Dr Venkman Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think it's ridiculous to suggest that we play 4-4-2 just because of Ba. Pardew has been brilliant enough that we shouldn't be criticizing him after we lost 2-0 to a pretty much guaranteed top 3 team. And it's not like 4-4-2 has always been awful for us. I trust Pardew 100% what ever formation he decides to go with. This season has lasted a day over week now, calm down everybody. Everyone's calm, I trust him as well but it's a growing concern imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pata Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think it's ridiculous to suggest that we play 4-4-2 just because of Ba. Pardew has been brilliant enough that we shouldn't be criticizing him after we lost 2-0 to a pretty much guaranteed top 3 team. And it's not like 4-4-2 has always been awful for us. I trust Pardew 100% what ever formation he decides to go with. This season has lasted a day over week now, calm down everybody. Everyone's calm, I trust him as well but it's a growing concern imo. Well yeah, it was more directed at ATB/Mole. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I trust Pards more than any manager since Sir Bobby i would just like to see us use the system that i believe suits our players the best. It's just frustrating seeing Cabaye and Ben Arfa so deep but i do trust Pards and anything he thinks is right for this club i support. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I trust Pards more than any manager since Sir Bobby i would just like to see us use the system that i believe suits our players the best. It's just frustrating seeing Cabaye and Ben Arfa so deep but i do trust Pards and anything he thinks is right for this club i support. All I can say to that is thank fuck you weren't around on here when we were managed by the likes of Souness and Fat Sam. If you call this constant bitching about his tactics trust and support I dread to think how you would hold up with a genuinely tactically clueless manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Pards want to have enough quality in a two man midfield that we'll compete and have the constant goal threat of 2 upfront at the same time. The worry is we'll be less clinical with just Cisse up front. I think it's not working yet. I didn't see chelsea game so only going on everyone's opinion of it but sounds like Cabaye's lack of fitness was probably as much to blame of us losing control of the midfield, really going for them with 2 unsettling their defence isn't the worst idea. That said we've always looked best in 4-3-3, not sure why Pards has so little faith in it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I trust Pards more than any manager since Sir Bobby i would just like to see us use the system that i believe suits our players the best. It's just frustrating seeing Cabaye and Ben Arfa so deep but i do trust Pards and anything he thinks is right for this club i support. All I can say to that is thank f*** you weren't around on here when we were managed by the likes of Souness and Fat Sam. If you call this constant bitching about his tactics trust and support I dread to think how you would hold up with a genuinely tactically clueless manager. It's just frustrating because of the football we played at the end of last season. It seems i'm coming across a lot definitely than what i'm trying to portray...... Fat Sam and Souness was different as i had lower expectations and it almost got to the stage where i just accepted what ever they did. I'm not really bitching, just showing concern about the long term success of what 4-4-2 can bring us. I said i support Pardew and i do but that doesn't mean i have to agree with every little thing he does, i believe in what he's trying to do but there's obviously a difference of opinion of what system is best for us. Or am i not allowed to express an opinion? does this show a lack of faith in the manager? There's more to this club than just systems and i believe in everything Pardew is doing from top to bottom i just feel we are using the wrong system. I don't see no reason to bottle this up inside of me, i personally feel he's using the wrong system for the players we have but this doesn't mean i don't support him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 We were pretty indifferent first few games of last season iirc, few 0-0s and were all getting concerned despite not losing, then Ba started scoring...it'll happen again, we'll click, we just managed to fail to get the right fitness levels. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cronky Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think it's ridiculous to suggest that we play 4-4-2 just because of Ba. Pardew has been brilliant enough that we shouldn't be criticizing him after we lost 2-0 to a pretty much guaranteed top 3 team. And it's not like 4-4-2 has always been awful for us. I trust Pardew 100% what ever formation he decides to go with. This season has lasted a day over week now, calm down everybody. Everyone's calm, I trust him as well but it's a growing concern imo. This concern has some substance though. Pardew has said in public that Ba had been worried about what position he was going to play, and that he'd told him that in 90% of games, he'd be down the middle. Really that can only mean 4-4-2, unless he's going to drop Cisse, or push him wide. In that respect, he's made a bit of an exception of Ba. No-one else has been given those kind of public assurances. That's never felt right to me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 If we get Debuchy (which I don't think we will tbh) I can see us rocking a 4-3-1-2 a la Italy at Euros, but without competant wing-backs that has no width at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 If we get Debuchy (which I don't think we will tbh) I can see us rocking a 4-3-1-2 a la Italy at Euros, but without competant wing-backs that has no width at all. if that happens then i'm perfectly fine with that, i just don't want to see Cabaye and Ben Arfa so bleeding deep. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 I think it's ridiculous to suggest that we play 4-4-2 just because of Ba. Pardew has been brilliant enough that we shouldn't be criticizing him after we lost 2-0 to a pretty much guaranteed top 3 team. And it's not like 4-4-2 has always been awful for us. I trust Pardew 100% what ever formation he decides to go with. This season has lasted a day over week now, calm down everybody. Everyone's calm, I trust him as well but it's a growing concern imo. This concern has some substance though. Pardew has said in public that Ba had been worried about what position he was going to play, and that he'd told him that in 90% of games, he'd be down the middle. Really that can only mean 4-4-2, unless he's going to drop Cisse, or push him wide. In that respect, he's made a bit of an exception of Ba. No-one else has been given those kind of public assurances. That's never felt right to me. It's really strange I agree. Imagine if Pardew felt the need to say he's promised Ben Arfa he doesn't have to track back if he doesn't want to, there'd be more than a few raised eyebrows and rightly so. Why is Ba any different? He's not the only player who had a good season last time out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spider Jerusalem Posted August 25, 2012 Share Posted August 25, 2012 Why is Ba any different? He's not the only player who had a good season last time out. Possibly becaue Ba was the only one that was contractually able to leave for a value that proved to be a buttload less than his footballing value and the manager made assurances to that player he was going to try and play to his strengths rather than what had proved successful for the team over the last couple of months rather than give him personal glory. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 I expect "sorry Demba it's not quite working can you try out left again, if you don't drop too deep you'll get plenty of opportunities. You'll get plenty central action in cups don't worry" soon enough. He could bugger off in january over it but we shouldn't play a formation that isn't working just to please one player. Ba's smart enough to understand that if he's not scoring centrally he's in no position to demand to stay there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 I expect "sorry Demba it's not quite working can you try out left again, if you don't drop too deep you'll get plenty of opportunities. You'll get plenty central action in cups don't worry" soon enough. He could bugger off in january over it but we shouldn't play a formation that isn't working just to please one player. Ba's smart enough to understand that if he's not scoring centrally he's in no position to demand to stay there. He's 1 in 2 to date Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 He's 1 in 2 to date Ironically, the goal came from the left. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 He's 1 in 2 to date Ironically, the goal came from the left. Centre left... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Centre left... Maybe so but it's where you would expect an attach to come from on the left of a front 3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveMc Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Centre left... When he missed the initial header he was between the posts. Orthadox Centre Forward territory Maybe so but it's where you would expect an attach to come from on the left of a front 3. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Quite frankly if Ba is to play on the left, the position he took up against Spurs is exactly the type of positions he should be taken up. Those little pockets of space between out wide and the middle of the pitch, basically the sort of positions Barcelona's wide players take up. He could do that and get goals doing so IMO but it seems he doesn't like the role unfortunately. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiresias Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 tbh play 4-3-3 tell Ba to not play too wide, and tell Jonas / Anita to drift to left more often to cover. May not work I suppose but may be happy medium. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 We lose a man centrally and are outplayed. 4-3-3 is a must against the better teams who are stacked in midfield otherwise we wont hold possession. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATB Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 4-3-3 can easily become 4-5-1. personally I'm pleased that we have a go at top teams by playing 2 Dembas Playing 2 strikers doesn't really mean "having a go" though, in the first half i wouldn't really call how we were playing "having a go" We did in the 2nd half sure, but the first half we looked like we came for a 0-0 PArds said we were brave. I think in formation and personnel we were. First half we didn't play for 0-0 we just got outplayed by a good team and didn't start too well. We were not brave and "had a go" in first half. We definitely looked happy to play for a 0-0. I don´t buy that we couldn´t have got a result because Chelsea were so good. We just didn´t play. We lose a man centrally and are outplayed. 4-3-3 is a must against the better teams who are stacked in midfield otherwise we wont hold possession. Exactly! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATB Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 4-3-3 can easily become 4-5-1. personally I'm pleased that we have a go at top teams by playing 2 Dembas Playing 2 strikers doesn't really mean "having a go" though, in the first half i wouldn't really call how we were playing "having a go" We did in the 2nd half sure, but the first half we looked like we came for a 0-0 This. And why are we so concerned to play two strikers up front when it´s clearly so many players is suffering from it? We can still play the two Dembas, in a 4-3-3/4-5-1. We always plays better in that system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest reefatoon Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 This fucking thread man, dear me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
loki679 Posted August 26, 2012 Share Posted August 26, 2012 Ok, so what advantages does four four two give us over the other system? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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