Douglas

[healthyaddiction]

Well, we were VERY solid defensively the season before last, especially in the first half of that season, so it's incorrect to suggest Pardew doesn't know how to set up a team to defend effectively. I feel we have suffered from a lack of stability in personnel, especially in defense where understanding and confidence in each other is crucial. I said so at the time (first half of this season) and pointed out in the first 10-15 matches we always had at least one, and often multiple changes in our back 5. Also, the quality of player coming in meant quite a drop in ability. Hopefully with more able defenders at our disposal (Mbiwa, Debuchy, Haidara and possibly Douglas/A.N.Other) and less games to play next season we can get off to a good start next season and build our confidence up again. Having a focused and committed Colo available to lead the defense is massive as well. All in all I'm pretty confident that we can do better defensively than last season. Now for being more effective going forward...

 

Mostly we looked good but we still had too many games where we got a good thrashing.

[Tiresias]

Pace in behind seemed to cause the threashings, we were very solid mostly then had awful games.

 

Mbiwa seems to me a good solution once he's acclimatized, got the speed we've been missing at the back. The other problem is fullbacks not being brilliant defensively, this i suspect will persist, albeit I still have hopes for Santon improving.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Pace in behind seemed to cause the threashings, we were very solid mostly then had awful games.

 

Mbiwa seems to me a good solution once he's acclimatized, got the speed we've been missing at the back. The other problem is fullbacks not being brilliant defensively, this i suspect will persist, albeit I still have hopes for Santon improving.

 

Santon and Debuchy will both improve defensively I reckon, although they'll always bomb forward.

[Guest bimpy474]

First half of the season before last we were (amongst the) team(s) that conceeded the least goals in the league. Did we only play at home?

 

Have we even looked like recreating that kind of form, since the first dozen games of which you mention, it's been terrible and i tend to form my view over the nearly two season since rather than just those twelve or so games.

[Mole_Toonfan]

I don't mind Pardew going for a big CB and CF as long as they are good 

 

I do feel we need someone like Douglas and someone like Carroll, irrelevant of Pardew.

[Unbelievable]

First half of the season before last we were (amongst the) team(s) that conceeded the least goals in the league. Did we only play at home?

 

Have we even looked like recreating that kind of form, since the first dozen games of which you mention, it's been terrible and i tend to form my view over the nearly two season since rather than just those twelve or so games.

If you want to discard half a season proof that we can be solid defensively (could say full season), why do people base their opinion on how we could be much better going forward on a period stretching 6 matches in the same season? Both things happened, and both things are true: we can be better defensively AND going forward.

[Tooj]

You need to defend from the front IMO and that's something that we've never done under Pardew. He makes us sit back and contain pressure instead of using an effective pressing game.

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

Three top CB's has been something we have really lacked for a long time, not saying this should be how we setup for every game but would be nice to have the possibility if needed.

 

------------------Krul

 

---------MYM----Colo---Doug

Debuch------------------------Santon

---------Sisso------------Tiote

------------------Cabs

-------Benny-------------Cisse

 

Skirge hates a back 4

[Guest bimpy474]

First half of the season before last we were (amongst the) team(s) that conceeded the least goals in the league. Did we only play at home?

 

Have we even looked like recreating that kind of form, since the first dozen games of which you mention, it's been terrible and i tend to form my view over the nearly two season since rather than just those twelve or so games.

If you want to discard half a season proof that we can be solid defensively (could say full season), why do people base their opinion on how we could be much better going forward on a period stretching 6 matches in the same season? Both things happened, and both things are true: we can be better defensively AND going forward.

 

It wasn't half a season, we conceded 51 goals in that season. 34 of them away. Like i said, under him we have been terrible for concededing goals especially away. Pick a few games out of that lot if you like. It doesn't change the overall pattern, under him our away record for the last two seasons is played 38, won 10, drew 10, lost 18, scored 48 conceded 71. It's just terrible. 5 goals short of two conceded a game average.

 

Not exactly sure how you can defend that like.

 

[Unbelievable]

First half of the season before last we were (amongst the) team(s) that conceeded the least goals in the league. Did we only play at home?

 

Have we even looked like recreating that kind of form, since the first dozen games of which you mention, it's been terrible and i tend to form my view over the nearly two season since rather than just those twelve or so games.

If you want to discard half a season proof that we can be solid defensively (could say full season), why do people base their opinion on how we could be much better going forward on a period stretching 6 matches in the same season? Both things happened, and both things are true: we can be better defensively AND going forward.

 

It wasn't half a season, we conceded 51 goals in that season. 34 of them away. Like i said, under him we have been terrible for concededing goals especially away. Pick a few games out of that lot if you like. It doesn't change the overall pattern, under him our away record for the last two seasons is played 36, won 10, drew 10, lost 18, scored 48 conceded 71. It's just terrible. One goal short of two conceded a game average.

 

Not exactly sure how you can't defend that like.

 

 

Again, do home games not count? We conceded 17 at home that season, which puts us third, with second only conceding 2 less than us. I'm not defending this shambolic mess of last season, but to say we can't be solid defensively is nonsense.

[Guest bimpy474]

First half of the season before last we were (amongst the) team(s) that conceeded the least goals in the league. Did we only play at home?

 

Have we even looked like recreating that kind of form, since the first dozen games of which you mention, it's been terrible and i tend to form my view over the nearly two season since rather than just those twelve or so games.

If you want to discard half a season proof that we can be solid defensively (could say full season), why do people base their opinion on how we could be much better going forward on a period stretching 6 matches in the same season? Both things happened, and both things are true: we can be better defensively AND going forward.

 

It wasn't half a season, we conceded 51 goals in that season. 34 of them away. Like i said, under him we have been terrible for concededing goals especially away. Pick a few games out of that lot if you like. It doesn't change the overall pattern, under him our away record for the last two seasons is played 36, won 10, drew 10, lost 18, scored 48 conceded 71. It's just terrible. One goal short of two conceded a game average.

 

Not exactly sure how you can't defend that like.

 

 

Again, do home games not count? We conceded 17 at home that season, which puts us third, with second only conceding 2 less than us. I'm not defending this shambolic mess of last season, but to say we can't be solid defensively is nonsense.

 

You may have noticed my maths was a bit off, corrected now, fast typing is not my thing.

 

Of course i can say we can't be solid defensively, we only conceded 3 more goals away the season just finished, than the one before. So that shows it's not a one off. You say about the home form, well if that's not good then we are in big trouble as this season just gone showed.

 

Under Pardew we are terrible and it's gotten worse and worse as his time here has lengthened. I hope your right but i'm not sure that i can see the defensive fraility changing just because we sign one more decent defender.

[Unbelievable]

Not just because we sign one more defender. I never said that. We also got 2 new full backs and a centre back in January, who have had half a season to adjust. That's a full back four. On top of that, with a little bit of luck, we may also get our esteemed captain back, focused and committed to the cause unlike last season.

[Guest bimpy474]

Not just because we sign one more defender. I never said that. We also got 2 new full backs and a centre back in January, who have had half a season to adjust. That's a full back four. On top of that, with a little bit of luck, we may also get our esteemed captain back, focused and committed to the cause unlike last season.

 

Don't get me wrong, i think you're quite right and agree with you. It's just Pardew and his tactics that make it a complete unknown. We will concede goals but i think the ridiculous amounts has been down to him and his tactics as much as it's been the fault of the players. He started off well but other managers have just sussed him and his tactics out imo, and the results have reflected that.

[Unbelievable]

Not just because we sign one more defender. I never said that. We also got 2 new full backs and a centre back in January, who have had half a season to adjust. That's a full back four. On top of that, with a little bit of luck, we may also get our esteemed captain back, focused and committed to the cause unlike last season.

 

Don't get me wrong, i think you're quite right and agree with you. It's just Pardew and his tactics that make it a complete unknown. We will concede goals but i think the ridiculous amounts has been down to him and his tactics as much as it's been the fault of the players. He started off well but other managers have just sussed him and his tactics out imo, and the results have reflected that.

 

Possibly, not certainly. We will see. If results don't improve he'll be sacked off sharpish anyway. I like to think it's been made perfectly clear to him that this season wasn't acceptable by any measure. They cut him some slack however for last season. One season of overachievement, one of underachievement. He will not be allowed another.

[Guest bimpy474]

I reckon you're spot on, his bit of leeway will disappear if we start badly. Only next Wednesday to find out what kind of fixtures we'll have too.

[Jayson]

Looked up our last two seasons defensively:

 

                              2011-12            2012-13    |                                  2011-12          2012-13

Conceded:              Home:                Home:      |    Conceded:              Away                Away

                                                                          |

Clean sheets              9                        4            |    Clean sheets              6                      2 

1 goal                        5                        6            |    1 goal                        5                      6

2 goals                      3                        5            |    2 goals                      1                      8

3 goals                      2                        3            |    3 goals                      3                      0

6 goals                      0                        1            |    4 goals                      2                      2

                                                                          |      5 goals                      2                      0

                                                                          |      7 goals                      0                      1

 

+ So we were far better at home in 2011-12, 5 clean sheets more, which have been replaced by us conceding 2 or more (4 times) & 1 goal (once).

+ The 4 clean sheets we had away have been replaced by many more times of conceding 2 or more last season.

+ (Though suprisingly we had less games last season where we conceded 3 or more away, which might have been useful if we hadnt weakened our strikeforce)

------

But yeah we also have a tendancy to get thrashed several times away from home under Pardew. In 2011-12 under him we did defend very well though, conceding 1 or less 25 out of 38 games. Giving us a very good chance to win those games with a half decent strikeforce.

[mrmojorisin75]

Possibly, not certainly. We will see. If results don't improve he'll be sacked off sharpish anyway. I like to think it's been made perfectly clear to him that this season wasn't acceptable by any measure. They cut him some slack however for last season. One season of overachievement, one of underachievement. He will not be allowed another.

 

lot of conjecture there tbh, i'm starting to move towards the viewpoint that they'll stick with him come what may

 

i'm aware that's based on nothing but opinion as well mind

[Unbelievable]

Possibly, not certainly. We will see. If results don't improve he'll be sacked off sharpish anyway. I like to think it's been made perfectly clear to him that this season wasn't acceptable by any measure. They cut him some slack however for last season. One season of overachievement, one of underachievement. He will not be allowed another.

 

lot of conjecture there tbh, i'm starting to move towards the viewpoint that they'll stick with him come what may

 

i'm aware that's based on nothing but opinion as well mind

 

Your fatalistic approach that next season is a write off before it's even begun is conjecture too, as I'm sure you realise (do you?)

[mrmojorisin75]

well yes, but it's based on my observations of pardew's management in 2.5 years as well so there's something behind it, whereas your belief they'll sack him after a bad start and that it's been made clear to him he failed last year is based on fuck all as far as i know

 

 

[Unbelievable]

well yes, but it's based on my observations of pardew's management in 2.5 years as well so there's something behind it, whereas your belief they'll sack him after a bad start and that it's been made clear to him he failed last year is based on f*** all as far as i know

 

 

 

1) Pardew did have one good season in that 2.5 year, and his first half season wasn't bad either. He got some credit for his 5th place finish

2) Hughton was sacked off under no fan pressure at all for having a promoted side safely in midtable, so we know Ashley can have a mean streak

3) Pardew himself indicated in the press before the end of season meeting he expected it to be uneasy. You don't think for a second they gave him a pat on the back and opened a bottle to celebrate?

 

Aye, but Pardew is here to stay forever, regardless of what happens and we are guaranteed to not ever have a good season again under his helm. Sounds legit.

[mrmojorisin75]

well yes, but it's based on my observations of pardew's management in 2.5 years as well so there's something behind it, whereas your belief they'll sack him after a bad start and that it's been made clear to him he failed last year is based on f*** all as far as i know

 

 

 

1) Pardew did have one good season in that 2.5 year, and his first half season wasn't bad either. He got some credit for his 5th place finish

2) Hughton was sacked off under no fan pressure at all for having a promoted side safely in midtable, so we know Ashley can have a mean streak

3) Pardew himself indicated in the press before the end of season meeting he expected it to be uneasy. You don't think for a second they gave him a pat on the back and opened a bottle to celebrate?

 

Aye, but Pardew is here to stay forever, regardless of what happens and we are guaranteed to not ever have a good season again under his helm.  Sounds legit.

 

i didn't say this btw

 

of course he gets credit for 5th but let's be honest with ourselves about how he achieved that shall we and not delude ourselves he will be able to replicate it, nor that other clubs around there like chelsea will have as bad seasons again...not impossible but i know where my money is, that's all i'm saying

 

unlike you i don't know what's in the minds of dekka and mike because nobody should have survived that fucking disgusting train wreck of a season last year, no-one, but pardew did so i'm afraid i can't predict what their motivations might be

 

success for us under pardew's management next season for me would be to stay in touching distance of 7th for the majority of the season and have a cup run, i think he might achieve it actually, i just think it'll still end up being a wasted season

[toontownman]

Everton fans thought the same with moyes.

 

I can see where Ashley and Derek are coming from with consistency.. Blatantly they all fall together now.. We will probably just bumble around mid table and alienate more fans/players.

 

Should have been out at Christmas, but maybe he deserved one chance to turn it around. Four new players later and he makes us look worse and we nearly get relegated. He should have gone without doubt. This is the biggest one in his ownership big we know how Ashley loves a gamble.

 

[David Icke - Son of God]

I hated last season as much as the next fan and I have absolutely no faith he'll turn it around next year but short termism in football gets right on my tits. He's the second longest serving manager in the league, which is absolutely mental. Twelve months ago he was manager of the year and being touted as a future England boss. I don't think you can hammer the board for deciding his worth one last chance.

 

And I mean one last chance because I certainly don't think he's untouchable. I don't think it's beyond the realms of possibility that we get a rotten first half dozen games and he's clearing his desk come early October. Ashley's only loyalty is to his businesses being successful. Now we already know his measure of success is purely financial, but an under performing Newcastle side is a lot more costly than one that competes further up the league for more prize money. I don't think personal relationships will come into it.

[Unbelievable]

I hated last season as much as the next fan and I have absolutely no faith he'll turn it around next year but short termism in football gets right on my tits. He's the second longest serving manager in the league, which is absolutely mental. Twelve months ago he was manager of the year and being touted as a future England boss. I don't think you can hammer the board for deciding his worth one last chance.

 

And I mean one last chance because I certainly don't think he's untouchable. I don't think it's beyond the realms of possibility that we get a rotten first half dozen games and he's clearing his desk come early October. Ashley's only loyalty is to his businesses being successful. Now we already know his measure of success is purely financial, but an under performing Newcastle side is a lot more costly than one that competes further up the league for more prize money. I don't think personal relationships will come into it.

[Guest bimpy474]

I see these differing views and can agree from both sides at times. Thing is though, it wasn't just bad form. It was just about everything. The style, the formation, the set pieces, him and his gob. The utter nonsense he spouted once we were safe, thinking were stupid with some of his bullshit stats.

 

He doesn't deserve another go, 5th place or not, last season was as poor a performance from a manager as i can remember. From games he decided to give up on, Man City away, Brighton in the cup, the first 70 mins against Benfica. To continue to hoof every ball into the box whenever we get a free kick. The continued selection of Jonas. The list really does go on. He deserves nothing and should have been sacked multiple times last season.

 

But as much as i dislike him, he has my support for now in the hope he can gets us playing and performing well, and if this lad Douglas will aid that, then brilliant. As unlikely as that is.