Alan Pardew

[Mick]

 

 

That post was solely in response to "Look at these names, they are all class, we should have done better" because it doesn't quite work like that unless they are playing every game.

 

I don't deny we have been poor though and although I agree that missing players at the back can have a big impact as Stu mentioned, Pardew has still shown a worrying lack of ability to change our gameplan when it is needed.

 

I am in the give him the start of next season and see how it goes camp.

 

How long should he get into next season and at what point do you think he should go?

[Dr Venkman]

It's all well and good listing off our quality players but when a lot of them have missed nearly half the season it doesn't really look that great, they have started -

 

Cabaye 18 games - 1 more games than Perch

Tiote 17 games - The same amount of games as Perch

Colocinni - 19 games - 2 more than Williamson

Taylor 17 games - Same as Williamson

Ben Arfa 13 games

Krul 22 games

Anita 17 games

Marveaux 8 games

 

Obviously they couldn't have played more since they only signed in January, however if you are including them in an argument of what we have done with this squad this season..

 

Games started -

 

Debuchy 9

Gouffran 8

Sissoko 8

Yanga-Mbwia 4

 

Cisse 28 and Santon 30 are the only players who has had a consistent run in the side.

 

Loads of numbers that don't justify the lack of team cohesion, competent attacking team play or ruthlessly terrible set penises we've seen for over two years. I understand that it sounds dismissive but that's the point I've reached now I'm afraid, he can either get some results or fuck off.

 

That post was solely in response to "Look at these names, they are all class, we should have done better" because it doesn't quite work like that unless they are playing every game.

 

I don't deny we have been poor though and although I agree that missing players at the back can have a big impact as Stu mentioned, Pardew has still shown a worrying lack of ability to change our gameplan when it is needed.

 

I am in the give him the start of next season and see how it goes camp. I'm not overly confident he will change it around as he seems to have one way of playing (which can be boring) but I don't think it's a lost cause just yet either.

 

Aye fair enough mate I don't even know why I'm still talking about this to be honest, it's just preferable to doing any work.

[Wullie]

No you're not Jon, you're in the "defend him, come what may" camp.

 

There's absolutely no way you would call for his head if we're fifteenth in October, and even if you did, how on Earth is that preferable to giving a real manager a full summer and pre-season with the players?

[Stu]

now mick, let's not let reality get in the way of a good supporting argument for pardiola

 

aye, particularly when he's putting his own twist on 'reality' - pretty sure Pardew was sacked for non-footballing reasons at Southampton, they won their last match 5-0 (or similar) before his 'falling out' with Cortese came to a head. He took a team on -10pts to fall just short of the play-offs while leading them to a successful Wembley final.

[Cajun]

 

 

That post was solely in response to "Look at these names, they are all class, we should have done better" because it doesn't quite work like that unless they are playing every game.

 

I don't deny we have been poor though and although I agree that missing players at the back can have a big impact as Stu mentioned, Pardew has still shown a worrying lack of ability to change our gameplan when it is needed.

 

I am in the give him the start of next season and see how it goes camp.

 

How long should he get into next season and at what point do you think he should go?

 

I hate this sort of question because I can't really put a number on it.

 

For me it will be when it gets to the point I am certain he isn't going to change his approach so it's not going to work. I wasn't happy with some of the performances last season but I was happy with our progress and where we ended up. This season it's similar/worse performances but without the results to justify it.

 

He's had two seasons (the half season really doesn't count), he's had one where he overachieved and one where he has underachieved. It depends on which of these we get next season. If we just carry on from where we started this season I don't think my patience will last too long

[Incognito]

As if people are comparing our manager to David Moyes.

 

Moyes had constrictions on him financially in his relegation threatened season and had his team thrive with the Rooney money. Since then, he has had Everton perpetually challenging for Europe whilst playing a style that is pleasing to the eye.

 

Any of that ring true for our manager? Like comparing shite to chocolate.

[Ronaldo]

As if people are comparing our manager to David Moyes.

 

Moyes had constrictions on him financially in his relegation threatened season and had his team thrive with the Rooney money. Since then, he has had Everton perpetually challenging for Europe whilst playing a style that is pleasing to the eye.

 

This I agree with, tbh. Apart from them being pleasing to the eye, which they rarely are.

[Mick]

 

 

aye, particularly when he's putting his own twist on 'reality' - pretty sure Pardew was sacked for non-footballing reasons at Southampton, they won their last match 5-0 (or similar) before his 'falling out' with Cortese came to a head. He took a team on -10pts to fall just short of the play-offs while leading them to a successful Wembley final.

 

His "successful Wembley final" was against Carlisle in the Johnstone's Paint Trophy. 

 

From the BBC when Southampton sacked him.

 

Saints, who started the season as favourites to win promotion, are currently 14th in the League One table.

 

"The club has decided that, to achieve its well known targets, it is essential to make changes to the management," said a Southampton statement.

[mrmojorisin75]

now mick, let's not let reality get in the way of a good supporting argument for pardiola

 

aye, particularly when he's putting his own twist on 'reality' - pretty sure Pardew was sacked for non-footballing reasons at Southampton, they won their last match 5-0 (or similar) before his 'falling out' with Cortese came to a head. He took a team on -10pts to fall just short of the play-offs while leading them to a successful Wembley final.

 

aye the southampton thing wasn't accurate at all like, that was clear

[Cajun]

No you're not Jon, you're in the "defend him, come what may" camp.

 

There's absolutely no way you would call for his head if we're fifteenth in October, and even if you did, how on Earth is that preferable to giving a real manager a full summer and pre-season with the players?

 

Sorry but that's bolllocks, you're just such a grumpy fucker that anyone who doesn't moan at every little thing is a Pardew apologist I have criticised him in the very posts you are responding to ffs!

 

I have criticised him plenty for things he has done wrong this season, I have also defended him when I thought people were going OTT (like blaming him for the result against Benfica).

[Ronaldo]

That makes it alright, then. Just mention good players who we've had since January - and who having us looking far better.

 

Petty by a 20-year-old's standards.

 

I didn't "Just mention good players who we've had since January."

 

What's left is a few good players, injured players and players who've been poor all season. Doesn't help your case one bit.

[Incognito]

And let's not play the stability card for stability's sake. Why have stability with a bloke who clearly is out of his depth and plays a brand of football that would put a glass eye to sleep?

[Wullie]

So you'd rather waste another season and bin him in September/October than get a good manager who will play positive football in over summer?

 

Boggles my mind all this. You constantly say the club can't get anyone better than this mug - we'll have a hell of a lot more chance in the summer than after two months of a new one, but apparently this comes second to giving him a "chance". We're not running a fucking charity giving opportunity to the under-achieving, it's a multi million pound football club and we're giving people "chances", utterly ludicrous.

 

You know as well as I do that he's not going to change his football philosophy. Why would anyone want to watch this negative turgid rubbish for another season?

[Mick]

 

 

I hate this sort of question because I can't really put a number on it.

 

For me it will be when it gets to the point I am certain he isn't going to change his approach so it's not going to work. I wasn't happy with some of the performances last season but I was happy with our progress and where we ended up. This season it's similar/worse performances but without the results to justify it.

 

He's had two seasons (the half season really doesn't count), he's had one where he overachieved and one where he has underachieved. It depends on which of these we get next season. If we just carry on from where we started this season I don't think my patience will last too long

 

As Wullie has pointed out, by that time we'll have lost a full pre-season for any replacement to work with the players and we'll be looking to bring in whoever is sitting by a phone waiting for a call because they are out of work.

 

Bringing in a replacement will always be easier between May and August and more likely to bring in an upgrade, assuming we have enough about us to actually recognise one.

[mrmojorisin75]

So you'd rather waste another season and bin him in September/October than get a good manager who will play positive football in over summer?

 

Boggles my mind all this. You constantly say the club can't get anyone better than this mug - we'll have a hell of a lot more chance in the summer than after two months of a new one, but apparently this comes second to giving him a "chance". We're not running a fucking charity giving opportunity to the under-achieving, it's a multi million pound football club and we're giving people "chances", utterly ludicrous.

 

You know as well as I do that he's not going to change his football philosophy. Why would anyone want to watch this negative turgid rubbish for another season?

 

this is the worrying part for me, and a big part of our problems this season especially after ba left imo

 

i think he wants to change, i think he recognises the players we've signed aren't necessarily suited to the game we played last year, but i don't think he knows how to do so

 

this season we've looked neither good in defence nor attack at any stage really and i put a lot down to pardew not knowing what he wants...last year he had one plan only and the players were drilled to do it, this year i don't think anyone knows what they're supposed to be doing

 

his use of sissoko stinks of this for me, i don't think he's being used correctly and never have (said so from the chelsea game before anyone starts)

[Beren]

Ashley would only sack Pardew if he threatened his financial investment in the club, I think.

 

Having already thrown money at the issue in January, the next step has to be the manager should his investment remain in jeopardy. The closer we get to relegation without being relegated the better (sadly) - but even that won't be enough to get him to get rid of Pardew in the summer I don't think.  Future is glum with the our moron manager.

[Mick]

 

 

What's left is a few good players, injured players and players who've been poor all season. Doesn't help your case one bit.

 

Why have those players been poor all season?  Is it not the manager’s responsibility to make sure the players are performing?  Pardew isn't some innocent bystander that has no part to play in this.  He's the one who trains the players and prepares them for games and is supposed to set us up to get the best out of what we've got and he's failed miserably at that.

 

Christ, we found a formation that worked for most of our players towards the end of last season and he was saying that we were going to change it even before a ball was kicked this season and look what's happened since.

[colinmk]

At the end of the day it is clear Pardew is a manager who relies on individuals in his squad to be hitting peak form and not injured for the majority of the season. He hasn't managed to make an effective system of playing in his time here at all(sorry, he had it a one point then binned it), a system where player A is injured player B can come in and not unsettle the way the team is going to play. It's clear to me if we want to move forward and achieve what is possible with this very talented squad of players we need to get a new manager in the summer.

 

I am quite willing to accept if we kept him it's possible that we will be fifth or something come October too. This really means nothing though unless he changes his ways and considering he has had two and a half seasons to do it now I can't see it happening.

[mrmojorisin75]

Is it not the manager’s responsibility to make sure the players are performing?  Pardew isn't some innocent bystander that has no part to play in this.  He's the one who trains the players and prepares them for games and is supposed to set us up to get the best out of what we've got and he's failed miserably at that.

 

my thoughts exactly

 

i'll say it again, amazing the leeway he's getting from some given our position in the league

[ATB]

Mick is the only sensible person in this thread.

[Guest neesy111]

Mick is the only sensible person in this thread.

 

[Parky]

No you're not Jon, you're in the "defend him, come what may" camp.

 

There's absolutely no way you would call for his head if we're fifteenth in October, and even if you did, how on Earth is that preferable to giving a real manager a full summer and pre-season with the players?

 

If we actually had some 'football brains' in the boardroom there is no way they wouldn't make a change this summer. We have the players now that can play a cogent european type posesssion and tempo game. How do I know this? They've been playing it all their lives at other clubs and for their respective countries.

[Ronaldo]

 

 

What's left is a few good players, injured players and players who've been poor all season. Doesn't help your case one bit.

 

Why have those players been poor all season?  Is it not the manager’s responsibility to make sure the players are performing?

 

The poor performances of Colo and Tiote in particular this season go way beyond what they're being told in the dressing room.

[Guest neesy111]

Tiote is a poor footballer in general and his role should be needed in 10-15 games a season.  Colo is in the twlight of his career.  Both are explainable.

[Mick]

 

 

The poor performances of Colo and Tiote in particular this season go way beyond what they're being told in the dressing room.

 

Coloccini hasn't been that bad and earlier in the season was a contender for player of the season, along with Santon.  Poor performance will not be as much effected in the dressing room, it will mainly come from what happens on the training pitch and also from how we are set up to play.

 

Sitting back doesn't suit our players and that is clearly how we're being set up.  Sitting back is putting our defenders under constant pressure and our forward play also suffers because we’re feeding off scraps more often than not and that does come from the manager, not the players.

 

If the players were ignoring the manager then he’s either lost them or he’s not impressing on them what he’s expecting from them, not that I think for one minute that that’s the case with us.