Parky Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Whether we win or lose, the fact that he seems unable to get the best out of real top class players to the point where Shola is a better option is a massive concern to me. I still don't understand this thing about him not doing any attacking coaching. Seems bizarre. I know teams sometimes have a specialist defensive coach to work in isolation with the defenders but the manager is still responsible for overall play, positioning and formations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketsbaia Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Deserves to be under pressure if we lose today. I know people don't like to admit that, I can live with results not going our way when we play our best team, best system, but playing a system that doesn't work for 2 months straight and scraping wins against Norwich and Spurs being our only results this season is shocking for a top 6 team. Definitely deserves it. But now we've shackled him to an 8-year deal it'll be depressingly pointless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Have we already lost today like? If we lose he deserves everything though. Same as if Shola has a blinder he deserves the credit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 If his baffling decisions don't work out today he should get some grief for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Think if we don't get a result today with some decent periods of football he's going to start coming under pressure from the crowd. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 If his baffling decisions don't work out today he should get some grief for it. He'll be absolutely slaughtered on here today if we play poor and get a draw or loss. I think he's picked a very defensive, very uninventive team. Got issues with several selections but I'll wait and see what happens. If we do turn out to play shite, he will take it and deserve it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Carr and the scouting team get the players in, so Pardew can take little credit from us having Cabaye, Tiote, HBA, Cisse, Ba etc. Pardew's job is to take that collection of undoubtedly talented individuals and turn them into a flowing side. He's completely failing at this. Things he's good at: - Comes across well on TV - Seems to have built a strong team spirit - Players like him Things he's not good at: - Playing the right players in the right positions (I'm going to continue banging the "Put players on their natural side in a 4-4-2" drum until everyone in the world hears it) - Selecting the right formation for the players we have available Shola ahead of Cisse is starting to look like West Ham where he played some lumbering carthorse like Harewood ahead of Tevez and some other plank (Mullins?) ahead of Mascherano. I've still got faith in him and we could have a far worse manager, but he's never going to be top class until he addresses the negatives. And they're not small negatives, they're pretty bloody big and basic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbandit Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 To be honest, Pardew fought for Cisse and Ba and wanted both irrespective of Carr so you can't level that one at him. I agree with the rest Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeletor Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 4-4-2 will break him eventually. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Saying he has nothing at all to do with the players we bring in is massively harsh and completely untrue like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zach Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Carr and the scouting team get the players in, so Pardew can take little credit from us having Cabaye, Tiote, HBA, Cisse, Ba etc. Pardew's job is to take that collection of undoubtedly talented individuals and turn them into a flowing side. He's completely failing at this. Things he's good at: - Comes across well on TV - Seems to have built a strong team spirit - Players like him Things he's not good at: - Playing the right players in the right positions (I'm going to continue banging the "Put players on their natural side in a 4-4-2" drum until everyone in the world hears it) - Selecting the right formation for the players we have available Shola ahead of Cisse is starting to look like West Ham where he played some lumbering carthorse like Harewood ahead of Tevez and some other plank (Mullins?) ahead of Mascherano. I've still got faith in him and we could have a far worse manager, but he's never going to be top class until he addresses the negatives. And they're not small negatives, they're pretty bloody big and basic. Who would you say he plays on the wrong side like? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Have we already lost today like? If we lose he deserves everything though. Same as if Shola has a blinder he deserves the credit. If we lose he will have fucked up badly. If we drew we would have won with the 4-3-3. If we win it would have been a lot more comfortable if we played 4-3-3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Let me know when the proper turning on Pards phase begins. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Not saying he's had no input at all in transfers, I'm sure its discussed and he says his piece. But Carr's the one pulling the strings there for the most part and he's done a bloody good job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Have we already lost today like? If we lose he deserves everything though. Same as if Shola has a blinder he deserves the credit. If we lose he will have fucked up badly. If we drew we would have won with the 4-3-3. If we win it would have been a lot more comfortable if we played 4-3-3. This never happens, if we play well and win he'll be given the credit he deserves, like always. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Pards has no say in transfers I'd have thought that was clear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Have we already lost today like? If we lose he deserves everything though. Same as if Shola has a blinder he deserves the credit. If we lose he will have fucked up badly. If we drew we would have won with the 4-3-3. If we win it would have been a lot more comfortable if we played 4-3-3. This never happens, if we play well and win he'll be given the credit he deserves, like always. It's already started happening today. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Even those people fully behind everything Pardew does and says must wonder to themselves why the formation with Cisse up top and Ba on the left which gave us, what, six straight wins, has not been tried once this season? No? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbers Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Even those people fully behind everything Pardew does and says must wonder to themselves why the formation with Cisse up top and Ba on the left which gave us, what, six straight wins, has not been tried once this season? No? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nuneaton Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Let me know when the proper turning on Pards phase begins. hopefully never Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Even those people fully behind everything Pardew does and says must wonder to themselves why the formation with Cisse up top and Ba on the left which gave us, what, six straight wins, has not been tried once this season? No? Cause Ba told him to fuck off with that shit and his agent and brother and cousins around the world started revolutions and disrupted the flow of western capital and euro lost value and war started in Libya. Pards backed off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_R Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Who would you say he plays on the wrong side like? Ben Arfa, Gutierrez and Santon today. That's 3/4 of our wide players. Only Simpson will be on his best side and he's terrified of a football so is no use whatsoever going forward. OK, Ben Arfa's so bloody talented that it's largely irrelevant for him, but as a team game it's fucking shit to have so many players on the wrong side. There's no service to the strikers as nobody can beat a man on the outside and get a cross in. Every single time they'll have to stop, check back, and play an inswinging cross in with their stronger foot that will be cleared easily by the defenders who've had time to compose themselves and are facing away from goal. We're completely negating our strikers, wingers and fullbacks effectiveness by doing this, and we do it every bloody week. Under a 4-3-3 its different, as the 2 wide men play as auxiliary strikers rather than wingers, so I can see the logic of having people on the wrong sides there. But not in a 4-4-2, it's utter dogshit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanSkÃrare Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 This set up he's gone for today, it's really saddening more than anything. There's just no ambition to play it on the deck and be "fluid", as he so elegantly puts it all the time. There's just one simple plan involving route 1 to Shola and Ba. Like Wullie said in the pre-match thread: the gameplan is poor to a degree that's forced him to bench one of Europe's best finishers. Can't get my head around what he's hoping to achieve with this sort of football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cajun Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Even those people fully behind everything Pardew does and says must wonder to themselves why the formation with Cisse up top and Ba on the left which gave us, what, six straight wins, has not been tried once this season? No? That would be my preferred choice, I am guessing Ba wanted to play in his preferred position and was promised this to keep him happy. He has scored 6 goals this season there while Cisse has scored none in the league (and to be fair he has had his chances). On the one hand you can say Ba needs to just lump it and play in a position which suits the team more, on the other do we know Cisse will instantly start banging them in when it returns to that set up? Can we risk shifting our leading goalscorer to a position he struggles to score in whilst hoping Cisse instantly starts scoring again? I don't think it's as straightforward as some think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanshithispantz Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Have we already lost today like? If we lose he deserves everything though. Same as if Shola has a blinder he deserves the credit. If we lose he will have fucked up badly. If we drew we would have won with the 4-3-3. If we win it would have been a lot more comfortable if we played 4-3-3. This never happens, if we play well and win he'll be given the credit he deserves, like always. It's already started happening today. People are pre-empting how the match will go, not saying that any win/good performance will be luck tbf. If we win AND play well I'm sure Pardew will be given his dues. Whether or not people still think that Cisse and Taylor should have started is irrelevant. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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