Joe Willock

[nufc123]

4 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

Since his most recent injury he's started 4 matches. Birmingham away, Man City away, Forest home, Liverpool away. A tough set of matches, buf 2 goals vs Birmingham, an assist vs Forest, and by no means someone to single out for blame vs Man City and Liverpool.

 

Find it mad how quickly folk will turn on our players like. If they don't immediately perform after coming back from injury they're on the chopping block with some

He also had 30/20 mins in several other games as a sub. For me its his body language wich is the most frustrating. Today he showed something, but a part from the Birmingham game he has done himself few favours. He has looked uninterested, lazy, no passion. He is supposed to be a player fighting for a place in the midfield. I have not seen a Willock fighting for a place until today.

[TRon]

13 minutes ago, nufc123 said:

He also had 30/20 mins in several other games as a sub. For me its his body language wich is the most frustrating. Today he showed something, but a part from the Birmingham game he has done himself few favours. He has looked uninterested, lazy, no passion. He is supposed to be a player fighting for a place in the midfield. I have not seen a Willock fighting for a place until today.

 

 

This is it for me as well. I remember in our CL qualifying season his work rate was insane. Even without the goals he was all over the pitch harrying the opposition and attacking them from the left. We have seen glimpses of the latter, even today, but he doesn't look like he's busting a gut any more. He plays like it's a job and he's not particularly enjoying it.

[TheBrownBottle]

There’s still talent there, so I’d give the lad time to bed back into the squad.  But it can’t go on indefinitely. 

[The College Dropout]

Big fan of Willock.

 

 

But his cameo prevented any chance he had of starting on Sunday IMO. Thought he was pap.

[r0cafella]

1 minute ago, The College Dropout said:

Big fan of Willock.

 

 

But his cameo prevented any chance he had of starting on Sunday IMO. Thought he was pap.

We will be moving him on this summer imo. 

[Lush Vlad]

7 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

We will be moving him on this summer imo. 

 

Starting to agree.

 

I love the bloke and his qualities suit this team, for sure.  But he hasn't been anywhere near his best for a while now and I also think/hope we might be trying to progress and evolve tactically.  So that we need a bit more than just runners in the side.  If we are looking for another midfielder or two.  Then you'd imagine Longstaff and/or Willock will be on their way. 

[Kid Icarus]

He was on for 15 minutes when we were defending a 1 nil lead. I swear to god man

[r0cafella]

1 minute ago, Lush Vlad said:

 

Starting to agree.

 

I love the bloke and his qualities suit this team, for sure.  But he hasn't been anywhere near his best for a while now and I also think/hope we might be trying to progress and evolve tactically.  So that we need a bit more than just runners in the side.  If we are looking for another midfielder or two.  Then you'd imagine Longstaff and/or Willock will be on their way. 

Yeah, I like him too he's very talented imo but his injury issues as well and inconsistency are issues. He will also have 2 years left I think? 

[nufcjmc]

1 minute ago, Kid Icarus said:

He was on for 15 minutes when we were defending a 1 nil lead. I swear to god man

So other than Birmingham in the cup has he done a great deal to be pushing for more time than cameo appearances? 

 

I had him in my list of players to go to allow reinvestment despite being less injured this season he's showing me nothing to warrant a run in the side. 

 

Might have been different for a few of our fringe players with Europe and the need to rotate more but just not seeing the player from the  Champions league qualifying season. 

[The College Dropout]

Not focussed on the summer atm. Every game this season is absolutely massive. This is a pivotal season and could be our best ever. Atm Joe is an option off the bench and no more.

[The College Dropout]

7 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

He was on for 15 minutes when we were defending a 1 nil lead. I swear to god man

Agree not a long time on the pitch.

 

Still - people seem unanimous that Wilson has been pap in small cameos and I can't disagree. Same is true of Willock. 

[Lush Vlad]

10 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

He was on for 15 minutes when we were defending a 1 nil lead. I swear to god man

Yes. Everyone is basing their opinion on him from those 15 minutes last night  

[Kid Icarus]

2 minutes ago, nufcjmc said:

So other than Birmingham in the cup has he done a great deal to be pushing for more time than cameo appearances? 

 

I had him in my list of players to go to allow reinvestment despite being less injured this season he's showing me nothing to warrant a run in the side. 

 

Might have been different for a few of our fringe players with Europe and the need to rotate more but just not seeing the player from the  Champions league qualifying season. 

 

Yeah, he was also the only player playing with any real sense of urgency against Brighton. Willock has always been a player who grows into matches, just as Barnes is a player who tends to suit coming off the bench, and his starting game time has been really limited because of injury. Since his most recent injury he's only started against Birmingham away, Man City away, Forest home, Liverpool away.

 

It's been a very stop-start season for him, but I think he's a brilliant asset that shouldn't be discarded on what feels like very little in comparison to what we've seen from him long-term. 

[Kid Icarus]

4 minutes ago, Lush Vlad said:

Yes. Everyone is basing their opinion on him from those 15 minutes last night  

 

It's unequivocal. 

Quote

his cameo prevented any chance he had of starting on Sunday

 

[nufcjmc]

6 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

Yeah, he was also the only player playing with any real sense of urgency against Brighton. Willock has always been a player who grows into matches, just as Barnes is a player who tends to suit coming off the bench, and his starting game time has been really limited because of injury. Since his most recent injury he's only started against Birmingham away, Man City away, Forest home, Liverpool away.

 

It's been a very stop-start season for him, but I think he's a brilliant asset that shouldn't be discarded on what feels like very little in comparison to what we've seen from him long-term. 

Cant quite agree with you when you use brilliant to describe him. Agree we need a squad, we need an option from the bench etc. 

 

In a non PSR world I would say great age, behind others so don't need him to show up week on week and would suit certain games etc.

 

The lack of europe and how good the others are at staying fit have meant we can't offer these players the run of games they maybe need.

 

The side are also evolving and you need to step up or be left behind as longstaff has found this season. 

 

Biggest issue for me is 30m sitting on the bench week in week out who spends alot of time out on the treatment table. For that "investment " he's not been good value and if we could get 25m for him i would snap your hands off. 

 

All  very what if really. While Eddie clearly has his favs and persists with them the likes of Barnes and willock are simply not doing enough to make the decision harder. When everyone is fit the team right now picks itself I feel. 

 

Looking forward to futher in the journey when there are tougher calls to make.

 

 

Edited yesterday at 11:45 by nufcjmc

[Menace]

He's got Fulham in the summer with all the ex Arsenal boys all over him

[Kid Icarus]

4 minutes ago, nufcjmc said:

Cant quite agree with you when you use brilliant to describe him. Agree we need a squad, we need an option from the bench etc. 

 

In a non PSR world I would say great age, behind others so don't need him to show up week on week and would suit certain games etc.

 

The lack of europe and how good the others are at staying fit have meant we can't offer these players the run of games they maybe need.

 

The side are also evolving and you need to step up or be left behind as longstaff has found this season. 

 

Biggest issue for me is 30m sitting on the bench week in week out who spends alot of time out on the treatment table. For that "investment " he's not been good value and if we could get 25m for him i would snap your hands off. 

 

All  very what if really. While Eddie clearly has his favs and persists with them the likes of Barnes and willock are simply not doing enough to make the decision harder. When everyone is fit the team right now picks itself I feel. 

 

Looking forward to futher in the journey when there are tougher calls to make.

Each to their own, but I've said it before and I'll say it again - being a player who isn't in the starting XI isn't necessarily a bad thing, I think Barnes has exemplified that. 

 

Willock in 22/23 was imo as crucial as anyone to our success. His ability to break, get us up the pitch, pick a pass, dovetail with Joelinton, and create/finish chances was so important. I'm not trying to claim he's been great this season or anything, I'm just not ready to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Imo he's always been our most underrated player, even when he was at his best. 

[AyeDubbleYoo]

It’s his style that is difficult for me. Not tidy and technical enough to be a CM really. 

[Lush Vlad]

33 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

 

It's unequivocal. 

 

 

Ah yeah.  That's nonsense  

 

But TBF, he has been bad well below par for a while.  So despite me expecting him to start last night and the final.  I can't see it now.  Howe went with Barnes and then when Willock came on, he looked like how our subs often tend to look.  Nowhere near what is expected and a couple of times he appeared to just give up tracking back after getting beat or not receiving the ball from a pass.  Very unlike him and shit to see. 

 

As someone said in the match thread.  You can see why Howe is often reluctant to make changes, even when we're dead on our feet.  As the subs that come on are often so far off the level required and rarely seem to get up to speed with the pace of the game.  

[Kid Icarus]

26 minutes ago, Lush Vlad said:

 

Ah yeah.  That's nonsense  

 

But TBF, he has been bad well below par for a while.  So despite me expecting him to start last night and the final.  I can't see it now.  Howe went with Barnes and then when Willock came on, he looked like how our subs often tend to look.  Nowhere near what is expected and a couple of times he appeared to just give up tracking back after getting beat or not receiving the ball from a pass.  Very unlike him and shit to see. 

 

As someone said in the match thread.  You can see why Howe is often reluctant to make changes, even when we're dead on our feet.  As the subs that come on are often so far off the level required and rarely seem to get up to speed with the pace of the game.  

 

Yeah, no denying he's been below par, guess it just depends on the reasons each person has for why that's happened. 

 

It's a tricky one for the final, Gordon has had TAA on toast a couple of time and when we played them a couple of weeks ago he handled Willock no problem. But then Barnes is more of a one-two merchant than a dribbler, so I'm not sure if he'd be any good either. Then you've got to think about the defensive side of things too, with Willock and Joelinton both probably being the better choices for looking after that side, Willock and Joelinton's partnership vs Barnes and Joelinton's, and then there's the limited impact Willock has off the bench vs Barnes' record for doing well off the bench, it's a difficult one because if you start Barnes and he doesn't perform, you're more or less cementing the left hand-side as a failure for the full match imo. 

[TRon]

3 hours ago, Lush Vlad said:

 

Ah yeah.  That's nonsense  

 

But TBF, he has been bad well below par for a while.  So despite me expecting him to start last night and the final.  I can't see it now.  Howe went with Barnes and then when Willock came on, he looked like how our subs often tend to look.  Nowhere near what is expected and a couple of times he appeared to just give up tracking back after getting beat or not receiving the ball from a pass.  Very unlike him and shit to see. 

 

As someone said in the match thread.  You can see why Howe is often reluctant to make changes, even when we're dead on our feet.  As the subs that come on are often so far off the level required and rarely seem to get up to speed with the pace of the game.  

 

Don't think there's a whole lot in it for me as to who starts on Sunday. I'm already on record as saying I would go with sheer end product so it would be Barnes for me, and that was borne out last night when one dangerous cross won the match.

 

It might even have been you who said Barnes didn't offer enough defensive cover whereas the Willock/Joelinton combo would provide a bit more insurance. I can understand that argument as well.