Guest neesy111 Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 8 minutes ago, HTT II said: Nah appointing Pirlo was their biggest mistake, Ronaldo won the league with them last season, hardly failure. Juventus did what the likes of Inter et al did way before them, thinking just with Ronaldo alone, they’d sweep up. Their squad has been in decline for a while and needed more money spent on it and hiring a complete novice in Pirlo hasn’t worked, although he needs more time obviously to prove himself. I doubt he will, however, Nah, signing Ronaldo was their mistake. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 7 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Brilliant that Juve have had such a mighty shitter. Where's it all gone wrong for them this season? They should have went for Conte who is a big factor in all of this IMO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Just now, neesy111 said: Nah, signing Ronaldo was their mistake. But they won the title last season with him and could have won more this season had they appointed say Conte and not a novice like Pirlo. Ronaldo is not the reason Juve have had a shit season or would be judged as a mistake signing. And like with any successful side that’s won so much over a time span, it was always going to lead to a period of a falling from grace if you like, Juve just never saw that and appointed the wrong manager and didn’t add the level of quality alongside Ronaldo that was inevitably going to be required to sustain yet more success. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
astraguy Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, neesy111 said: Nah, signing Ronaldo was their mistake.n Not a chance hiring pirlo who has never managed a team before just for the name sack and wasting wages on ramsey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
astraguy Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Ronaldo is the league's top scorer by a mile and also made them alot of money just off shirt sales Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Pre-Ronaldo 2015 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2016 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Last 16 (Bayern) 2017 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2018 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL QF (Real Madrid) Post-Ronaldo Signing 2019 - Serie A, CL QF (Ajax) 2020 - Serie A, CL Last 16 (Lyon) 2021 - 5th, Coppa Italia final tbc, CL Last 16 (Porto) That is a clear and marked decline since they signed Ronaldo both domestically and in Europe. Pirlo or no Pirlo. Signing him for 100 million euros, and putting him on a 31 million euro contract (the next highest paid player in Serie A is 7 million euros), has completely hamstrung their squad building. This has been to the detriment of the team. Whatever the merits of Ronaldo as a player at 36 there is absolutely no doubt that as a team the signing has ultimately made them worse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 18 minutes ago, Yorkie said: Brilliant that Juve have had such a mighty shitter. Where's it all gone wrong for them this season? Novice manager, squad already on the slide, poorish recruitment, other sides improving. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 1 minute ago, astraguy said: Not a chance hiring pirlo who has never managed a team before just for the name sack and wasting wages on ramsey Totally forgot about Ramsey, what a waste of a move that was and I get the thinking behind appointing Pirlo, but the chances of him failing were much higher than him ever succeeding, in fact you could argue without Ronaldo’s presence, they’d have bombed even more under Pirlo. The key facts are that they appointed the wrong manager and didn’t invest in significant enough quality alongside their investment in Ronaldo to maintain their previous success and especially up against a resurgent but still somewhat average Inter side, average in terms of Inter being a European power house team which they are not. Leicester would probably smash them, although given how they allowed Steve Bruce’s NUFC to do that to them, maybe not... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HTT II Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Just now, Disco said: Novice manager, squad already on the slide, poorish recruitment, other sides improving. 2 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: Pre-Ronaldo 2015 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2016 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Last 16 (Bayern) 2017 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2018 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL QF (Real Madrid) Post-Ronaldo Signing 2019 - Serie A, CL QF (Ajax) 2020 - Serie A, CL Last 16 (Lyon) 2021 - 5th, Coppa Italia final tbc, CL Last 16 (Porto) That is a clear and marked decline since they signed Ronaldo both domestically and in Europe. Pirlo or no Pirlo. Signing him for 100 million euros, and putting him on a 31 million euro contract (the next highest paid player in Serie A is 7 million euros), has completely hamstrung their squad building. This has been to the detriment of the team. Whatever the merits of Ronaldo as a player at 36 there is absolutely no doubt that as a team the signing has ultimately made them worse. Basically what Disco said... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
astraguy Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: Pre-Ronaldo 2015 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2016 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Last 16 (Bayern) 2017 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL Final 2018 - Serie A, Coppa Italia, CL QF (Real Madrid) Post-Ronaldo Signing 2019 - Serie A, CL QF (Ajax) 2020 - Serie A, CL Last 16 (Lyon) 2021 - 5th, Coppa Italia final tbc, CL Last 16 (Porto) That is a clear and marked decline since they signed Ronaldo both domestically and in Europe. Pirlo or no Pirlo. Signing him for 100 million euros, and putting him on a 31 million euro contract (the next highest paid player in Serie A is 7 million euros), has completely hamstrung their squad building. This has been to the detriment of the team. Whatever the merits of Ronaldo as a player at 36 there is absolutely no doubt that as a team the signing has ultimately made them worse. Christ look at the managers they had them, how's the bacon? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 (edited) The entire point is the Ronaldo signing has caused this. Paying him 31 million euros a year (this is Atalanta's entire squad more or less) has meant they couldn't afford to build a proper team and experimented with cheaper managerial recruitment. It all stems from making a hugely expensive signing for marketing reasons rather than trying to build a team. Historically Juventus has always been a club which made superstars and generally had no problem selling them. Signing Ronaldo was a shift from this historic policy to align with their rebrand. It's been a total disaster in every way except for Ronaldo's wallet. Edited May 10, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, astraguy said: Christ look at the managers they had them, how's the bacon? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 (edited) Ronaldo has scored 27 goals in the league this season. Against Inter, Milan, Napoli and Atalanta he has scored 1 in 7. He also has 2 assists in an entire league campaign. This is in a side built entirely around serving him the ball. But this is no slant on him. At the end of the day he has just turned 36. For a player of that age he's doing more than fine. The question is why successful club with an established dynasty and economic advantage has deliberately hamstrung themselves in this way. One can only ask Agnelli. Edited May 10, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 I haven't been following Juve, but having read Pirlo's book I think he would be an absolute nightmare to be managed by. Maybe he's not like this in real life, but he basically considers himself a god. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 2 hours ago, astraguy said: No Ronaldo in the cl is gonna be horrible I think they'll make top 4 (just) If they don't, he'd probably leave, can't imagine him wanting to play in the Europa League Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Fascinating stuff. What a cock up. Lolllllll Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyt Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Nice to see Juve and PSG struggling to maintain their dominance Shame the Bundesliga is a closed shop Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 52 minutes ago, HTT II said: But they won the title last season with him and could have won more this season had they appointed say Conte and not a novice like Pirlo. Ronaldo is not the reason Juve have had a shit season or would be judged as a mistake signing. And like with any successful side that’s won so much over a time span, it was always going to lead to a period of a falling from grace if you like, Juve just never saw that and appointed the wrong manager and didn’t add the level of quality alongside Ronaldo that was inevitably going to be required to sustain yet more success. They just won it last season They've been getting worse The reality is, Ronaldo himself isn't a flop (goal record speaks for itself) but his signing has been a disaster for Juventus. As has been mentioned the money they gave him has meant the rest of the squad has been neglected. The league was a formality, he was signed to deliver the CL and in that regards they've gotten worse and got knocked out by less fancied sides Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Tricky away games at Bologna and Sassuolo, and Inter at home, they're going to struggle to even make the CL places. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Rabiot, Ramsay, Bentancur, McKennie and Artur. Not really the midfield options of a team that aspires to be the best in the world. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Geordie Ahmed said: I think they'll make top 4 (just) If they don't, he'd probably leave, can't imagine him wanting to play in the Europa League I think it's probably only Napoli they can overhaul at this point since Milan also have H2H over them now (as do Atalanta). Juventus have Sassuolo and Inter next to play and finish with Bologna. Napoli have Udinese, Fiorentina and Verona. So all teams with nothing to play for essentially. I don't trust Napoli to finish the job with 3/3 - but equally I am sure Conte and Inter will want to rub salt in the wounds. Edited May 10, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
toon25 Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 The number of decent central midfielders that they've wasted is also ridiculous. Ramsey, Rabiot and Arthur to name but three Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Disco said: Rabiot, Ramsay, Bentancur, McKennie and Artur. Not really the midfield options of a team that aspires to be the best in the world. Yep this is their major problem. Generally all good players but a lack of pace and energy. Regularly have committed to only playing a midfield two. Compare that to their midfield in the CL final of 2015: Pirlo/Pogba/Vidal/Marchisio Edited May 10, 2021 by ponsaelius Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geordie Ahmed Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, ponsaelius said: I think it's probably only Napoli they can overhaul at this point since Milan also have H2H over them now. Juventus have Sassuolo and Inter next to play and finish with Bologna. Napoli have Udinese, Fiorentina and Verona. So all teams with nothing to play for essentially. I don't trust Napoli to finish the job with 3/3 - but equally I am sure Conte and Inter will want to rub salt in the wounds. If Napoli didn't concede that late goal to Cagliari then I think that would have been tough for Juve The Inter game will be big, whilst Conte will probably want to win, how much in holiday mode will the players be? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted May 10, 2021 Share Posted May 10, 2021 Conte's class, isn't he? Never made sense to me, the way Chelsea dicked him about and eventually made his position untenable. Loved his 3-4-3 in 2016/17; incredible spine to the team with Courtois-Cahill-Matic-Kante-Costa; Moses/Alonso providing the balance and Hazard/Pedro the flair. Unreal team. Just lacked a Drinkwater. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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