Guest bimpy474 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Happy Face : style of play, lack of movement, set penises and free kick hoofs.....? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 I've noticed that, i asked him about our style of play and the free kick hoofs. Maybe this will jog his memory. Aye, dodging question all over aren't I. There's a dozen of you and 2 of us expressing the counter argument. I don't think Pardew is capable of implementing any style other than keeping it tight. His set piece record is atrocious. But then we scored from as many set pieces as Arsenal last season. Should Wenger be sacked for his awful set pieces? We don't necessarily have to rely on them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudil Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Whether due to goals scored or conceded, or the game getting on, or the opposition taking it up a notch. Our players struggle to maintain their shape and concentration for 90 minutes. Can you expand on why you believe Pardew sees us playing reasonably good stuff, then insists we stop playing so well and start defending for outr lives? Settling for what he's got and hoping for more doesn't really cover it because he could do that from the first whistle, but the consensus seems to be, we don't. These are your reasons for our long ball play? Goals scored or conceded? The game 'getting on'? and the opposition taking it up a notch. losing shape, tiredness. But not Alan Pardew. Every one of 19th teams below us in the long table are subject to the conditions you give. And yet they are all below us in the long ball table. Coincidence? Can you expand on why you believe Pardew sees us playing reasonably good stuff, I don't think he does though. Perhaps when we string 5 passes together at the back under no pressure when the opposition are asleep (like the 1st half Vs. West Brom) that constitutes Pardew seeing us play "reasonably good stuff" for you but not for me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Much more sensible to view it from the perspective that players lose concentration, they forget their instructions, they panic after a bit of pressure and resort more and more to methods that they had not been asked to use when in training for the game. think hans might have covered this but let's assume you're correct - what has the manager done about it in 2.5 years then? his job isn't to just let shit happen...if you were right, and i don't think you are, he's paid to find a way to stop it happening He got 5 new players in January that are better than the ones they replaced. They will help with that, long term. Short term they are as likely to show inexperience or panic as those lesser players. I find it a bit worrying that the new players have mostly actually got worse since they got here. Lack of confidence rubbing off? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Well from watching games, when the opposition makes changes and get at us, Pardew has no reaction, no change other than Shola it seemed at times. Overall Pardew doesn't react at all, hence we get pushed back combined with our terrible ball retension and lack of real forward movement and play. Well there it is. What Change do you prefer to Shola? Williamson? Perch? Gosling? You have a problem with the tools here, not the workman. Of course you dont. You set the team up to pass, to move, to keep the ball. Pardew does none of those. He sets the team up to be tight, rigid and not give much away. Then he hopes a bit of magic will get a goal. Now that is fine if when you set up like we do, if you do keep it tight, but 67 goals conceded tells you he can't do that to well. Pardew has a decent squad at his disposal, lacking a striker which is ridiculous tbh. But overall to be so close to relegation is telling of his lack of ability. A question you've not answered (my apologises if i've missed it), our style of play is dreadful, our GK hoofing it into the box from 50/60 yards out, a tactic has never ever worked. Pardew is responsible for that, to keep trying something that is so poor. Pardew is a terrible manager at getting a team to play good, passing football. Is he not ? he is a terrible manager at getting results without luck thats what it comes down to, and the turgid boring negative s*** he brings to the table just further compounds his situation at the club. I understand why people are blaming Ashley etc, but this season is down to Pardew and his tactics, to say otherwise is flying in the face of all the evidence and plain old common sense. exactly, sure the owner, players, coaches share some of the blame, but ultimately what we are seeing on the field barely even merit the performance and ability of a midtable championship side. the players we got are quite a bit better than a championship team, some on here keep telling us the lack of quality we got, all i know is those players we got are more than capable of being in the top half of the table for the majority of the season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 What decent teams really get anywhere just by 'keeping it tight'? If you want to be a good side you need more than that about you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 What decent teams really get anywhere just by 'keeping it tight'? If you want to be a good side you need more than that about you. We have more than that though don't we? Great individual players. That's how we finished 5th. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 What decent teams really get anywhere just by 'keeping it tight'? If you want to be a good side you need more than that about you. This sums up Moyes' main deficiency FWIW. Being hard to beat gets you so far. Winning games gets you further. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gemmill Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 HF will attempt to engage in intelligent debate with the stupidest of people for a lot longer than most humans would allow*. Spudil, you should enjoy the patience he's affording you and see if you can learn something, rather than resorting to abuse. *He was the very last person to run out of patience with Leazes ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Much more sensible to view it from the perspective that players lose concentration, they forget their instructions, they panic after a bit of pressure and resort more and more to methods that they had not been asked to use when in training for the game. think hans might have covered this but let's assume you're correct - what has the manager done about it in 2.5 years then? his job isn't to just let shit happen...if you were right, and i don't think you are, he's paid to find a way to stop it happening He got 5 new players in January that are better than the ones they replaced. They will help with that, long term. Short term they are as likely to show inexperience or panic as those lesser players. doesn't explain the identical performances, indeed worse performances, prior to january Performances were solid and achieved 5th place when we had a remarkably injury free season. Before January we were filling gaps with Sammy Ameobi. Tavernier? Obertan? Ferguson? Bigirimana? They're not good enough. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bimpy474 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 I've noticed that, i asked him about our style of play and the free kick hoofs. Maybe this will jog his memory. Aye, dodging question all over aren't I. There's a dozen of you and 2 of us expressing the counter argument. I don't think Pardew is capable of implementing any style other than keeping it tight. His set piece record is atrocious. But then we scored from as many set pieces as Arsenal last season. Should Wenger be sacked for his awful set pieces? We don't necessarily have to rely on them. Fair enough on your reply, cheers mate. Second thing, the point about Arsenal is pathetic, seeing as they score freely from open play, have a good movement and have been high in the league every year. Its a ridiculous comparison. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 How many times have we seen us play a good first half We have no real pattern of play, no real way of keeping the ball. You are contradicting each other while being in agreement. Has Pardew set us up to play well in the first halves of games or not? Reading was the prime example. Dominated for an hour before Pardew shat himself and whipped off the main fretts to Reading, Marveaux and Cabaye , who had ran the show between them. Ended up losing. That's a bad example, as it's not entirely true. He took of Marveaux, that much is true. I forget who replaced him. However, Cabaye then asked to come off as he felt a knock/strain of some kind. That unfortunately left us well short on creativity and forward momentum. I'm sure that you can find a better suited example though. Not really as it was Cabayes comeback game after a lay off and Pardew must've had an inkling he wasn't going to get the 90. In which case, why did he take off Marveaux beforehand ? He may not have got the 90, but I'd hazard a guess that he was expecting him to last longer than the 60 (I think?) he did manage. As I say, it's a bad example because you'd given the impression that he'd elected to 'whip' them both off, despite them playing well. That wasn't the case, as an unexpected situation had caused the second substitution. Something he admitted after game, if I remember correctly. In this example, it wasn't his absolute intention to completely stifle our creativity and forward impetus. There'll be other, clearer, and more damning examples. You could point to those instead? He said it was unexpected. I'm saying that Cabaye struggles to get 90 when he plays week in week out, so it shouldn't have been unexpected and he should never have even contemplated taking Marveaux off beforehand. It was rank bad management, and effectively cost us the game. Reading was the prime example. Dominated for an hour before Pardew shat himself and whipped off the main fretts to Reading, Marveaux and Cabaye , who had ran the show between them. Ended up losing. You're twisting your argument again, Billy. It perhaps wasn't the greatest example of prescient management, but, a deliberately negative move with the sole intention of 'shutting up shop' it was not. Like I've said, there are plenty of other examples you could use, as this is far from being your 'prime' one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 What decent teams really get anywhere just by 'keeping it tight'? If you want to be a good side you need more than that about you. signs were there last season that this season might happen, we all know this, what we didn't know for sure last year was how poorly pardew would react when he was up against it - it's some of the worst top flight football management i've ever witnessed tbh, he should be sacked for this alone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 HF will attempt to engage in intelligent debate with the stupidest of people for a lot longer than most humans would allow*. Spudil, you should enjoy the patience he's affording you and see if you can learn something, rather than resorting to abuse. *He was the very last person to run out of patience with Leazes ffs. Any thoughts on Pardew? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 He hasn't grown with the potential of the squad. Personally, don't think he has it in him. We can meander along at his potential or we could look for someone to get more out of the team than he does. Reading that, it's an easy decision. The next bit is a lot harder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Much more sensible to view it from the perspective that players lose concentration, they forget their instructions, they panic after a bit of pressure and resort more and more to methods that they had not been asked to use when in training for the game. think hans might have covered this but let's assume you're correct - what has the manager done about it in 2.5 years then? his job isn't to just let shit happen...if you were right, and i don't think you are, he's paid to find a way to stop it happening He got 5 new players in January that are better than the ones they replaced. They will help with that, long term. Short term they are as likely to show inexperience or panic as those lesser players. I find it a bit worrying that the new players have mostly actually got worse since they got here. Lack of confidence rubbing off? In a perfect world they would all have been used as sparingly as Ben Arfa was upon arrival when he was chomping at the bit to play. Instead, Sissoko played 10 games in 30 days or something ridiculous. Fitness, and concentration needs to be taken up a notch if they're gonna cut it in the Premier league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incognito Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 How many times have we seen us play a good first half We have no real pattern of play, no real way of keeping the ball. You are contradicting each other while being in agreement. Has Pardew set us up to play well in the first halves of games or not? Reading was the prime example. Dominated for an hour before Pardew shat himself and whipped off the main fretts to Reading, Marveaux and Cabaye , who had ran the show between them. Ended up losing. That's a bad example, as it's not entirely true. He took of Marveaux, that much is true. I forget who replaced him. However, Cabaye then asked to come off as he felt a knock/strain of some kind. That unfortunately left us well short on creativity and forward momentum. I'm sure that you can find a better suited example though. Not really as it was Cabayes comeback game after a lay off and Pardew must've had an inkling he wasn't going to get the 90. In which case, why did he take off Marveaux beforehand ? He may not have got the 90, but I'd hazard a guess that he was expecting him to last longer than the 60 (I think?) he did manage. As I say, it's a bad example because you'd given the impression that he'd elected to 'whip' them both off, despite them playing well. That wasn't the case, as an unexpected situation had caused the second substitution. Something he admitted after game, if I remember correctly. In this example, it wasn't his absolute intention to completely stifle our creativity and forward impetus. There'll be other, clearer, and more damning examples. You could point to those instead? He said it was unexpected. I'm saying that Cabaye struggles to get 90 when he plays week in week out, so it shouldn't have been unexpected and he should never have even contemplated taking Marveaux off beforehand. It was rank bad management, and effectively cost us the game. Reading was the prime example. Dominated for an hour before Pardew shat himself and whipped off the main fretts to Reading, Marveaux and Cabaye , who had ran the show between them. Ended up losing. You're twisting your argument again, Billy. It perhaps wasn't the greatest example of prescient management, but, a deliberately negative move with the sole intention of 'shutting up shop' it was not. Like I've said, there are plenty of other examples you could use, as this is far from being your 'prime' one. I'd say taking your two most creative players off was shutting up shop personally. Especially as he brought Perch and I think Anita to replace. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Much more sensible to view it from the perspective that players lose concentration, they forget their instructions, they panic after a bit of pressure and resort more and more to methods that they had not been asked to use when in training for the game. think hans might have covered this but let's assume you're correct - what has the manager done about it in 2.5 years then? his job isn't to just let shit happen...if you were right, and i don't think you are, he's paid to find a way to stop it happening He got 5 new players in January that are better than the ones they replaced. They will help with that, long term. Short term they are as likely to show inexperience or panic as those lesser players. doesn't explain the identical performances, indeed worse performances, prior to january Performances were solid and achieved 5th place when we had a remarkably injury free season. Before January we were filling gaps with Sammy Ameobi. Tavernier? Obertan? Ferguson? Bigirimana? They're not good enough. so he can only succeed when he has ideal circumstances then? pretty much the opposite of the definition of a successful manager right there also, you correctly used the term "filling gaps", he wasn't fielding 6 reserve players every week the entire season...he filled gaps with poorer players and inexperienced bairns, that's what happens in football Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve_69 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Serious question here - what is Pardew's preferred brand of football? I was thinking about it last night and I still haven't got a clue after 2 seasons. Pulis and Allardyce prefer a more direct, physical approach, Rodgers, Martinez, Wenger and a few others prefer carpet football, Hughton is defensive etc. What exactly is the end goal for Pardew? If he actually pulls his finger out of his arsehole and gets us playing the way he wants us to, what will that look like? Answers on a postcode Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotus Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Oh, one thing i have noticed about Pardew, he's pretty good and reflecting and identifying past mistakes. He's hasn't shown much ability and anticipating oncoming problems though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 think most would agree, not only is he inept, he is a liability quite honestly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dontooner Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Losers on the prowl, Cows on the streets. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Fair point Neil, I am interested to see how he gets on next season. Maybe Fergie will be the one to take him up a notch. We do Ian but to rely on the individuals producing magic is a cop out. That should be the icing on the cake? We had players on unbelievable runs of form last season, wonder goals all over the place, Pardew deserves some credit for that but I am 99% sure he won't be able to replicate that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Instead, Sissoko played 10 games in 30 days or something ridiculous. again, this was largely the managers choice no? he had other options but sissoko came in and looked like he was going to set the world on fire so pardew flogged him to death hoping he'd win games on his own imo Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmk Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 What decent teams really get anywhere just by 'keeping it tight'? If you want to be a good side you need more than that about you. signs were there last season that this season might happen, we all know this, what we didn't know for sure last year was how poorly pardew would react when he was up against it - it's some of the worst top flight football management i've ever witnessed tbh, he should be sacked for this alone This is another thing that has really shown him up yeah, he crumbles under pressure so badly. One of the worst I've ever seen for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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