Guest neesy111 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Good post TCD. Agree with that, what works in the premiership will not work the same in the championship. He has to drop the 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 forrmation for me and play a flat 442. Don't know about yesterday, but we played 4-4-2 against Fulham, whatever the Sky said the lineup was. It seems like we don't really have a focal point. More of the same, nobody taking responsibility. I'm not sure it was 442. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoot Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 I really hate this 'he knows this league' s***, what is there to know about it? It's a football league with football teams in it, exactly like the Premier League although the standard is lower. You don't need to have 60 years experience playing or managing in the Chmapionship to do well in it. Facile view imo. League nous can be over emphasised but it does exist. What a load of bollocks. On your view, Sean Dyce would be a better option to Rafa? Because he has Championship knowledge? That is apparently very different from winning in any other league in the world. felix magath struggled hugely in this league despite his reputation and experience. Because he was in charge of a faltering Fulham side who sold all of their best players, nothing to do with 'knowing the league'. They also bought the best striker in the division. And had gaping holes of crap in nearly every other position. What happens in League One? Do you need a knowledge of League One to suceed? Why are players like Payet so successful in the Premier League with no experience of it? How did Mourinho ever suceed in any job, he had no experience of the league when he started each role. Huddersfield have started very well under their manager with no Championship experience. This Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Good post TCD. Agree with that, what works in the premiership will not work the same in the championship. He has to drop the 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 forrmation for me and play a flat 442. We played 4-4-2 yesterday in the first half. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggs Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Throw my thoughts in fwiw basicaly i thought build up play was like typical England international style slowwwwwwwwww passing around back four playing controlled but fruitless balls to midfield allowing Hudders to get back so waste of time and pretty much zero movement from Gayle as he was happy to to wait for anything and not telling anyone where he wanted it ,Rafa to me got it wrong with the pace of the tempo we played at far too slow or players fault who knows ? ,plain for all to see Mitro back after ban and a fucking winger on other flank to compliment Ritchie .2 holding midfielders meh not required imho just grafters covering runs . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morla84 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We either need to buy players who suit the system he wants to play, or change the system to suit the players. It's a long season but we can't go too long hoping it will click Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Good post TCD. Agree with that, what works in the premiership will not work the same in the championship. He has to drop the 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 forrmation for me and play a flat 442. We played 4-4-2 yesterday in the first half. We definitely did in the first half against Fulham too. Perez would constantly hit the flanks, pretty much never sat in the hole at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mattoon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We're just getting a lot of the ball and don't know what to do with it, I think it's obvious to all that we don't have the personel to penetrate a team that sits back on us and until that changes every team in the league is going to play the same way, sit back and wait for a break. We need some teeth and we'll dominate, we're too one dimensional at the moment, Rafa will change that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We're just getting a lot of the ball and don't know what to do with it, I think it's obvious to all that we don't have the personel to penetrate a team that sits back on us and until that changes every team in the league is going to play the same way, sit back and wait for a break. We need some teeth and we'll dominate, we're too one dimensional at the moment, Rafa will change that. Whilst I do agree with this, I think our lot will become more accustomed to playing that way even if we don't get more in (which we need). Rafa said his methods take a few games to kick in, I'd expect that to be the case here when it's a very different type of football to the one most of our squad have been playing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We're just getting a lot of the ball and don't know what to do with it, I think it's obvious to all that we don't have the personel to penetrate a team that sits back on us and until that changes every team in the league is going to play the same way, sit back and wait for a break. We need some teeth and we'll dominate, we're too one dimensional at the moment, Rafa will change that. Yeah, one thing I have no doubt of is that Rafa will not tolerate these levels of incompetence for too much longer. Taylor was out on his arse after his abject performance against Norwich last season, and I'm getting the feeling that Rafa's patience is starting to wear thin with a few of those still here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We're just getting a lot of the ball and don't know what to do with it, I think it's obvious to all that we don't have the personel to penetrate a team that sits back on us and until that changes every team in the league is going to play the same way, sit back and wait for a break. We need some teeth and we'll dominate, we're too one dimensional at the moment, Rafa will change that. Yeah, one thing I have no doubt of is that Rafa will not tolerate these levels of incompetence for too much longer. Taylor was out on his arse after his abject performance against Norwich last season, and I'm getting the feeling that Rafa's patience is starting to wear thin with a few of those still here. Indeed; but he needs viable alternatives in order to carry that out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AY Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Good post TCD. Agree with that, what works in the premiership will not work the same in the championship. He has to drop the 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 forrmation for me and play a flat 442. this 4-4-2, 4-2-3-1 and 4-3-3 conversation is bollock. 4-4-2 is not automatically more attacking than 4-3-3 or some version of it. It's more down to players movement than numbers on paper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We're just getting a lot of the ball and don't know what to do with it, I think it's obvious to all that we don't have the personel to penetrate a team that sits back on us and until that changes every team in the league is going to play the same way, sit back and wait for a break. We need some teeth and we'll dominate, we're too one dimensional at the moment, Rafa will change that. Yeah, one thing I have no doubt of is that Rafa will not tolerate these levels of incompetence for too much longer. Taylor was out on his arse after his abject performance against Norwich last season, and I'm getting the feeling that Rafa's patience is starting to wear thin with a few of those still here. Indeed; but he needs viable alternatives in order to carry that out. Rafa doesn't strike me as the sort of manager who will accept going into a season like this without the players he wants. Ashley's not dealing with McClaren or Pardew now, he's going to have to back him 100% now. If we have to pay over the odds to get the right player so be it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 But TCD, none of that is 'knowing the league', it is about knowing the team you are working with. Rafa doesn't need to 'know the Championship', he just needs to know his best 11 and best tactics for each game. we are getting caught up in semantics. He hasn't got up to speed with the challenge yet. We look setup to counter from what I've seen and the teams in division aren't interested in attacking us like that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 But TCD, none of that is 'knowing the league', it is about knowing the team you are working with. Rafa doesn't need to 'know the Championship', he just needs to know his best 11 and best tactics for each game. we are getting caught up in semantics. He hasn't got up to speed with the challenge yet. We look setup to counter from what I've seen and the teams in division aren't interested in attacking us like that. That's very naive imo, I could had predicted teams would sit back against us. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chopey Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 TBF if Rafa gets the Striker, winger and left back he wants he'll have no excuses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 But TCD, none of that is 'knowing the league', it is about knowing the team you are working with. Rafa doesn't need to 'know the Championship', he just needs to know his best 11 and best tactics for each game. we are getting caught up in semantics. He hasn't got up to speed with the challenge yet. We look setup to counter from what I've seen and the teams in division aren't interested in attacking us like that. That's very naive imo, I could had predicted teams would sit back against us. Except that Rafa's already said that the players aren't following his instructions, so that presumption is dependent upon whether Rafa's lying. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 I don't think we're set up to counter, his sides are usually about possession, but it seems he hasn't quite got the attacking players he needs to make this work (yet). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 But TCD, none of that is 'knowing the league', it is about knowing the team you are working with. Rafa doesn't need to 'know the Championship', he just needs to know his best 11 and best tactics for each game. we are getting caught up in semantics. He hasn't got up to speed with the challenge yet. We look setup to counter from what I've seen and the teams in division aren't interested in attacking us like that. That's very naive imo, I could had predicted teams would sit back against us. Except that Rafa's already said that the players aren't following his instructions, so that presumption is dependent upon whether Rafa's lying. Following his instructions is different to how the team is setup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Crooks Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 Plans take time to implement. It's just a matter of time in seeing whether his the right one. I'm going be concerned after 5 games is this doesn't improve though. I have faith but the right bodies need bringing in badly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 I do think quite a few have greatly underestimated the strength of this league (some going so far as to put money on us going undefeated, which is totally asinine), based largely on our experience from 2009/10. It's not remotely the same league it was even six years ago: the PL doesn't exist in a vacuum, its good fortunes do somewhat trickle down. The quality's f***ing abject, man. Give over. Just look at the Burnley side that won it. I agree. Huddersfield did nothing yesterday except put their team behind the ball and fight for every ball. As we've seen over the years once it became clear we didn't have a plan to break them down they grew in confidence. Still should never have lost. We beat ourselves yesterday. We did have a plan, apparently. It just wasn't followed. As someone else said, Rafa has spent the majority of his career playing against sides that sit & concede possession to his teams, he obviously knows how to get the results. If you saw a credible plan in that yesterday then you know something I don't. Our own manager said the players didn't follow 'instructions. He said they weren't doing what they'd practised in training. Ergo, I'm assuming there was a plan. Then I'm perhaps more worried. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 But TCD, none of that is 'knowing the league', it is about knowing the team you are working with. Rafa doesn't need to 'know the Championship', he just needs to know his best 11 and best tactics for each game. we are getting caught up in semantics. He hasn't got up to speed with the challenge yet. We look setup to counter from what I've seen and the teams in division aren't interested in attacking us like that. That's very naive imo, I could had predicted teams would sit back against us. Except that Rafa's already said that the players aren't following his instructions, so that presumption is dependent upon whether Rafa's lying. Following his instructions is different to how the team is setup. It depends on whether they've followed his instructions on how to set up, unless you're talking about team selection. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoppaz Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 We are in transition at the moment with players coming and going so I ain't worried about Rafa. Get the squad sorted then get them settled with each other and the setup of the team will gel. I watched the hull game this morning and they played for each other, some were dead on their feet at 80 minutes but they held on and won. We need that collectiveness to develop once we get the new signings sorted and the deadwood out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 The comments in this article http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-looking-clear-out-unused-11746659 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 The comments in this article http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-looking-clear-out-unused-11746659 Saivet is on 35k a week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEEJ Posted August 14, 2016 Share Posted August 14, 2016 The comments in this article http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/newcastle-looking-clear-out-unused-11746659 People are strange. One of them saying we should replace Rafa with Bruce. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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