2011/12. That isn't my issue though. My issue is people looking back at SBR and KK's teams with rose tinted specs and forgetting that they too had good times and bad times with certain players who have been compared to HBA. Robert quite often got dogs abuse from the stands and in the press and then won people over by scoring a worldy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Pardew seems unwilling to recognise the good Ben Arfa does. It's the sort of my way or the highway bollocks you got from Souness. Pardew should persist with him in the team and work on improving him, rather than taking him out of the team until there is an improvement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBG Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Jonas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 It's weird that him and Tevez never hit it off tbh. considering how hard working he is. I/m not sure if that was much to do with Tevez being a flair player, and more to do with Pardew just being thick as fucking mince. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 "I had to sacrifice myself for the team which I don't think helped. I was playing in ways I did not understand well and I lost a lot from my own game." The degenerating of player's games, well I never ... currently happening to every one in our team even still. "I don't think he had a clear idea about my game or what to do. He was good football man but more suited to coaching English teams without foreign players with big reputations. "I think that was a bit of a problem for him." To quote the great man himself ... "we need more English". Go coach in the lower leagues then, or learn to adapt to the reality of most teams in the premier league. "It was strange not to have Javier playing. Especially as the team were struggling and losing. He is a very good player, doing well in training and he just wanted to play." Doing well in training, and still not being played, I bet this could easily apply to a number of our players. Ben Arfa and Marv for one. No doubt this was also Anita's lot for a while too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Remy has a lot of flair in his game, picks the ball up and likes to beat a man and get his shots away which can bring the fans to life whenever he's on the ball. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ujpest doza Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Give over, course he is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 I wouldn't consider Remy a flair player. Very athletic, yes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. He seemed to manage Cabaye ok and he seemed to manage to bring HBA on gently to good effect in 2011/12. That isn't my issue though. My issue is people looking back at SBR and KK's teams with rose tinted specs and forgetting that they too had good times and bad times with certain players who have been compared to HBA. Robert quite often got dogs abuse from the stands and in the press and then won people over by scoring a worldy. Robert got a lot of abuse from thick fans and TV pundits. But he got support from the man who counted, and that was Bobby Robson who didn't give a flying fuck what Trevor Brooking or some dope of a fan thought. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Interpolic Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Give over, course he is. Well he's a player with flair who is a piece of piss to manage. He even looked handy in that God-awful QPR team last year, in his first half-season in the best league he's ever played in. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Give over, course he is. Well he's a player with flair who is a piece of p*ss to manage. He even looked handy in that God-awful QPR team last year, in his first half-season in the best league he's ever played in. Well the question wasn't 'name me one flair player who is difficult to manage but Pardew has managed him well?' You got an answer to your question then twist it around and say he's piss easy to manage so that don't count Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Name me one flair player that he's managed well, which includes putting them in the team now and then. Remy? Hardly a flair player tbh. Give over, course he is. Well he's a player with flair who is a piece of p*ss to manage. He even looked handy in that God-awful QPR team last year, in his first half-season in the best league he's ever played in. Well the question wasn't 'name me one flair player who is difficult to manage but Pardew has managed him well?' You got an answer to your question then twist it around and say he's p*ss easy to manage so that don't count Remy's got as much 'flair' as Gouf. It's just that Remy has got a little bit more in every dept. over Gouf except perhaps out and out workrate. Sammy's got more flair than Remy. Just lacking all the other things Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 I don't see Remy as a flair player either tbh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 IMO He's a striker, put up front and told to score goals. Obviously he needs nowt more than that to be able to consistently score. I'm sure pretty much every position on the pitch needs a greater level of tactical coaching to be able to perform well in a team. I'm not saying Pards should get no credit on this one, as ultimately he's got to keep all these twats happy to get them playing well. But that's a complete different kettle of fish to being able to actually give them some tactical instruction beyond "work hard, defend, hope for a goal on the counter", which is obviously what is needed if we want our midfield to look like they can create anything without just giving the ball to HBA in our own box and telling him to take it 70 yards up the pitch. Fuck knows if I'm on topic here or not, but I just kept on typing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussiemag Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Remy has an abundance of flair for a striker, he can beat a man one on one and is capable of making that inch of space to get a shot away, through skill and technique. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted March 28, 2014 Share Posted March 28, 2014 Remy isn't a flair player like, he's not a Suarez or a coutinho type, he's very athletic and makes very good runs and can finish from a variety of positions. But not a flair player for me Remy has an abundance of flair for a striker, he can beat a man one on one and is capable of making that inch of space to get a shot away, through skill and technique. For me having flair isn't all about being able to beat a man one on one. Sissoko can do all of that, but he's not considered a flair player is he? Remy is a formidable striker, but he's not a flair player. ÍMO at least. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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