RIP Joe Kinnear (1946-2024)

[NG32]

TalkSport are trying to get him on at some point this morning, he's in France though apparently.

 

Probs that pissed he has gone on a skiing holiday in september.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

TBH, he's been given a job that he's spectacularly unqualified to do, and he's fucked it up. No surprises all round.

[sempuki]

TalkSport are trying to get him on at some point this morning, he's in France though apparently.

 

Probs that p*ssed he has gone on a skiing holiday in september.

 

I never want to hear anything from him again.

[PCW1983]

TBH, he's been given a job that he's spectacularly unqualified to do, and he's fucked it up. No surprises all round.

 

Thats presuming his job wasn't just to come in and be someone to take the flak for the lack of transfers.

[Willow]

sorry if posted. From .com

 

So in the end United just couldn't get anyone over the line, despite those countless scouting missions and expressions of wishful thinking from the manager.

 

Exactly what many feared when JFK reared his ugly head again has come to pass: a self-proclaimed Director of F***all role that was really minister of misinformation.

 

Like the idiots who let off flares at games, Kinnear's task was to create a smokescreen. Provoking all and sundry - be they players, punters or pundits - unsettling those already in post and misleading the masses into expecting some positive action to take the club forward.

 

The only tasks JFK doesn't look to have achieved yet are in seeing off the present manager and using those global contacts to attract a sufficiently large bid for Cabaye.

 

All the talk, all the planning, culminating in that seven hour meeting in France - when the only plan looks to have been hoping for a perfect, flawless season. That's one when the players avoid injury, suspension or loss of form and no off-field misfortunes befall them.

 

There's no need for strength in depth or cover - after all, it's not as if we'll have all of those unwanted extra Europa League ties? And why sign players for Pardew? he's done little with many of the previous signings and it was his fault we had to spend all that cash in January.

 

So why waste more wonga - he's going anyway. Stop up, take the cash, take the p*** out of those gullible Geordies. You almost want them to be proved wrong, that's how genuinely screwed up this place is.

 

For a club obsessed with saving money and reducing head count, there are two quick ways to trim the wage bill: abolish the roles of the Director of F***all and Chief Scout, on the basis they have no discernible purpose.

 

One signing, a loan arrival from a relegated club that was all but completed back in January and was a replacement for the departing Demba Ba. That's hardly great value for money considering all those telephone calls, air fares, hotel bills etc. never mind the two salaries.

 

The annoyance here is that we've seen this all before - and not just this time last year, when Pardew was persuaded to agree that his fringe players were strong enough to step up to the plate. They weren't. 

 

The shortcomings of many previous seasons have been repeated in what may be the ultimate false economy and short-sighted piece of non-business.

 

So what do the coming months hold for JFK? a few more cringeworthy interviews or perhaps a well-earned family holiday. As he himself said recently: "When the transfer window shuts it’s back down to football and nothing else but results."

 

The window may be closed, but the clock is still ticking. Like a set of shirts, Pardew has been hung out to dry. And while this all plays out to a sorrowful conclusion over the coming months, the damage done to this club grows more incalculable - and the body count mounts.

[Shays Given Tim Flowers]

http://i.imgur.com/zWSf75l.gif

[Guest Yanga]

Posted something similar a day or to - our squad on paper. I fail to see how anyone can be disappointed with this squad, as a club that finished 16th in the league last year.

 

GK - Krul, Elliot, Alnwick

 

DEF - Debuchy, Yanga-Mbiwa, Coloccini, Santon, Williamson, S. Taylor, Haidara, R. Taylor, Dummett, Tavernier, Good

 

MID - Ben Arfa, Sissoko, Anita, Cabaye, Tiote, Gutierrez, Marveaux, Gosling, Obertan, Bigirimana, Ameobi, Amalfitano

 

ATT - Cisse, Remy, Gouffran, Ameobi, Vuckic

[Lotus]

Type that sentence out some other way, can't actually make out what you're saying.

[Memphis]

Posted something similar a day or to - our squad on paper. I fail to see how anyone can be disappointed with the squad we start this season with as a club that finished 16th in the league last year.

 

GK - Krul, Elliot, Alnwick

 

DEF - Debuchy, Yanga-Mbiwa, Coloccini, Santon, Williamson, S. Taylor, Haidara, R. Taylor, Dummett, Tavernier, Good

 

MID - Ben Arfa, Sissoko, Anita, Cabaye, Tiote, Gutierrez, Marveaux, Gosling, Obertan, Bigirimana, Ameobi, Amalfitano

 

ATT - Cisse, Remy, Gouffran, Ameobi, Vuckic

 

I've taken the liberty of placing in bold the players who have continuing injury concerns - and all of whom have missed significant time recently with said injuries.

 

I've italicized the players who are or clearly should be fringe players, who are either unproven or proven to be not at the level a "top 10" team needs to be playing on a regular basis.

 

I've struck through the players who are just not good enough at this level.

 

I don't think your statement is very compelling.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Most of the ones you've highlighted as fringe players are fringe players.

[Lotus]

Most of the ones you've highlighted as fringe players are fringe players.

 

It's not a good squad then is it?

 

We've played 20 minutes of good football out of 360 so far this season and we've just watched everyone of the competition improve their squads.

[Memphis]

Most of the ones you've highlighted as fringe players are fringe players.

 

Correct. As I mentioned.

 

The point is that they stand a very real chance of being forced into significant playing time due to injury concerns. The strength in depth - as has been pointed out billions of times previous - is nonexistent. So any injuries, which are inevitable particularly with our luck, will be even more troublesome than is needed.

 

It is not a strong squad at all. There are good players, but not nearly enough of them, and that is the point.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Yeah, but you have to have some reserves right? And obviously they're going to be worse than the first XI. Not many in the league have 2+ players of the same quality for every position. The point is that it shouldn't effect overall results too much unless too many of them have to play together.

[BrettNUFC]

Would love to see someone pull up someone likes of West Ham/Norwich/Southampton, these sides that are supposedly going to finish above us so we can bold and italic their squads in comparison. Unless you've got a lot of money and challenging for major honours, two top players per position isn't really going to be happening. Our squad on the face of things is of decent enough standard, every club hopes injuries are few and far between your key players, we are no different.

[SEMTEX]

I like how Obertan got all 3.

[Guest Yanga]

Posted something similar a day or to - our squad on paper. I fail to see how anyone can be disappointed with the squad we start this season with as a club that finished 16th in the league last year.

 

GK - Krul, Elliot, Alnwick

 

DEF - Debuchy, Yanga-Mbiwa, Coloccini, Santon, Williamson, S. Taylor, Haidara, R. Taylor, Dummett, Tavernier, Good

 

MID - Ben Arfa, Sissoko, Anita, Cabaye, Tiote, Gutierrez, Marveaux, Gosling, Obertan, Bigirimana, Ameobi, Amalfitano

 

ATT - Cisse, Remy, Gouffran, Ameobi, Vuckic

 

I've taken the liberty of placing in bold the players who have continuing injury concerns - and all of whom have missed significant time recently with said injuries.

 

I've italicized the players who are or clearly should be fringe players, who are either unproven or proven to be not at the level a "top 10" team needs to be playing on a regular basis.

 

I've struck through the players who are just not good enough at this level.

 

I don't think your statement is very compelling.

 

Remy shouldn't be in bold, he has made 25+ league appearances in his last 5 seasons.

 

Agree with most of your other highlights. Obertan showed glimpses of promise the season before last - Blackburn away I think he came on to score? He could be useful as an impact sub.

 

Would love to see someone pull up someone likes of West Ham/Norwich/Southampton, these sides that are supposedly going to finish above us so we can bold and italic their squads in comparison. Unless you've got a lot of money and challenging for major honours, two top players per position isn't really going to be happening. Our squad on the face of things is of decent enough standard, every club hopes injuries are few and far between your key players, we are no different.

 

Precisely.

[Geordie Ahmed]

Posted something similar a day or to - our squad on paper. I fail to see how anyone can be disappointed with this squad, as a club that finished 16th in the league last year.

 

GK - Krul, Elliot, Alnwick

 

DEF - Debuchy, Yanga-Mbiwa, Coloccini, Santon, Williamson, S. Taylor, Haidara, R. Taylor, Dummett, Tavernier, Good

 

MID - Ben Arfa, Sissoko, Anita, Cabaye, Tiote, Gutierrez, Marveaux, Gosling, Obertan, Bigirimana, Ameobi, Amalfitano

 

ATT - Cisse, Remy, Gouffran, Ameobi, Vuckic

 

A squad which results in Shola Ameobi starting matches can't be regarded as good

[Memphis]

I suppose, then, it's a pipe dream to look at the squad in place as a platform upon which to build.

 

Clearly some of the likes of Tiote and Jonas can be improved upon even if they're not bolded/italicised/struck through. Beyond that, there is simply a massive leadership vacuum in place that is sucking the life out of the supporters through continued flagging ambition. Considering the state of the competition and the amount of money available, there is - at least in my mind - an obligation to at least try to make the squad stronger. To show some ambition. To at least pretend to try to win something, even if that's a long way from happening.  That's what Southampton/Norwich/West Ham/Everton, etc are doing, and they've at least given their supporters a sign they're interested in trying to get better.

 

Effective depth in our case wouldn't have been all that expensive, considering some of the signings that were made in the window.

 

So, back to Kinnear, then. His appointment served to seal our fate as a bobbing ship content to stay afloat and hope that by dint of good fortune or whatever that we'd somehow move forward in the Premier League ocean. And I suppose we might. But it's happening in a way that's deflating energy and excitement and slowly shrinking the fan base. Don't know how that approach is defensible.

 

 

[Stottie]

For a team with our number of fans, a better backup CB than Williamson, a better wide player than Jonas, and a better striker than Shola is not a big ask. No one is expecting a team of superstars and there are multiple examples of midtable clubs getting in better players than the ones I've indicated. What is a big ask is expecting to keep buying season tickets while showing little or no interest in providing a decent "product".

 

fwiw, I'm a bit greedy so I'd like a better backup keeper too, but it's fourth on the list.

 

[alpal78]

Ian honest question, are you arguing for the sake of arguing with Memphis' post on which players should be italicized or in bold or do you genuinely think that we should be happy with our squad's 'strength'?

[Ronaldo]

Ian's just being the ultimate battered wife. Nobody does it better.

[Wallace]

http://www.thejournal.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/summer-discontent-newcastle-united-st-5831553

 

By Mark Douglas

 

A summer of discontent at St James' Park

 

3 Sep 2013 14:00

 

Newcastle United's transfer business has been chaotic and ultimately ended in failure. Mark Douglas assesses a summer of discontent at St James' Park

 

It was apparent long before yesterday’s deathly quiet deadline day that Joe Kinnear was adding nothing to Newcastle United.

 

At 11pm last night we got the final, grim confirmation: Kinnear had failed in the task that was given to him in a London pub back on a sunny afternoon in June.

 

All of the bluff and bluster about his extensive contacts and exhaustive knowledge amounted the square root of nothing when applied to the complex game of cat and mouse that is the transfer market in 2013.

 

United added a single (loan) signing and failed to bring in the left midfielder that Alan Pardew had petitioned for. Talk of injecting Premier League experience – voiced by Pardew – amounted to nothing.

 

It ranks as a personal failure and one for the club as a whole, with Mike Ashley’s judgement in bringing back his close friend exposed as seriously flawed. He has taken counsel from those close to him about Kinnear’s work during the summer – now he must decide whether to act on it.

 

It is safe to say that Kinnear has found the world of Premier League football has moved on a fair bit since his last experience of it. Appointed in a blaze of self-publicity, he has struggled in a transfer market now dominated by the coterie of agents who attach themselves to overseas players and chief executives who have a background in business rather than the beautiful game.

 

Kinnear is from a time when managers spoke to managers and he attempted that with Paul Lambert over the Darren Bent deal. Derek Llambias had already been working on the deal at boardroom level, which is how deals are done now.

 

He didn’t help himself with the inaccuracies and boasts that were not backed up by action. What he did propose behind-closed-doors didn’t come to fruition. There was talk of using contacts to bring in Jermain Defoe but it didn’t materialise. Agents put hundreds of names to him but some – like Braga striker Eder – were injured.

 

Those in the game have noted a flurry of Newcastle links to players they are not interested in, like strikers Andre Ayew, Jelle Vossen and Brown Ideye. Perhaps some of those agents who had been chased from the door during Llambias’ time had seen the vacuum at Newcastle and decided that there was an opportunity to use the club’s good name again. That is a worry.

 

On the one deal that should easily have been done, Kinnear stumbled. Ashley was prepared to do a deal for Bent, and Llambias had put in the work to try and broker it. Alan Pardew wanted it too. But when Kinnear entered the negotiations the transfer was thrown into disarray by the director of football’s less-than-impressive work.

 

The problem is that Kinnear does not fit easily into the scouting world. It is a hard-bitten, contacts-driven environment that is dependent on putting in the long, hard hours up and down French, English or Dutch motorways watching players – and Kinnear has been dropped into it after a long time out of the game.

 

Newcastle have got Graham Carr to do that anyway, and he’s damned good at it. What they needed was a mover: someone who could out-Llambias Llambias, and negotiate like Daniel Levy at Tottenham.

 

Kinnear needed to work in the corporate world that Llambias inhabited but from his first moments in the job, he put the club on the back foot with two jaw-dropping interviews.

 

Llambias was brusque and could be difficult, but Kinnear came at it from a completely different, wholly unrecognisable place. He was difficult to control and unreconstructed, which made life difficult. The interviews he has given have not been authorised by the club, and sometimes have created problems.

 

It was interesting that there was a brisk “no comment” from Pardew when Kinnear’s assertion that the manager was in agreement that the squad is strong enough was put to him.

 

To his credit, he’s stayed away from the training ground and hasn’t meddled in first-team affairs at all. But it all rather begs the question of what he has been doing in the three months since he got the job.

 

Someone who paid witness to his work – a person with decades of experience in football who still has a hand in it – summed it up succinctly: “The guy just hasn’t got it.”

 

So where now for Newcastle?

 

They end the summer stronger in the striking department thanks to the acquisition of Loic Remy on a season-long loan. In every other department they have protected their starting XI, which is no great disaster, but it leaves them vulnerable if there are injuries or a player suffers a loss of form.

 

The club said they were learning from the mistakes but 12 months on it feels all too familiar. There has been no new player uplift and some of the existing players are bound to question the club’s ambition.

 

Yohan Cabaye should not have made the decision to make himself unavailable for Newcastle, but his desire to depart might be linked to the club’s apparent unwillingness to move up a level. It says it all that other members of the dressing room sympathise with his stance.

 

Pardew, too, has questions to answer. A summer of speaking about bringing in offensive reinforcements has come to nothing. Does he feel let down?

 

The real question surrounds the direction of Newcastle under Ashley – if, indeed, there is any now. Sports Direct’s (free) perimeter advertising is a reminder of the owner’s priorities but at least there felt like a plan a year ago. Now? Like Kinnear’s appointment, it is deeply confusing. The suspicion is he is fed up and locked in a loveless marriage with a Newcastle support who have made little attempt to hide their contempt.

 

Still, the books should look good this year.

 

The club’s summer spend was £2million, while recouping £700,000 for the unnecessary sale of James Perch. This in the close season when a TV deal worth almost £40million kicked into gear. It just doesn’t add up.

 

Neither do the enforced cuts the club made in the summer.

 

One club employee – photographer Ian Horrocks, with 19 years of experience at Newcastle – was made redundant as Ashley shaved the margins again.

 

It was a sad end to a career underscored by loyalty to his club – just another example of the reality that is Ashley’s Newcastle.

 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Ian honest question, are you arguing for the sake of arguing with Memphis' post on which players should be italicized or in bold or do you genuinely think that we should be happy with our squad's 'strength'?

 

Ian's just being the ultimate battered wife. Nobody does it better.

 

Why are you having a go at me?

 

I've said what I think. We've missed an opportunity to strengthen but we have a squad of likeable players with quite a bit of ability. There's no reason (insert Pards face here) that we shouldn't do alright. We have decent cover in most positions, although obviously it is a step down from the first team quality.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

This in the close season when a TV deal worth almost £40million kicked into gear. It just doesn’t add up.

 

Doesn't it 'kick in' in the next close season?

[aussiemag]

Sounds like Kinnear is fucking hopeless. At least under Llambias we signed quality players at good prices.